Exhaust Questions Galore

[04MEMA]

I'm thinking about electric cutouts and other possibilities. Best of both worlds? LOUD and quiet? Anybody got these? Just wondering...

1. Does anyone know how much power the stock mufflers are robbing? Not an estimate - real dyno, rear wheel HP/TQ plots of stock vehicle vs. stock vehicle with high flow mufflers or better yet with post-cat cutouts or exhaust disconnected after cats?

2. Also how about stock car vs headers through stock exhaust on stock car dyno plots? And what do headers through stock exhaust sound like - a lot louder than stock?

3. Which headers are the best? (bring on the :twocents: brigade)

4. Who thinks flipping the cutouts open and revving to 6 grand when next to "louder than hell" Harleys would get me killed???? :hide: Or befriended? :grouphug:


Thinking out loud here - and forgive me if this already exists - I don't have access to the garage link. In the timeslips area could there be a link like the one for the timeslip to post corresponding dyno sheets. The link could pull up a list of previous best times for each different configuration and again have a link to available dyno plots and timeslips to track the history of mods and times. It could be a great resource when researching mods and results. :grad: :2thumbs:

Thanks,
Jeff

P.S. If this database already exist here we're going to need a smilie depicting a re-invention of the wheel! :rofl:

[FiveO]

TooManyFords has the cutouts.

They sound great...heard them at Cedar Falls Raceway.

He also has the Kooks headers with the rest of the exhaust stock if I recall.


There are only the Kooks headers available if I recall. The Cobra "manifolds" aren't "headers" so to speak.

I went with the full Kooks system which are the headers, high flow cats and custom xpipe and I lost .47 in the 1/4. I went from 14.97 to 14.50 flat.

[TooManyFords]

Jeff, here's a picture of the MM with Kooks and electric cutouts:

http://john.frieltek.com/toomanyfords/marauder/cutouts/img/cutouts.jpg

and here is a picture of a new set of DynoMax Bullets with turn-downs that are bolted to the cutouts:

http://john.frieltek.com/toomanyfords/marauder/cutouts/img/dsc01897.jpg

I had these made so that when I race at the "All Night Street Drags" I can use the cutouts. Mufflers were required for this and I got the least restrictive thing I could. When I want to ge racing for real, 4 bolts and the bullets et all, come off and it is wide open.

On the street, if I want to flex a little muscle, the bullets give the car that "don't mess with me" sound. For normal driving, the cutouts are closed and it's just like a normal MM.

Cheers!

John

[04MEMA]

FIveO - thanks - great info. Kook's and exhaust are worth a half second! Do you remember your trap speeds fo those runs?

TooManyFords - Thanks - totally awesome setup! Having the second set of mufflers is killer! I'm wondering if I could do that with the bullets on the stock exhaust? What brand are your cutouts? Any issues or concerns with that product?


Thanks,
Jeff

[TooManyFords]

Jeff, no problems at all with the cutouts or the setup. You can read more about the current mods to my system at http://prorauder.frieltek.com.

As far as running those bullets instead of factory mufflers, only if I was 16 again! They are way too loud and would really diminish the quality quiet ride the MM has if you ever want to take a trip down the highway. YMMV...

John

[Big Joe P]

After I had the Kook's installed I went with the supplied Magna-flow's. It was too quiet. Then I ran straight pipes for a few days, and it was too loud. Now I have the bullets (red hots) and love it.

[SergntMac]

John, that's a kick-azz exhaust system, think you could find the time to post the part numbers and suppliers?

[valleyman]

What he ^^^ said.

[Warpath]

http://john.frieltek.com/toomanyfords/marauder/cutouts/img/dsc01897.jpg


Its like looking at one of those freak of nature animals that have extra legs or wings. Its a little difficult at first to look at.

[04MEMA]

Thanks John - I watched your 1/4 mile video. The car sounded sweet. What was the exhaust set to for that run - was it through the cutouts and bullets? Who makes the cutouts you're running?

Thanks Big Joe P.

Anybody know the BEST place to go for this type of custom exhaust work in the Detroit (Oakland county preferably) area? What do you think it would cost to have them installed on a stock system?

Thanks all :high5: ,

Jeff

[TooManyFords]

Thanks John - I watched your 1/4 mile video. The car sounded sweet. What was the exhaust set to for that run - was it through the cutouts and bullets? Who makes the cutouts you're running?

The video was taken with open cutouts without the bullets.

I'm having a bit of a problem finding my receipt for the mufflers so I don't have the part numbers handy. As soon as I find them I'll get it posted. The cutouts are from Quicktimeperformance.com though.

John

[TooManyFords]

Its like looking at one of those freak of nature animals that have extra legs or wings. Its a little difficult at first to look at.

Yep, I kinda thought that too when I was snapping off pictures! The original exhaust will get "redone" as soon as I get the high-flow cats back from Kooks. (Nick? Where the heck are they???) I had to have a pair of the factory cats customized while waiting for the replacements and, well, it's all kinda funky and all. The guys at Boubins Muffler will get this job as soon as I have all the parts again.

John

[SergntMac]

1. Does anyone know how much power the stock mufflers are robbing? Not an estimate - real dyno, rear wheel HP/TQ plots of stock vehicle vs. stock vehicle with high flow mufflers or better yet with post-cat cutouts or exhaust disconnected after cats?

2. Also how about stock car vs headers through stock exhaust on stock car dyno plots? And what do headers through stock exhaust sound like - a lot louder than stock?

3. Which headers are the best? (bring on the :twocents: brigade)

Thinking out loud here - and forgive me if this already exists - I don't have access to the garage link. In the timeslips area could there be a link like the one for the timeslip to post corresponding dyno sheets. The link could pull up a list of previous best times for each different configuration and again have a link to available dyno plots and timeslips to track the history of mods and times. It could be a great resource when researching mods and results.
Thanks,Jeff
Only one owner here I know of with cut outs, and you have heard from him. As far as judging sound quality in this medium, that's near impossible. What's impressive to me may make you run and hide. Keep in mind too, that not all mods will show improvement on a dyno. Some will lower ETs, or improve MPG, and lie flat in a dyno test. A case in point, would be low dyno results from a torque converter change. Oh, it's there, but not very impressive, just wait until you're really moving the car down the track!

There are some more problems in with answering your questions, Jeff, one is that most Marauders don't stay bone stock for long, or, maybe I should say that the Marauder owners who mod, are the owners who would be able to supply you your answers. It's a smaller group than you think, but we're very chatty. Secondly, running dyno tests between mods is very expensive, dyno tests average 100 bucks for 3 pulls, which is why 60-75 dollar dyno days are so popular. Moreover, owners may add two or three different mods between dyno days, and it's hard to nail down what mod provided what result.

We are seeing an increase in dyno tuning, and more dyno sheets are getting posted everyday, but they still do not help you in the "bone stock vs. mod" areas you specify. Remember, this was a brand new car in 2003, and the "database" of mod performance, is really us right here. I'll add this though, the professional among us are very accurate in their speculation of what a particular mod may produce.

A long time ago, I did many before and after dynos while testing some of our common mods, one of which covered your muffler question. I don't have the dyno sheets anymore, they went with the car when I sold my 1st MM. However, it was a narrow test of the OEM mufflers vs. the Ravin Z-55, on a Stage I Marauder. While this isn't the "bone stock" environment, it's as close as I can get.

I picked the Ravin Z-55 because of it's cost and availability. It's not a name brand on it's own, but it is the muffler many people buy under other brand names, and it's available at every Midas muffler shop in the world, because Ravin owns Midas. BTW, the Z-55s are the highest flowing turbo muffler on the market today. Measured in CFM, the OEMs flowed at 110 CFM. DynoFlows and FlowMasters at 260-275 CFM respectively, and the Ravin Z-55 flow at 375 CFM. Anyway, I did clean before and after pulls, changing only the OEM muffler for the Ravins, everything else in the exhaust system was bone stock OEM. I picked up 7 RWHP and 5 RWTQ over the OEM mufflers, a nominal reward for the 300 bucks installed, and not including cost of dyno tests. The bang for the buck is low, performance wise, but the sound was delicious. Hope this helps...Just my .02c.

[Warpath]

...I'll add this though, the professional among us are very accurate in their speculation of what a particular mod may produce...

A lot of that knowledge was built from messing with Cobras, Mustangs, and Machs.

A good site for exhaust questions is www.mustangexhaust.com . There are a lot of sound clips. Someone created it in response to the numerous posts regarding exhausts. Although it is about Mustangs, you should get a feeling how it may perform/sound on an MM.

Another site to check out is corral.net. Check out the 4V/SVT forum for a lot of good information. Make sure you search before posting though. After years of seeing the same questions over and over again, some don't have the patience for popular questions. Again, it is a Mustang site. But, you should still learn a lot about MMs since engines are similar.

Of course this site is the best one for MMs.

[Warpath]

Looks like Mustangexhaust.com moved here: http://64.177.72.121/forums/index.php

[michburt]

4. Who thinks flipping the cutouts open and revving to 6 grand when next to "louder than hell" Harleys would get me killed???? :hide: Or befriended? :grouphug:


P.S. If this database already exist here we're going to need a smilie depicting a re-invention of the wheel! :rofl:
As and "old" Harley rider, I can venture a guess that I would give you a big thumbs up then try and race you.

Mike:stooges:

[04MEMA]

Alright everyone, thanks for the valuable feedback.

SergntMac I appreciate you sharing your $0.02 with me, and I understand the point you made. Also I find the fact about the Ravin mufflers fascinating - I'd never heard of them and would have doubted that Midas would have anything besides low quality for high price stuff. As an aside I was once told - in the late 80's that at that time the best flowing turbo muffler you could get was the stock muffler for an 82 (I think it was 82) L82 Corvette. Your comments reminded me of that little tidbit. I'm still plotting my mods but at this point it's looking like the Trilogy and cutouts. Although I have to admit that I'm a little nervous about losing my warranty so we'll have to see how long I can hold out. I had Jerry Barnes send ma a copy of the installation guide to look over and he invited me down to take a s/c car for a drive, now I'm having a hard time thinking about anything else. And I know if I go with my credit card in hand, I'll be bringing one home with me... Yet truthfully the car is sweet in stock form and with only 1,400 miles on the clock I'm still getting to know her. :burn:

Joe (Warpath) thanks for the info on the sites, I will check them out. :2thumbs:

Mike (Michburt) thanks for the feedback, and I guess I'd better get that Trilogy installed before pulling my little stunt so I stand a chance in the ensuing race! :burnout:

Jeff