MSD - COP - 82448

[Dragcity]

I developed a miss at idle on my Trilogy Marauder that now has 105,000 miles on it. About 8,000 miles supercharged. Still running on the original COP's. Presently has Motorcraft SP-505 Plugs in it from when I installed the Trilogy. Time for a little maintenance.

I just received the MSD Blaster COP's and NGK-TR6 - 4177 plugs. I Know, I know, The OEM Coils are plenty good. I'm just trying something different. I do have the Solid cable connectors from Granatelli installed and will carry them over to the new coils.

Question is, what gap on the plugs for this application. .028, .030, .032 ? Where are we all at these days?

Thanks.

[Cougar_Marauder]

The Trilogy manual says 0.032" for gap.

[Dragcity]

Yup, got that. I was just wondering if anyone had experimented with changing that prescribed gap with better results.

[justbob]

It depends on how much boost your pushing.


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[Dragcity]

just shy of 10 psi.

[fastblackmerc]

I would assume more boost the tighter the gap.

[Dragcity]

Yes, that is what I found. 10 psi is not much. Gets tighter than .032 north of 15 psi.

I was actually wondering if a greater gap would be better in this application. Sounds like we are happy with .032, so I''ll keep it there.

[justbob]

.032 for 10psi is fine.

I ran .022-.025 for 20-26 psi. That should give you a charting reference.


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[Dragcity]

Thanks Fellas.

[Red Rum]

I too am running MSD Coil packs on my car. And a set of NGK TRG 4177 PLUGS. GAPPED AT 0.32. I HAVE A ADTR STAGE 2 V-3 VORTECH SUPERCHARGER ON 10 POUNDS OF BOOST.

[Dragcity]

Installed, set at .032. I thought it was time to replace everything and it was well worth it. I guess we will see about the longevity of the MSD COP's. That FoMoCo crap only lasted 105,000 miles. (jk) And six or seven are probably still just fine.

I did find two of my Granatelli cables had broken clips on the end. DO they have any replacement program for these things?

Car is running amazing, as it should.

[justbob]

Installed, set at .032. I thought it was time to replace everything and it was well worth it. I guess we will see about the longevity of the MSD COP's. That FoMoCo crap only lasted 105,000 miles. (jk) And six or seven are probably still just fine.

I did find two of my Granatelli cables had broken clips on the end. DO they have any replacement program for these things?

Car is running amazing, as it should.


When I called Granatelli about my ends that came off from crappy crimping he assured me that he would hand pick replacements and send them out.

Judging by what he sent he is either blind, trying to kill the business, partly retarded, or they are all junk.

I would certainly never purchase another set..


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[SteelQualityMan]

The second of my set of Granatelli cops just died recently. When the first one died while still under warranty, the Granatelli people at first refused to believe that one of their coils could have failed. They very grudgingly sent me a replacement. I wonder what they thought after receiving what was obviously a defective coil of their manufacture.

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[Dragcity]

Hmm. I thought I may have been the only one.

Maybe go back to Bic pen springs.....

[Fastbob]

Granasmelly parts are not good, just sayin......

[Dragcity]

Finally made it out to our 1/8 mile track last night, since changing a few things. I am not impressed. Seems I lost 4/10 of a second in something I have done. Not good.

Not sure if it was the Coils or the plugs. I went from OEM coils with a low RPM miss on one, to MSD coils. (could have been the broken ends on the Granatelli cables) At the same time I swapped out Motorcraft plugs with NGK.

I did do a bunch of other stuff that should have made improvements. Such as, a Detroit Trutrac and 31 spline axles, front and rear sway bar upgrade, watts link upgrade, new brakes and rotors all around and a drive shaft loop.

Went on a prepped track, no loss of traction at all. 60 foot is 1.9 which kinda sucks. E/T is 8.7 which really sucks. I hate it when you think your making improvements and you go backwards.

Oh well, guess I'll order new OEM coils and see what I get.

I know I need a way more aggressive tune to take advantage of the trilogy. It was a very mild tune that needs to be turned up a few notches.

What injectors are the boosted folks using these days? Maybe I should up those for next year?

Back to the drawing board.

[FavianHerrera]

I definitely think OEM COP'S are they way to go, bought accel a couple years ago and got about 25k out of them and started having rough idle and misfire codes all the time , pieces of junk!! Regret not just buying OEM from the get go.

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[RubberCtyRauder]

unless your injectors are at duty cycle max or near, no point in really changing. trilogy came with Ford 39 lb. The tune can be tweaked and you prolly are on the stock trilogy pulley which I think is 3.6 going to smaller pulley with updated tune is the simplest way. 3.2 or maybe even 3.0.

[Dragcity]

Right on on the pulley. I went with the 3.2" pulley when I went for a dyno-tune. I have the 3" pulley in a secret place if I ever get brave enough on my stock internals.

I don't have any tuners that come recommended in my parts. I need to find new friends around here, or go West or South to jack this thing up.

I have upgraded the fuel pump to an AEM 320 LPH and have the Boost-A-Pump still functional.

I know there is a lot more to be had in this thing.

Guess I'll start by going back to the OEM coils. My originals have 107,000 miles on them, so I'll order a new set.

[RubberCtyRauder]

Right on on the pulley. I went with the 3.2" pulley when I went for a dyno-tune. I have the 3" pulley in a secret place if I ever get brave enough on my stock internals.

I don't have any tuners that come recommended in my parts. I need to find new friends around here, or go West or South to jack this thing up.

I have upgraded the fuel pump to an AEM 320 LPH and have the Boost-A-Pump still functional.

I know there is a lot more to be had in this thing.

Guess I'll start by going back to the OEM coils. My originals have 107,000 miles on them, so I'll order a new set.

MO's can remote tune very successfully especially if you can datalog. I don't run stock internals so I run a 2.8 pulley and tune on the conservative side as opposed to the edge.

[Turbov6Bryan]

What time of the year were you running .4 faster? Find that time slip, find the density altitude that day vs your recent slip.

You could have been at 400 feet one time and 3400 feet recently. BIG difference

Is your boost down? When was the last time you replaced the belt?

[Dragcity]

Still on original belt from Trilogy install in August 2010. Put about 9,000 miles on it.

I run at the same crappy track all the time. Best I did was 8.13 May 20, 2015. Last night was hot 88 and humid 85% for sure. That's why I said 4/10 of a second. The 8.13 was a fluke, it was cool and dry that day. 50 degrees, 50% humidity. So, there I have it.... I usually run 8.35. I can see it being

I don't ever watch my boost gauge. All I know is it moves. Pay my attention to oil pressure.

I can data log with the SCT X3. MO can go remote? Really? Amazing. Sounds Like a great option.

I really should get on board and build up a proper engine before I blow mine up.

[RubberCtyRauder]

what rwhp you running and a air/fuel wideband is more informative than oil pressure.

[Dragcity]

I agree on the wideband. I have the gauge, went to install last month and the port on the exhaust pipe is wiped out. Tried to re-thread it, but i think it will need replaced.

Sheet shows 432.8 Max Power 412.9 Max Torque. Max boost 9.7

[RubberCtyRauder]

on stock internals, I would not want to push it much further. The block and crank are not the weak points. block and crank should be good to 600..the powder metal rods and pistons are the weak part. Mine is stock block and stock crank but nitride coated and eagle rods and diamond pistons. I'm at 455rwhp/442tq..but when tuning it was up to close to 480, but I did not want a tune pushing it to the edge.

tires and pressure and gear ratio and stall will have some factors as well.

[Dragcity]

I have 4.10 and 31 spline on widened wheels with M/T DOT slicks. Factory stall. I cant get RPM past 2,000 without creeping.

Engine has 107,000 miles on it. What is the largest mod engine we can work with? 5.0? 5.4? I might as well start planning that.

How often are we changing the belt for the supercharger?

Thanks for the good tips. I always like to push, but I really do not want to destroy the stock engine. Something tells me the car will eventually be worth more with all the correct parts.

Oh, I did also go from 5/20 to 5/30 motor oil. Not sure if that is of any concern.

And oh yeah, one more thing. I noticed my slicks are rubbing on m rear shocks. I saw rub marks on the slicks and am a little troubled by that. I think I need narrower shocks.

[Turbov6Bryan]

What time of the year were you running .4 faster? Find that time slip, find the density altitude that day vs your recent slip.

You could have been at 400 feet one time and 3400 feet recently. BIG difference

Is your boost down? When was the last time you replaced the belt?


Lucky guess. I looked up esta 1/8th mile track, it sits at 398 feet above sea level
Last night it was 2200 feet DA at 5:00
Dropped to 1850 feet at 7:00

Is this the track you raced at?

Here is a DA calculator by track, by date. Simply punch in the date you raced before, and the track,.... Then punch those figures into a sea level calculator :)

That way you can compare apples to apples, not summer muggy 90% humidity vs great racing weather in November and December where you can be at negative sea level

http://www.dragtimes.com/da-density-altitude-calculator.php?temperature=84. 9&rh=38&altset=30.04&elevation=398&track=33&month=9&day=6&year=2016&time=4:54%20PM

[Turbov6Bryan]

On 5-20-15 esta track was 55 degrees at 7:00

That puts the DA at 176 feet


Low temp, low DA = better times

Nothing wrong with your car last night, it was just nicer out last time you raced it

How bad is the tire rubbing the shock? Only rubs when turning?

[Dragcity]

I'm at Elegant Builders Raceway Park. AKA Lancaster Speedway.

Wow, cool application of technology, thanks for the link.!!!!

[Turbov6Bryan]

I'm at Elegant Builders Raceway Park. AKA Lancaster Speedway.

Wow, cool application of technology, thanks for the link.!!!!

Hey cool, I did that with my phone so it took a bit of time

Would you mind providing the DA info from 5-20-15 vs last night?,.. I picked esta, wasn't sure if it was Lancaster

Shows 76 feet and 51 degrees at 4:00 at Lancaster Motorsports park... Not sure if that's the same place

Wallace racing has all the calcs a man ever needs

[TJCOX]

I too am running MSD Coil packs on my car. And a set of NGK TRG 4177 PLUGS. GAPPED AT 0.32. I HAVE A ADTR STAGE 2 V-3 VORTECH SUPERCHARGER ON 10 POUNDS OF BOOST.
MSD made in China?

[Dragcity]

Tire rub is bad enough to un-thread the driver side shock from upper mount. Had to double nut it. I can hear is hitting over bumps mostly. Tire pressure is at 28 psi. I turned off the load level system and make sure the back end is as low as it can go. The higher the back end, the closer the tire is to the shock on top.

[Dragcity]

Hey cool, I did that with my phone so it took a bit of time

Would you mind providing the DA info from 5-20-15 vs last night?,.. I picked esta, wasn't sure if it was Lancaster

Shows 76 feet and 51 degrees at 4:00 at Lancaster Motorsports park... Not sure if that's the same place

Wallace racing has all the calcs a man ever needs

Yes, Lancaster. 5-20-15 DA 583 / 9-6-16 DA 2120

[RubberCtyRauder]

Tire rub is bad enough to un-thread the driver side shock from upper mount. Had to double nut it. I can hear is hitting over bumps mostly. Tire pressure is at 28 psi. I turned off the load level system and make sure the back end is as low as it can go. The higher the back end, the closer the tire is to the shock on top.

put a 1/4 inch or 3/16 maybe, slip on spacer on rear, i have them on mine, no rubbing

[Dragcity]

Wheel spacers? I read that increases the likelihood of breaking studs.

[RubberCtyRauder]

im talking minimal spacer, i dont think a trilogy car gonna break all 5 studs at once. youll break a 28 spline axle first.

[RubberCtyRauder]

or rub and cut your tire far more likely

[justbob]

I went from 12.9's to 12.5's once I started leaving just off idle. That's a HUGE drop from adding nothing. Every car is different.

I have plenty of time slips showing excellent consistencies from both styles of launching.

I'm hoping to get it out this fall and bypass 11's altogether. If I can find that fine line between sticking somewhat and carnage that is.


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[Dragcity]

or rub and cut your tire far more likely

True. There has got to be a smaller diameter shock. The Monroe are kinda fat.