Help -- Transmission Fluid Filter keeps falling out!

[GreekGod]

I am in the process of replacing the original transmission pan in my 107,000 mile 2003 Marauder.

I procured a Dorman 265813 from Rock Auto (~$22 + shipping), and an "ATP" brand TF144 ($7.12) filter kit. I ended up using an ATP LG200 ($2.06) gasket which has the 4 corner gasket holes punched undersized, so they hold the bolts in place while fitting up the pan.

I also bought a Dorman 65216 ($7.36 locally) magnetic drain plug. They are also available in a package of 5 from Rock Auto (~$17 + shipping). The thread size is M14-1.50. The protruding magnet part is quite long, and hopefully won't be a clearance problem.

The Dorman pan doesn't come with a magnet, and my OEM Ford pan's magnet was glued down. Whenever I replace a bad speaker, I save them for their magnet. I had a nice thick one (~ 3/8" thick?), so I just placed it in the proper location, without gluing it down with epoxy.

As far I as I know, the fluid and filter is original, but I bought the car used with 13K miles, so it may have been changed before I bought it. The fluid seemed a proper red color, and did not smell at all burned. It had a (about 3/16" thick?) moderate coating of extremely fine metal particles on it. There was no plastic plug in the pan when I took it down, so maybe it was dropped before I bought the car?

One very annoying problem is the filter - the replacement is a somewhat loose fit in the hole it goes in. I tried re-fitting the OEM filter in place, and it's even looser than the new one. They will both fall/drop out, even if I push them in as far as they will go. Both of the seals on the outlet tube are multi-ribbed, and appear in good condition. What's up with that? Does the pan prevent the filter from dropping out of place?

[Marauderjack]

Have ya looked up into the filter neck hole to see if someone left a ribbed seal in there?? If one is in there you can't push the filter tube in far enough to seat it properly!!

[justbob]

You should reuse your OEM pan gasket unless it was leaking.

The drain plugs I always install on the back side of the lower center section. This way I can send a drill bit thru and let them drain. Clears everything fine.

The filter has had falling out issues for as long as I can remember. A dab of silicone would help.

I've yet to see a magnet glued down and what would be the need in that? It's a magnet.


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[fastblackmerc]

When doing my J-mod the new filter and o-ring was a tight fit. Look in the hole and see if the old o-ring is in there. The pan shouldn't hold up the filter as you would probably draw enough fluid thru it because it's resting on the pan.

[fastblackmerc]

When doing my J-mod the new filter and o-ring was a tight fit. Look in the hole and see if the old o-ring is in there. The pan shouldn't hold up the filter as you would probably draw enough fluid thru it because it's resting on the pan.

BTW... +1 on reusing the old gasket, they are made to be reused.

[GreekGod]

Have ya looked up into the filter neck hole to see if someone left a ribbed seal in there?? If one is in there you can't push the filter tube in far enough to seat it properly!!

Yes I did look - no there was no gasket left in the hole.

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[GreekGod]

You should reuse your OEM pan gasket unless it was leaking.

The drain plugs I always install on the back side of the lower center section. This way I can send a drill bit thru and let them drain. Clears everything fine.

The filter has had falling out issues for as long as I can remember. A dab of silicone would help.

I've yet to see a magnet glued down and what would be the need in that? It's a magnet.

Thanks for the advice. I like the ATP gasket better than the OEM. I now have the OEM for a spare.

The Dorman pan seems a quality piece. It does drain out the front, and on my hoist, it doesn't make any difference for me which way the oil comes out.

I am thinking that with the pan on, the filter can't drop down far enough to come out of the hole. It doesn't make sense to not have it retained/bolted in, if it can drop down and cause a problem.

I worked in a stamping plant for 4 years that made deep draw pans for heavy duty (class 6<) Allison Transmatic automatic transmissions. We epoxied the magnets in. I will look again and see if my OEM pan's magnet is glued in. I assumed it was, but maybe I didn't pry up on it enough. At any rate, I didn't glue down my speaker magnet.

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[88grandmarq]

I only use motorcraft transmission filters, they dont fall out. FT105.
the OEM style pan gasket is the best, torque the pan bolts to 130 inch pounds and it will never leak. get a new pan magnet ... E9TZ-7L027-A

[GreekGod]

I only use motorcraft transmission filters, they dont fall out. FT105.
the OEM style pan gasket is the best, torque the pan bolts to 130 inch pounds and it will never leak. get a new pan magnet ... E9TZ-7L027-A

Then why does my Motorcraft filter fall out easier? The ATP is the same size and type of seal, and it is a tighter fit. I suspect the OEM seal is somewhat compressed from the 107,000 miles of installation.

The ATP gasket is better than the Motorcraft gasket.

The shop manual spec is 120 inch pounds.

My speaker magnet is bigger than your magnet!

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[DrZ]

Excellent information ^^^^^^^^^ I live by. I reuse the original gasket with a ford pan with drain bolt. Ft-105 filter

[justbob]

Then why does my Motorcraft filter fall out easier? The ATP is the same size and type of seal, and it is a tighter fit. I suspect the OEM seal is somewhat compressed from the 107,000 miles of installation.

Ya think??

The ATP gasket is better than the Motorcraft gasket.



The shop manual spec is 120 inch pounds.



My speaker magnet is bigger than your magnet!



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OMG 10 in. pounds difference? Decisions decisions..
I suppose you didn't know that the guy you are correcting is a highly reputable trans rebuilder.
If you know it all so well then why ask?


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[GreekGod]

Ya think??

OMG 10 in. pounds difference? Decisions decisions..
I suppose you didn't know that the guy you are correcting is a highly reputable trans rebuilder.
If you know it all so well then why ask?

Yes, I think the old seal is in a compressed state. No one else has offered an explanation as to why the filter is not retained, other than by a friction fit, or if the clearance to the pan keeps it from falling out after installation. I understand the Motorcraft filter is preferred and recommended.

No, I did not know 88grandmarq is a trans rebuilder.

Being as he is a trans tech, he may have updated torque specs from when the Ford manual was composed, 14 years ago.

Forty seven years ago, I started working at a large Ford dealership. I frequently watched and discussed transmission repairs during the 7 years I worked there, with the 5 different techs who stayed or came and went during that time. I recall Burt had to pull the 312 engine with the trans attached, out of a '57 T-Bird. The X frame has no room to drop it from below.

Everything from Allison Transmatic 5 speeds in F-750 county snow plows/dump trucks, to the Ford-O-Matic, Cruise-O-Matic, MX/FX, C4, and C6.

The main thing I learned is it takes a very good mechanic to fix them, and even the good ones get done with a job, find out they made a mistake, and need to tear the whole thing apart again.

I don't see where I "corrected" anyone in this thread, other than saying the ATP is a better gasket - my opinion - and I didn't say it is the "best" gasket. - ("Thanks for the advice. I like the ATP gasket better than the OEM.").

It's sad that you seem to think I "know it all so well". I never try to be one, and came here for help and advice. I am just asking a few simple questions. Mainly, "Does the pan prevent the filter from dropping out of place?"

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[justbob]

Measure from the Trans case down with it installed and again with it all but falling out and compare it to the depth of the pan. That will yield the answer your looking for.

I know countless members have dropped their pan to see the filter laying in the bottom but that doesn't necessarily mean it wasn't somewhat still in its hole before they lowered the pan down.

My comment was written because you pretty much answered all the questions of your original post and corrected others trying to help. Perhaps I miss understood the context and you were being sarcastic?

If so, then I apologize. If not, then you'll quickly realize just how fast most here will no longer help out.


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[GreekGod]

Measure from the Trans case down with it installed and again with it all but falling out and compare it to the depth of the pan. That will yield the answer your looking for.

I know countless members have dropped their pan to see the filter laying in the bottom but that doesn't necessarily mean it wasn't somewhat still in its hole before they lowered the pan down.

Thanks again for your help

You are the first I've found (in hours of searching) that has mentioned the filter "problem". I've been on both MM forums and read through pages of threads, to no avail.

No, I was not being sarcastic, but maybe my writing style, and your comprehension don't coalesce very well.

"Poor understanding of differences in values of the participants is a common problem on forums."

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[RF Overlord]

While I haven't done a lot of 4R70W fluid changes, I've done it on over a dozen different ones and I've never seen one with the filter fallen out. When I replace the filters, I give them a smack with the heel of my hand right under the neck and they always seem to kind of pop into place and sit snug. Maybe you aren't getting yours seated all the way?