Couple quick questions on Gauges....

[FiveO]

Hey people,

Couple quick questions:

1. Boost gauges... 0-30psi, mechanical...right?

2. Transmission temp gauge... temp range? Mechanical or Electrical?



I'm placing a rather large order from Summit Racing....3 new digital gauges for the lower dash as quoted in that other thread...along with a new dual A-Pillar pod gauge and 2 gauges for it. I'm thinking of doing the carbon fiber for the pillar gauges...just need these questions answered.

Thanks in advance!!!

[FiveO]

Answered my own question with some deep digging in the archives.

I'm going to try the carbon fiber Autometer gauges.

0-20psi mechanical boost gauge (identical to the 4301)
and.... 100-250 tranny temp gauge.

Appreciate the archives and old threads...!

[TAF]

ANYTHING you need to know about gauges...ask Donny...HE is the "gaugemeister"...:cool4:

[Donny Carlson]

Hey people,

Couple quick questions:

1. Boost gauges... 0-30psi, mechanical...right?

2. Transmission temp gauge... temp range? Mechanical or Electrical?



I'm placing a rather large order from Summit Racing....3 new digital gauges for the lower dash as quoted in that other thread...along with a new dual A-Pillar pod gauge and 2 gauges for it. I'm thinking of doing the carbon fiber for the pillar gauges...just need these questions answered.

Thanks in advance!!!
Why not stay with Nordskog's digitals for your pillar pod? They make both a trans temp and boost gauge (actuall two boost gauges with different ranges).

Here's the trans temp gauge (in red, you probably want green if that's what your ordered for your gauge console)

http://www.nordskogperformance.net/images/products/auto/street_digital/m9007.gif (http://www.nordskogperformance.net/products/auto/streetdigital/detail/m9007.htm)
M9007 Transmission Temperature Gauge, 100-300° F
http://www.nordskogperformance.net/images/spacer.gif
NOTE: Summit Racing part number is NRD-M9007G (for green, if you want red or amber substitute R or A)
Monitors transmission-operating temperature from 100 to 300 degrees

Here's the boost gauges:

http://www.nordskogperformance.net/images/products/auto/street_digital/m9017.gif (http://www.nordskogperformance.net/products/auto/streetdigital/detail/m9017.htm)
M9017 Boost Pressure Gauge, 0-16 psi
(Summit Racing # NRD-M9017G for the green gauge; R for Red, A for Amber)
Displays 0-16 PSI in 1 lb. increments for precise readings at lower boost levels.
http://www.nordskogperformance.net/images/spacer.gif

http://www.nordskogperformance.net/images/products/auto/street_digital/m9018.gif (http://www.nordskogperformance.net/products/auto/streetdigital/detail/m9018.htm)
M9018 Boost Pressure Gauge, 0-100 psi
(Summit Racing # NRD-M9018G for the green gauge; R for red, A for Amber
Displays 0-100 PSI in 1 lb. increments for precise readings at higher boost levels.
http://www.nordskogperformance.net/images/spacer.gif

And the sending units:


http://www.nordskogperformance.net/images/products/senders/s8013.gif (javascript:popUp('detail/s8013.htm'))
S8013 Temperature Sending Unit Kit
(Summit # NRD-S8013)



http://www.nordskogperformance.net/images/products/senders/s8014.gif (javascript:popUp('detail/s8014.htm'))
S8014 Boost Sending Unit Kit, 0-100 PSI
(Summit #NRD-S8014)

[TAF]

^^^^^^ See??!! What did I tell ya..."The Gaugemeister"!!!:up:

[FiveO]

$383 order from Summit.... :eek: :eek: :eek:


dual pod gauge
2 carbon fiber gauges...boost/tranny temp
3 digital gauges for the lower dash
2 sending units
1 angle ring set...


Damn these little gauges are spendy...

[FiveO]

I really wanted a non-digital boost gauge but I do like the look of the digital gauges in the other thread.

Three digital on the lower dash and 2 carbon fiber in the A-pillar. Didn't want to mix and match in the specific areas.

Thanks for the info though....appreciate it!

[Donny Carlson]

I really wanted a non-digital boost gauge but I do like the look of the digital gauges in the other thread.

Three digital on the lower dash and 2 carbon fiber in the A-pillar. Didn't want to mix and match in the specific areas.

Thanks for the info though....appreciate it!
That's okay. I can appreciate not mixing gauges on the pillar pod. I went with both Dakota Digital for the pod because I didn't want to mix the green Nordskog gauge with the teal Dakota Digital, and Nordskog didn't offer tire pressure monitoring.

[FiveO]

I'm used to non-digital on my SHO's pillar and at night driving I'd think the numbers would be a bit eye catching. I figured the non digital was the way to go on the pillar.

Now the digitals on the lower dash are gonna be great! :)

Ordering my interior spray paint tomorrow also.


Thanks for all your work Donny.

[MENINBLK]

Don't forget the MANIFOLD you will need to put inline on the cooling line for the Transmission Oil Temperature !!!
The LAST place you want to read the transmission temperature is from the bottom pan...

[Donny Carlson]

Don't forget the MANIFOLD you will need to put inline on the cooling line for the Transmission Oil Temperature !!!
The LAST place you want to read the transmission temperature is from the bottom pan...
This is a matter of opinion. The instructions on the sending unit say to mount in the pan, or tee into a cooling line. I've had three Ford techs say the pan is just fine, that knowing what temp the fluid is being used by the tranny is important because if the fluid in the pan is overheated, you know it's breaking down and you're heading for trouble. Granted, the temp of the fluid is cooler here, since the tranny cooler dumps into the pan. Not saying not to use the manifold, but there isn't harm in using the pan, imo.

[Donny Carlson]

I'm used to non-digital on my SHO's pillar and at night driving I'd think the numbers would be a bit eye catching. I figured the non digital was the way to go on the pillar. Now the digitals on the lower dash are gonna be great! :) Ordering my interior spray paint tomorrow also.
Thanks for all your work Donny.
The paint will really make the pod look OEM. Be sure to paint both the a pillar and the pod, and the console as well as the ring. This will make the paint match exactly.

Oh, the digitals dim 50% at night when your lights are on, so it's not so distracting. Still, the carbon fiber Autometers are sweet!

[schuvwj]

So now I have 3 gauges in the center console.
1) Trany Temp.
2) Volt Meter
3) Engine Oil Temp.
Plus 2 gauges in the A-Pillar installed.
1) Oil Pressure
2) Water Temp.
------------------------------------------------
So where can I add the following gauges?
1) Fuel pressure
2) A/F Mix. ( Is this needed with fuel pressure gauge?)
3) Boost or NOS pressure

Has anyone added more than 5 gauges to our MM’s where did they put them?

Thanks!

[FiveO]

Don't forget the MANIFOLD you will need to put inline on the cooling line for the Transmission Oil Temperature !!!
The LAST place you want to read the transmission temperature is from the bottom pan...


Part number?

[FiveO]

The paint will really make the pod look OEM. Be sure to paint both the a pillar and the pod, and the console as well as the ring. This will make the paint match exactly.

Oh, the digitals dim 50% at night when your lights are on, so it's not so distracting. Still, the carbon fiber Autometers are sweet!


I attached and painted the pillar gauges in my SHO.

Looks OEM :)

I'm hoping I like the carbon fiber gauges...they looked sweet on Summit...can't wait to see 'em installed.

[Donny Carlson]

So now I have 3 gauges in the center console.
1) Trany Temp.
2) Volt Meter
3) Engine Oil Temp.
Plus 2 gauges in the A-Pillar installed.
1) Oil Pressure
2) Water Temp.
------------------------------------------------
So where can I add the following gauges?
1) Fuel pressure
2) A/F Mix. ( Is this needed with fuel pressure gauge?)
3) Boost or NOS pressure

Has anyone added more than 5 gauges to our MM’s where did they put them?

Thanks!
You can add another single pod to the A pillar. You may be able to place the other two in a pod on top of the dash, or hung individually from the bottom of the dash. I'm not sure you need fuel pressure inside (there are gauges made for your engine compartment, and I think Metco makes one), and A/F can be a dodgy choice with computer controlled cars. Boost is good, so is NOS.

[FiveO]

So now I have 3 gauges in the center console.
1) Trany Temp.
2) Volt Meter
3) Engine Oil Temp.
Plus 2 gauges in the A-Pillar installed.
1) Oil Pressure
2) Water Temp.
------------------------------------------------
So where can I add the following gauges?
1) Fuel pressure
2) A/F Mix. ( Is this needed with fuel pressure gauge?)
3) Boost or NOS pressure

Has anyone added more than 5 gauges to our MM’s where did they put them?

Thanks!

You could get one of those snazzy gauges thats mounted outside the car on the hood by the windshield :)

Seriously.... you may be able to rig up a triple pod gauge on the a pillar. Might take some good Dremel work and a single pod gauge to add to the double.

Just an idea.

[FiveO]

:lol:

Donny beat me to it....same actual time though :)

[Donny Carlson]

:lol:

Donny beat me to it....same actual time though :)
Your solution may be an Autometer "Add-on to" panel. These can be mounted under the dash and will accomodate up to three gauges.

Here's the add-on panel:

http://hp.autometer.com/products/product_photos/0022xx/002235.jpg

or you can use either a 1, 2 or 3 universal panel. Here's a 3 gauge panel:
http://hp.autometer.com/products/product_photos/0032xx/003233.jpg


Autometer also makes pedestal gauge mounts, which would mount on top of your dash or could be hung from underneath. On top the dash would require drilling a hole in the dash, but the wiring should be hidden by the pedestal mount.

follow this link for a pdf showing installation of the pedestal mount (scroll down to "gauge pedestal mount")

http://hp.autometer.com/instructions/048009_instruction.pdf

[MENINBLK]

This is a matter of opinion. The instructions on the sending unit say to mount in the pan, or tee into a cooling line. I've had three Ford techs say the pan is just fine, that knowing what temp the fluid is being used by the tranny is important because if the fluid in the pan is overheated, you know it's breaking down and you're heading for trouble. Granted, the temp of the fluid is cooler here, since the tranny cooler dumps into the pan. Not saying not to use the manifold, but there isn't harm in using the pan, imo.

On this point I will have to respectfully disagree with you, and this is NOT a matter of opinion,
it is a matter of accuracy.

When I received my Autometer TOT Gauge, the instructions called for the use of a MANIFOLD for accurate temperature readings.
The instructions clearly stated that the sender had to be mounted INLINE and prior to the Oil Cooler.

The oil leaving the transmission will show signs of abnormal temperatures LONG BEFORE the transmission pan
will have accumulated enough heat to give you any kind of reading on the gauge that will give you cause for concern.

Yes the oil is dumped into the pan after it is cooled and the airflow beneath the car also cools the pan as you are driving.
Taking both of these into account, you could possible be driving your vehicle on the highway for an HOUR, or more,
before the pan could heat up to show any indication of abnormal temps,
while a sender position at the beginning of the oil cooler circuit would be reading the temperture
of the AT oil immediately after it exits the transmission.
If there was any cause for concern, it would be detected as soon as this oil temperture began to rise.
I have always been taught to obtain tempertures at a point closest to its source for the most accurate reading.
In an Automatic Transmission, the oil pan is the farthest point from its source of the heat,
and of all areas to read the AT Temperature, the AT oil pan is the least accurate.

In an engine, the oil pan is the closest point to the heat source for an accurate oil temperature reading.
This is because HOT OIL drains from the engine into the oil pan.

Where does the transmission read it own temperature ?
It reads it near the solenoids, where the oil has to pass after leaving the oil pump.

[Donny Carlson]

On this point I will have to respectfully disagree with you, and this is NOT a matter of opinion, it is a matter of accuracy.
Keeping in mind that Autometer sells the manifold and has a vested interest in selling it to buyers of their gauges and sending units, I don't disagree that teeing into a cooling line is the best place. I'm just passing on what the opinions are of three, extremely knowledgable master techs experienced with our transmissions, one of whom races with it, one of whom works on them and other rebuilds Ford transmissions every day, and the other who is the most knowledgeable person I know of on Ford electrical systems and who installed my gauges, and each of these guys said the pan was perfectly acceptable as a location for the trans temp sending unit.

I asked because I wanted to know if the pan sender was not a good location. I was going to have installed a switch below the gauge that would switch between the cooling line sender and the pan sender, so I could check each location (because there was already a sender in the pan and I would be adding the one in the cooling line.) All three said the pan sender was just fine.

So, if you think the cooling line is the place to put it, put it there.

[schuvwj]

Donny and Fiveo thanks for the geat ideas on new gauge locations.

Maybe I should make an external gauge kit and list the needed parts with installation instructions for our MM's.

I was thinking about mounting one gauge on the side of the overhead console and one on each side of the instrument panel trim.

Thanks!

[Big Joe P]

I went with the carbon fiber gauges, and I have 7. Dual pillar pod with boost and A/F. 3 in the console, oil pressure, volts, fuel pressure. I got the 2 gauge mustang dash pod mounted on the dash, directly behind the steering wheel, oil temp, trans temp. I'll post a pic later today.

[MENINBLK]

... I don't disagree that teeing into a cooling line is the best place. I'm just passing on what the opinions are of three, extremely knowledgable master techs experienced with our transmissions...

Then ask them where is the MOST ACCURATE location to measure the transmission temperature and tell us what they tell you.

[Donny Carlson]

Then ask them where is the MOST ACCURATE location to measure the transmission temperature and tell us what they tell you.Okay, I went by and spoke to two of them again. I didn't talk to Steve the tranny guru, but the tech who installed my gauges and the tech who races the same tranny we have in our cars.

Before I start, I want to say as clearly as I can make it -- I AGREE with you that putting a sending unit on the cooling line is a good idea. Where we part company is your insistance that no other location is worthy, or is somehow inaccurate.

I was told that if you were to install a new sending unit, and were not removing the pan (as I was to install a new Ford Racing pan), or didn't want to remove the pan, then placing the sender in the cooling line was the one place to do it. I was also told that an alternative would be to place it in the pressure test port. They pointed out that splicing in a manfold was a PITA, not as easy as tapping the pan or putting a sender in the test port, and introduced the possibility of leaks, at least much more a likelyhood than tapping the pan (using self sealing sending units) or using the test port.

I was told that the location in the cooling line exiting to the cooler would give an accurate flash temp of the TC, something you would want to keep an eye on if your were running the car up and down the track a lot. Everyday driving, this is not necessary. Also, if you were data-logging, the flash temp of the TC is something you want to log.

Again, it was stressed to me that for an everyday driver (and even occasional run up the track), a sending unit in the pan is just fine, that this is a good monitor of the operating temp of the tranny, that even a cooling line sender will show a relative increase in temp just as the pan sender would. (I.e. the tranny cooler will return hotter fluid if the fluid going into it is also hotter -- it does'nt hold the fluid and wait to return it when it has cooled to a certain temp.)

And this is the last post I'm making on the issue. If you think the cooling line the only, most accurate, place to put your tranny temp sending unit, then that's where you should put it.

[Big Joe P]

Finally got some pics..

[M-75]

Then ask them where is the MOST ACCURATE location to measure the transmission temperature and tell us what they tell you.
why do we want to add a tranny temp guage in the first place? to monitor tranny fluid temp of course. with that agreed on, and remembering that high tranny temps mean critical damage, seems to me that measuring fluid temp is best done where it will be it's hotest, or, as close as you can get to that point, which i believe is where the fluid leaves the torque converter.

the inline manifold will report your worst tranny temps, and you can use that as your early warning system.

otoh...if you want to upgrade your gauges with a splash of performance and keep your pita install costs low, you can do it the easy way. at least you'll know why you're looking ahead for the next exit ramp.