Bad Vibration

[Dan]

Has anyone else experienced a noticably vibration in their car when driving at a very high speed. I won't say an exact number. It did not occur until I was in the last 5 mph of what the car has. Those of us who have N/A cars with governors removed probably know what speed range I am referring to.

This happened to me tonight. I think that it occurred while I was still in a power on situation but I am not sure.

I am suspecting it is the driveshaft and, if it is, I will be replacing that next.

Any thoughts?

-Dan

[Zack]

Its the driveshaft Dan, go under your car ASAP and make sure the tailshaft seal is still in the transmission.
Some have good luck with the stock shaft, others do not. I for one, did not.

[Joe Walsh]

Check out the recent thread "two piece steel driveshaft". You can get a custom Carbon Fiber Driveshaft from 'PST' for @ $800.00 or the Metal Matrix Driveshaft way cheaper than that.

[BillyGman]

Like Zack said. it's the driveshaft w/out a doubt. Unless you kept on it w/out slowing down even after it was vibrating, then it's doubtful that any damage occured. but if you get the Dynotech Metal matrix shaft, then that won't happen anymore.

[FiveO]

:wasntme: ....it was the driveshaft..!


I'd agree with the previous assessments Dan.

Get that driveshaft replaced with Metal Matrix one.

:toss: out that old one!!!

[Bradley G]

Dan, did you feel any vibes before Higher speeds??anyone else feel Driveline vibration at more conservative speed 70-80. I feel it in the floor. feels like it may be from driveshaft.Can they be balanced? anyone share these symptoms??

[merc406]

Has anyone else experienced a noticably vibration in their car when driving at a very high speed. I won't say an exact number. It did not occur until I was in the last 5 mph of what the car has. Those of us who have N/A cars with governors removed probably know what speed range I am referring to.

This happened to me tonight. I think that it occurred while I was still in a power on situation but I am not sure.

I am suspecting it is the driveshaft and, if it is, I will be replacing that next.

Any thoughts?

-Dan




Simple fix here...Don't drive that fast! Where were you at, Indy?

[FiveO]

Simple fix here...Don't drive that fast! Where were you at, Indy?


His own private track :high5:


Must be nice.... ;) :cool5:

[Smokie]

I have not visited the area you refer to, but I have been in a very close neighborhood, smooth as glass. It appears that as you reach the end of the clock your driveshaft flexed. You know what to do, stay out of the neighborhood...or buy a new shaft.:run:

[Dan]

Simple fix here...Don't drive that fast! Where were you at, Indy?

:lol:
:fishslap:

It was my private track, silly.

[Dan]

I have not visited the area you refer to, but I have been in a very close neighborhood, smooth as glass. It appears that as you reach the end of the clock your driveshaft flexed. You know what to do, stay out of the neighborhood...or buy a new shaft.:run:

Driveshaft flex!!! I have never heard of that but it makes quite a bit of sense.

Balancing would never be able to take away driveshaft flex, would it?

Well, it is an easy fix, anyway. I'll stay out of "the neighborhood" for now and look into the Metal Matrix shaft when the urge gets too great to resists.

Thanks for all of the input, gang. It is appreciated.

-Dan

[FiveO]

Dan,

The MMXDS also cuts weight...that'll help a bit with performance.. :)

Buy one. You won't be disappointed. The previous owner of mine purchased the one on my MM...so I don't know anything else but smooth moving.... :cool5:

[Dan]

MMXDS? Is that the metal matrix unit?

-Dan

[RF Overlord]

Driveshaft flex!!! I have never heard of that but it makes quite a bit of sense. Balancing would never be able to take away driveshaft flex, would it?Dan, that is correct...it has nothing to do with the driveshaft being "unbalanced"...it's the material the driveshaft is made out of that causes the problem. You're wise to stay out of that neighbourhood as damage can occur very quickly...

The correct name for the upgraded unit from DynoTech is AMMC: Aluminum Metal Matrix Composite...they also make a carbon-fibre unit...

[Dan]

Yeah. I plan on checking the car this morning.

I'll look at the floor for fluid leaks. I don't think that I'l have a problem as it was for less than 10 seconds that it happened and I drove the car another 20 miles, without incident, after that.

Still, I'll be checking it today.

-Dan

[hitchhiker]

:party: :party: :party: :party: :party: All the way to the speed limiter with no vibration..YES!

[Dennis Reinhart]

Has anyone else experienced a noticably vibration in their car when driving at a very high speed. I won't say an exact number. It did not occur until I was in the last 5 mph of what the car has. Those of us who have N/A cars with governors removed probably know what speed range I am referring to.

This happened to me tonight. I think that it occurred while I was still in a power on situation but I am not sure.

I am suspecting it is the driveshaft and, if it is, I will be replacing that next.

Any thoughts?

-Dan

Its the drive shaft Dan call me I will get you one out right away.


http://www.marauder57.com/Reinhart%20SC%20Banner%201.gif

[Dan]

:party: :party: :party: :party: :party: All the way to the speed limiter with no vibration..YES!

Speed limiter?

You're kiggin', right? :)

If you really want to see how far your driveshaft will go, ungovern your car and run it to the top. :)

Or, don't. There is absolutely nothing wrong with being content. More power to you. :up:

-Dan

[Dan]

Its the drive shaft Dan call me I will get you one out right away.



I forgot that you work on Saturdays. Poor guy.

I'll call you on Monday. I have to run off to an appointment now. Thanks.

-Dan

[TAF]

There's LOTS of "private tracks" in F-L-A right now...

http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/rids/20040903/i/r2601704704.jpg

[FiveO]

MMXDS? Is that the metal matrix unit?

-Dan


MetalMatriXDriveShaft...

Yup :)

[Dan]

There's LOTS of "private tracks" in F-L-A right now...

http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/rids/20040903/i/r2601704704.jpg

That's it. The next time you guys have a big one I am going to head on down and time my arrival so that I can get in some REAL driving.

Go out and have fun, Todd. Before it is too late.

-Dan

[AJAX]

my car has viberation at 80 mph right where i want to cruise on the interstate i am going to check with my drive shaft shop. I ask a cop friend of mine and he said he didnt fell it in his CV. i would hate to by a new shaft but that is on long sucker i could polish it and recycle as a lamp post. good luck.


c
Has anyone else experienced a noticably vibration in their car when driving at a very high speed. I won't say an exact number. It did not occur until I was in the last 5 mph of what the car has. Those of us who have N/A cars with governors removed probably know what speed range I am referring to.

This happened to me tonight. I think that it occurred while I was still in a power on situation but I am not sure.

I am suspecting it is the driveshaft and, if it is, I will be replacing that next.

Any thoughts?

-Dan

[SergntMac]

my car has viberation at 80 mph right where i want to cruise on the interstate i am going to check with my drive shaft shop. I ask a cop friend of mine and he said he didnt fell it in his CV. i would hate to by a new shaft but that is on long sucker i could polish it and recycle as a lamp post. good luck. c
Vibration at 80 MPH? Ummm...Before you spend the bucks on a driveshaft, check your wheel balance and front end alignment? Drvieshaft rotation (in OD) at 80 MPH is much too low to reveal the vibration (flex) we're speaking of here. I suspect something else is out of whack.

[MERCMAN]

Vibration at 80 MPH? Ummm...Before you spend the bucks on a driveshaft, check your wheel balance and front end alignment? Drvieshaft rotation (in OD) at 80 MPH is much too low to reveal the vibration (flex) we're speaking of here. I suspect something else is out of whack.

Believe me, Mac knows what he is talking about, have been above 80mph with him and he knows how a MM should feel at the higher speeds!!! :up:

[Mike Poore]

[QUOTE=Dennis Reinhart]Its the drive shaft Dan call me I will get you one out right away. QUOTE]

Dennis, I noticed something at about one one oh, on my private track. Same thing? Um, what's the tarrif on those things?

[Go Mifuni]

my car has viberation at 80 mph right where i want to cruise on the interstate i am going to check with my drive shaft shop. I ask a cop friend of mine and he said he didnt fell it in his CV. i would hate to by a new shaft but that is on long sucker i could polish it and recycle as a lamp post. good luck.


c
Hey AJAX,
Me too.
Mine's kind of a low, pulsing vibration with about a one second interval between pulses, not constant vibration. It appears at about 80 and becomes more noticable from 85 to 90 (Baby-Bucket crushing speed :D ).
I was thinking it was my tires (balance).
Soon the winter wheels will be on (unmarked cop mode :P ) and I'll be needing new tires in the spring anyway.
The driveshaft vibration won't be a problem because I have not yet installed the chip (programmed for my 4.10's, which are still sitting in a box on the floor in my living room looking at me every day with their puppy dog eyes asking when will the day come when they will be installed! :banghead: )
Uh, anyway.....yeah. Probobly tires.

[David Morton]

Dan, did you feel any vibes before Higher speeds??anyone else feel Driveline vibration at more conservative speed 70-80. I feel it in the floor. feels like it may be from driveshaft.Can they be balanced? anyone share these symptoms??You can take 2-4" hose clamps and install them on the front of the driveshaft and 2-4" on the rear with the screws 180 degrees apart and then move the screws around, first one way then another, testing all the way to see if it's worse or better until it's smooth, or take the shaft to a shop for a balance test.

Driveline angles are often an overlooked (sometimes unknown) source of high frequency vibration. A good way to diagnose (provided an inspection shows no damage) is to first reinstall the shaft 180 degrees on the pinion flange, that is to say undo the bolts on the saddles and swap the position of the u-joint 180 deg. Sometimes this will cure the vibration. If you have an inclinometer and can measure the angles of the u-joints the specification for correct phasing of u-joint angles is that any joint have at least 1/2 degree of angle and that the difference between the two be not more than 1/2 degree, for instance if the front joint has 3/4 degree angle the rear joint must be between 1/2 and 1-1/4 degrees. Front 2 degrees, rear 1-1/2 to 2-1/2.

Things that can throw these angles off are; raising or lowering the rear end; changing or damaging the transmission mounting, moving the tailshaft up, down or to the side; changing the angle of the rear end, in our application incorrect length control arms or damaged bushings. Angles can be corrected by adding shims to the transmission mount, raising it up (if that's not in the wrong direction), or by slotting the rear control arm mounting bolt holes and changing the angle of the rear end to correct.

Did you have anything done to the driveline? Driveshaft could be 180 degrees out. Change the gears? Pinion flange could have been bent, look for a tell-tale flat spot from a hammer blow that some inexperienced mechanics use to remove the flange. Has a transmission oil leak soaked the mount? Did you have the rear end raised or lowered or install control arms? Angles could be off.

I recommend you take it to a reputable shop that specializes in drivelines and rear ends.

[David Morton]

Hey AJAX,
Me too.
Mine's kind of a low, pulsing vibration with about a one second interval between pulses, not constant vibration. It appears at about 80 and becomes more noticable from 85 to 90 (Baby-Bucket crushing speed :D ).
I was thinking it was my tires (balance).
Soon the winter wheels will be on (unmarked cop mode :P ) and I'll be needing new tires in the spring anyway.
The driveshaft vibration won't be a problem because I have not yet installed the chip (programmed for my 4.10's, which are still sitting in a box on the floor in my living room looking at me every day with their puppy dog eyes asking when will the day come when they will be installed! :banghead: )
Uh, anyway.....yeah. Probobly tires.Yours sounds like a bad or fouling plug or bad coil.

[duhtroll]

I agree with Mac - sounds like "not the driveshaft."

Let's say hypothetically I had my car up that high. I never would, but theoretically it ran very smoothly as I dusted that damn Euro-trasher.

Theoretically.
:whistle:
-A

[Go Mifuni]

Yours sounds like a bad or fouling plug or bad coil.
My plugs?
Coil?
Uh..... :confused:

[David Morton]

My plugs?
Coil?
Uh..... :confused:Going from your description, it sounds a lot like a cylinder is missing intermittently.

I've had a lot of experience with vibration diagnosis on cars and vans. Nothing in my experience has led me believe that something that is out of balance, phase, or round can come and go at 80 mph or at 1 second intervals. But, I will never forget the time I rebuilt a transmission when I was young and green for a service writer that was convinced there was something wrong inside the tranny, on a complaint that was identical to the one you describe, and how dismayed I was to have the tune-up man laugh and get paid (I didn't) to replace a bad plug wire.

When torque convertor clutch is on at 100% the connection between engine and driveline is purely mechanical, no fluid buffer, and a misfiring cylinder will transmit that directly to the wheels, resulting in a 'vibration'. It generally happens under part throttle, just before TCC goes off, when the engine load exposes the weak plug or wire (coil in our case). You may not notice the cylinder misfire at lower speeds and sometimes it can misfire under this light load and not miss under heavy load.

How many miles on it? Pull the plugs (Number them as you do this) and look at them (Do this when the engine is cold. Use Anti-Seize (R) compound on the threads before you put them back.). See an odd-man-out? Replace the plug (if high miles replace them all). Still doing it? Replace the coil for the cylinder that had the oddball plug.

But that's going by your description. This is not what I recommend you do. Take it to an SVT dealership. I fixed a few on the 'phone' but my comeback ratio was much better when I could drive the car. :o

[drgnrdr33]

I had a chance a while ago to run a few more revs than normal. Smooth as glass all the way up. The only difference was a *bit* more wind noise. Even stock, she is a fine machine.

[Go Mifuni]

Going from your description, it sounds a lot like a cylinder is missing intermittently.

I've had a lot of experience with vibration diagnosis on cars and vans. Nothing in my experience has led me believe that something that is out of balance, phase, or round can come and go at 80 mph or at 1 second intervals. But, I will never forget the time I rebuilt a transmission when I was young and green for a service writer that was convinced there was something wrong inside the tranny, on a complaint that was identical to the one you describe, and how dismayed I was to have the tune-up man laugh and get paid (I didn't) to replace a bad plug wire.

When torque convertor clutch is on at 100% the connection between engine and driveline is purely mechanical, no fluid buffer, and a misfiring cylinder will transmit that directly to the wheels, resulting in a 'vibration'. It generally happens under part throttle, just before TCC goes off, when the engine load exposes the weak plug or wire (coil in our case). You may not notice the cylinder misfire at lower speeds and sometimes it can misfire under this light load and not miss under heavy load.

How many miles on it? Pull the plugs (Number them as you do this) and look at them (Do this when the engine is cold. Use Anti-Seize (R) compound on the threads before you put them back.). See an odd-man-out? Replace the plug (if high miles replace them all). Still doing it? Replace the coil for the cylinder that had the oddball plug.

But that's going by your description. This is not what I recommend you do. Take it to an SVT dealership. I fixed a few on the 'phone' but my comeback ratio was much better when I could drive the car. :o
Hmmm.... I never would have thought might be a plug.
I've got 28k miles and I have a set of the Denso iridium plugs that I have yet to install.
Just to help clarify the vibration. It is very, very subtle at 80 and gradually increases with velocity becoming more noticible around 90ish.
BTW, these "tests" are done under the safest conditions and pose no threat to other motorists, pedestrians, flora, or fauna. :D

[David Morton]

80-90 mph, low frequency, sounds about right.

Does it go away if you let off the throttle? Can you affect it by changing throttle?

At 80 mph anything driveline would be very high frequency, an almost musical tone (low bass).

Tire balance would be violent if off enough to do anything. Out of round tire goes away before 70.

I'd have a good tune-up guy look at it.

[Go Mifuni]

80-90 mph, low frequency, sounds about right.

Does it go away if you let off the throttle? Can you affect it by changing throttle?

At 80 mph anything driveline would be very high frequency, an almost musical tone (low bass).

Tire balance would be violent if off enough to do anything. Out of round tire goes away before 70.

I'd have a good tune-up guy look at it.
If I get a chance this weekend, I'll pull the plugs and look at them. Maybe I'll install the Densos while I'm at it.
Thanx

[Dennis Reinhart]

I would use the Dynotech Drive shaft that I had built for the Marauder I have them in stock call me any time, I have heard of carbon fiber shafts coming apart.

[Go Mifuni]

80-90 mph, low frequency, sounds about right.

Does it go away if you let off the throttle? Can you affect it by changing throttle?

At 80 mph anything driveline would be very high frequency, an almost musical tone (low bass).

Tire balance would be violent if off enough to do anything. Out of round tire goes away before 70.

I'd have a good tune-up guy look at it.
Hey, Forgot to get back to ya.
At 80 it appears.
The faster I go, the more noticible it gets. Never violent, but noticable.
The vibration persists even in neutral.

[David Morton]

Mifuni, if it's there in neutral it has to be tire or driveline. Could be a hard spot in the tread, roadforce balance will eliminate any tire problem if it exists, but it's $40 a tire (!) and if it is a hard spot you'll have to replace the tire.

Here we go again, did you replace a tire?
Have you gotten new gears?
Made any panic stops?
Do anything to the car and have this problem show up right after?

Take her down to the SVT dealership for the full inspection. We could go on here for a while knocking off the dozens of possibilities one by one. Send me a PM if you find anything. Always glad to help and talk is cheap.

[dhawke98]

Mine had a high speed vibration and as I said in my post, turned out to be a loose control arm. Ended up replacing subframe and a few other parts. No more vibration all the way up the scale! If you have checked everything else, might want to check that.

Scott

[David Morton]

Mine had a high speed vibration and as I said in my post, turned out to be a loose control arm. Ended up replacing subframe and a few other parts. No more vibration all the way up the scale! If you have checked everything else, might want to check that.

ScottWhat a great example to remind us of the basics! I hope you guys are doing this stuff first!

Yeah, it's a pretty good idea (if you plan on going faster than 70 mph) to make sure all the friggin' suspension bolts are tight!

[tomt41]

Dan, did you feel any vibes before Higher speeds??anyone else feel Driveline vibration at more conservative speed 70-80. I feel it in the floor. feels like it may be from driveshaft.Can they be balanced? anyone share these symptoms??
I havent posted in a while but there is a definite low level vibration on my MM at about 70mph. Had it to 115 on Ocean Pkwy about an hour ago, but my adrenaline was pumpin too much to notice any vibe at that level
I am assuming it is the driveshaft. I now have 40k on the clock and its time for brakes (rotors are warped)

[Krytin]

I had a very slight vibe @ 70 - 75 range. Went away w/old tires. They had 30k miles and inside edge was worn. New tires & alignment on the correct machine and no problems!

[Bradley G]

Sorry guy's, I lost track of this one.My vibration is virtually gone.With a road force balance on new tires.The orig. tires were deemed "out of round" during one of the balance sessions.It took several tries to correct this.There are several other "fixes" that I uncovered during this time. No other fixes seemed to be the cause.I still feel a little feedback over bumps, But at least the steering wheel doesn't shake.(God!, I hated that) I don't get to cruise at Big speed, I'm a half hour to any expressway .If I can help anyone with this please drop a line I'll do whatever I can.David Morton thats a great tip on solving driveshaft vibe.

[stuart petri]

Dan, did you feel any vibes before Higher speeds??anyone else feel Driveline vibration at more conservative speed 70-80. I feel it in the floor. feels like it may be from driveshaft.Can they be balanced? anyone share these symptoms??
Yes I also have the same symptom 70- 80mph, dealer told me I was crazy and dismised it.

[duhtroll]

I now have the same problem - only over 80 MPH. I just took the stock wheels and tires off for the winter so I'll know by tomorrow if it's a driveshaft issue. I noticed it yesterday on my trip home.

If it IS the driveshaft, I wonder if it could be related to the higher RPMs from the 4.10s. I doubt it but I would guess the dealer will certainly bring it up.

:rolleyes:

-A

[Bradley G]

Welcome Stuart,

One thing in hindsight, I would do different.I would insist a S/M or a Qualifed Wrench go on a drive together.Let the tech or S/M drive tell him/her how fast when it occurs (most prevelant).I drove this car for several months with the front end shaking and was told this is the way these cars are.Which I knew was Bull****, But I had brought it back sooooo many times that I wore them Down!Someone Posted a week or so ago that MM owners will not go away if they feel something is not right with thier vehicle. Service personal at dealerships not wrenches may feel a little threatened(not secure in thier abilities)by MM owners Knowledge, Entheusiasm cause this is not what they are used to seeing.
Bradley G

Yes I also have the same symptom 70- 80mph, dealer told me I was crazy and dismised it.

[Bradley G]

Hey MMers,

Just a quick update for those experiencing steering wheel vibe /feedback.I had the MMin to have the rotors cut yesterday.It was raining on the way home, so I didn't push it.I have no noticeable feedback comming back through the steering wheel anymore.I can't wait to get to speed and see how it feels.Thanks for all the posts.
Bradley G