ProCharger Dyno Results

[maraudernkc]

Well it is snowing and 30 degrees in Kansas City. Hope your weather is better.

DR sent me a SCT tunning file which I loaded in my car an headed down to MC Racing today for the first ever ProCharger Dyno.

My base run one month ago was 261.1RWHP 286.7 Torque

My run today was 397.4RWHP 365.3 Torque

That was running 9PSI and no other mods besides the ProCharger and 4:10 Gears and 180 stat. and I had some real good 91 Octane. Who sells 93 Ocatne?

We had to end because of weather but I can tell you that this baby feels strong. I am waiting for my DR exhaust and will be back at the Dyno to finish ASAP. In the mean time I will have the horriable job of testing this baby.

Thanks for all your support and I will get pricing and more data in the very near future.

[Bradley G]

Hey maraudernkc,This sounds great! are you happy with the progress?Sounds like your goal is very attainable!Good luck and keep us up to SPEED:D It's snowing here north of chicago too!
Bradley G

[hdwrench]

id buy a raffle ticket for one... :)

[MarauderMark]

Well it is snowing and 30 degrees in Kansas City. Hope your weather is better.

DR sent me a SCT tunning file which I loaded in my car an headed down to MC Racing today for the first ever ProCharger Dyno.

My base run one month ago was 261.1RWHP 286.7 Torque

My run today was 397.4RWHP 365.3 Torque

That was running 9PSI and no other mods besides the ProCharger and 4:10 Gears and 180 stat. and I had some real good 91 Octane. Who sells 93 Ocatne?

We had to end because of weather but I can tell you that this baby feels strong. I am waiting for my DR exhaust and will be back at the Dyno to finish ASAP. In the mean time I will have the horriable job of testing this baby.

Thanks for all your support and I will get pricing and more data in the very near future.


Nnneyesssss numbers!! :up: Ain't it great stepping on the gas and that big car running like it has a big block Awesome :burn: :2thumbs:

[Tallboy]

great job, greg! i can't wait to see one installed on tmac's car! :)

[CRUZTAKER]

I'm not up on pro-chargers....but....wheres the torque!!!!????

I am used to seeing numbers where the torque is always higher than the rwhp.

Hmmmm....397 eh....wanna a race an N/A...:P :lol:

[MikesMerc]

Actually what I'd like to see more than anything is the actual Dyno graph. The entire "area under the curve" tells far more about the power delivery and is much more important than the peak numbers. By analyzing the area under the curve as well as the general shape of the torque curve, you can tell quite a bit about how things will feel from the seat of the pants.

I encourage you to post up those graphs :up:

[MarauderMark]

I'm not up on pro-chargers....but....wheres the torque!!!!????

I am used to seeing numbers where the torque is always higher than the rwhp.

Hmmmm....397 eh....wanna a race an N/A...:P :lol:


Barry stop pickin on the s/cers .you bully :lol: :D

[stevengerard]

congrats 50% more hp, bet the exhaust will help with the torque

[snowbird]

Well it is snowing and 30 degrees in Kansas City. Hope your weather is better.

DR sent me a SCT tunning file which I loaded in my car an headed down to MC Racing today for the first ever ProCharger Dyno.

My base run one month ago was 261.1RWHP 286.7 Torque

My run today was 397.4RWHP 365.3 Torque

That was running 9PSI and no other mods besides the ProCharger and 4:10 Gears and 180 stat. and I had some real good 91 Octane. Who sells 93 Ocatne?

We had to end because of weather but I can tell you that this baby feels strong. I am waiting for my DR exhaust and will be back at the Dyno to finish ASAP. In the mean time I will have the horriable job of testing this baby.

Thanks for all your support and I will get pricing and more data in the very near future.Hi. I'm not tring to start war or anything, but haven't you said in previous posts that you were taking off the transmission to build it tougher or something ? In summary, were those numbers from stock, kit wise, no other mods or beefing up ?

[Zack]

This guy has made the fastest progress with a blower than any company here. The tuning process will take some time, and analyzing horsepower and torque numbers without an aftermarket exhaust is kind of pointless if you ask me. Give this guy a little more time, sounds like he's on a road to surprise us all, and fast.

[studio460]

That was running 9PSI and no other mods besides the ProCharger and 4:10 Gears and 180 stat. and I had some real good 91 Octane.maraudernkc:

Wow! You work FAST! First, you post the photos of the install, now dyno numbers! It's great to hear those numbers especially given the fact that you're running 91-octane fuel (which is what we're stuck with in California). Most of the tuners, chips, SC kits, etc. are built and tuned in parts of the country that have much higher-octane fuels than we have available to us in California. At least in my experience, non-California based tuners have had a difficult time tuning for our crappy gas. It's good to know that this kit will be tuned for California customers from the get-go! Way to go, maraudernkc, and thanks for putting this project together (and reporting about its development) so quickly!

P.S. Which DR exhaust did you decide on (which components)?

[SergntMac]

This guy has made the fastest progress with a blower than any company here. The tuning process will take some time, and analyzing horsepower and torque numbers without an aftermarket exhaust is kind of pointless if you ask me. Give this guy a little more time, sounds like he's on a road to surprise us all, and fast.
Hear, hear! Remarkable performance, not only in putting it together, but the early end results. There's a lot of tweaking ahead, and decisions about other mods. Nice job!

[MikesMerc]

and analyzing horsepower and torque numbers without an aftermarket exhaust is kind of pointless if you ask me.



Not to mention the concept of needing an after market exhaust is utterly ridiculous as well. We all know that the stock exhaust system is pretty darn good as it is, and that serious power can be made without changing anything exhaust wise. Lidio has proven that. Furthermore, other vendors such as Trilogy and Dennis have published performance numbers based on thier repsective kits on an otherwise stock MM. Adding other modifications, even when they compliment one another, only muddies the water when determining how much power the original kit adds to begin with.

This of course says nothing about those folks who cannot afford an aftermarket exhaust in addition to the blower kit. Remember, this kit is suppose to be "affordable." Additional mods should not be required to make good power or whats the point?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see what additional mods do. That's always good information and its just plain fun to see. But, the consumer should know what power delivery can be expected from just the kit alone....just like every other blower kit that is advertised does. This is the apples to apples comparison consumers need.

I also think maraudernkc has done a great job getting things together quickly. I am not rushing to any type of judgement here...remember marauderkc decided when to post his results. And I'd also still like to see what the dyno graphs show. Again, for anyone who knows how to read them, they offer a ton of valuable information. I certainly understand that if more tuning is needed, then that time should be taken before results are analyzed. But, eventually the final results for the stock kit without addiitonal mods needs to be published so folks can see what they are getting.


EDIT - BTW, stevengerard, opening up the exhaust in any fashion will likely increase peak HP but decrease torque in the low and mid range where centrifugal blowers need it most. There is far far more to power delivery than the "peak" numbers.

[RoyLPita]

What were the peak RPMs for each of the HP figures (before and after)?

[Smokie]

I am not sure why you believe opening exhaust in any way lowers your torque numbers, my real life experience is quite the contrary: CLICK (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=13390&page=2&pp=15) :)

[stevengerard]

I’m sure there is a point of diminishing returns with opening up an exhaust system, even happens with a 455 torque monster. Yet I’d bet he would see plenty of gains before the torque numbers start to go down. He hasn’t mentioned price yet, but those dyno are impressive. Just a new tune and 410s made a huge difference for me, this kit sounds like it will me a nice option for many.

[tmac1337]

Greg still has some work to do, and has done a great job so far, that cannot be disputed. He is probably the only person who is honest enough to post his initial results when he isn't even done with the tuning yet, nor is the kit entirely completed. He has done so to honestly represent his progress, not to inflate dyno's with the T/C locked down and so forth. And this so far with 91 Octane. I'm sure his numbers will be going up shortly.

Congratulations Greg!

[maraudernkc]

I want everyone here to know that this was our first attempt with putting a ProCharger on a MM. I did not have to post those numbers because they will be much better. I am trying to keep everyone updated on the progress of this project. That's what is neat about a web community like this one.


The numbers came in lower than I had antacipated due to the DR program ran 93 Octane with exhaust I had at best 91 octane with no exhaust.

We had to back out 4 degrees on the timing just so it would not ping. 4 degrees is alot of HP and TQ. I have several diffrent style impellers including a cut down version that will spin up faster for better TQ that we might try.

Do not get me wrong the car as is right now runs fantastic but I want to get the most out of her that we can and keep it under 450RWHP.

Please, keep in mind that we have done this from the ground up in a little over a Month and tunning takes a little time.

You do not need exhaust for this kit. I like the DR kit so I am installing one on my MM.

You do not have to beef up your trans. but I would. When we beefed up my trans at 5K miles the rear bearing was already showing. alot of wear. I would reccomend the DR oil kit for the tailshaft even if your not S/C.

I will post the Dyno Chart this week. I have to get it scanned.

I am just trying to keep anyone updated good or bad who is interested.

Thanks, Greg (maraudrenkc)

[maraudernkc]

snowbird, the transmission rebuild has no affect on the Dyno numbers.




Hi. I'm not tring to start war or anything, but haven't you said in previous posts that you were taking off the transmission to build it tougher or something ? In summary, were those numbers from stock, kit wise, no other mods or beefing up ?

[maraudernkc]

I am going with the DR Cobra Exhaust manifolds and the x pipe. That systems produces almost as much HP as the Kooks system and I do not want to change out my stock mufflers. I like to hear the whine of that blower.




maraudernkc:

Wow! You work FAST! First, you post the photos of the install, now dyno numbers! It's great to hear those numbers especially given the fact that you're running 91-octane fuel (which is what we're stuck with in California). Most of the tuners, chips, SC kits, etc. are built and tuned in parts of the country that have much higher-octane fuels than we have available to us in California. At least in my experience, non-California based tuners have had a difficult time tuning for our crappy gas. It's good to know that this kit will be tuned for California customers from the get-go! Way to go, maraudernkc, and thanks for putting this project together (and reporting about its development) so quickly!

P.S. Which DR exhaust did you decide on (which components)?

[maraudernkc]

Mike, you are right I did decide to post the numbers good or bad and I think there darn good for the first go around on a complete from the ground buildup and you are right we do not need exhaust however it can allow you to run less boost with the same amount of HP.




Well, no one asked you;)

Not to mention the concept of needing an after market exhaust is utterly ridiculous as well. We all know that the stock exhaust system is pretty darn good as it is, and that serious power can be made without changing anything exhaust wise. Lidio has proven that. Furthermore, other vendors such as Trilogy and Dennis have published performance numbers based on thier repsective kits on an otherwise stock MM. Adding other modifications, even when they compliment one another, only muddies the water when determining how much power the original kit adds to begin with.

This of course says nothing about those folks who cannot afford an aftermarket exhaust in addition to the blower kit. Remember, this kit is suppose to be "affordable." Additional mods should not be required to make good power or whats the point?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see what additional mods do. That's always good information and its just plain fun to see. But, the consumer should know what power delivery can be expected from just the kit alone....just like every other blower kit that is advertised does. This is the apples to apples comparison consumers need.

I also think maraudernkc has done a great job getting things together quickly. I am not rushing to any type of judgement here...remember marauderkc decided when to post his results. And I'd also still like to see what the dyno graphs show. Again, for anyone who knows how to read them, they offer a ton of valuable information. I certainly understand that if more tuning is needed, then that time should be taken before results are analyzed. But, eventually the final results for the stock kit without addiitonal mods needs to be published so folks can see what they are getting.


EDIT - BTW, stevengerard, opening up the exhaust in any fashion will likely increase peak HP but decrease torque in the low and mid range where centrifugal blowers need it most. There is far far more to power delivery than the "peak" numbers.

[SergntMac]

I am not sure why you believe opening exhaust in any way lowers your torque numbers, my real life experience is quite the contrary.
A matter of semantics, Javier. We don't "lose" power in an exhaust upgrade, but low end torque gets relocated to higher up in the power band. With a pure bone stock build, this can be is disappointing in terms of delivering power to the ground early in the launch. Torque moves the car, and the more torque you have available at lower RPM, the quicker the car moves.

MikesMerc is right, the OEM exhaust system on the Marauder is "pretty damn good" and it's important that every owner considering modding his MM exhaust system understands this. Don't mess with exhaust until it's time, and until other mods that will work best to enhance this power shift and turn it around in your favor, are researched and decided upon.

When I added the Reinhart Cobra kit to my MM, I added 30 RWHP and 30 RWTQ, just by installing the kit, no tuning. While my row and column report shows exactly where my power shifted to, that much overall gain from a 900 buck exhaust upgrade is impressive and valuable to the overall performance of any project, and enough to call it a need to do thing.

Had I added this kit and just this kit to a bone stock MM, the overall gain would have been much less, and I would have felt that in my seat of the pants almost immediately. Without other mods to compliment or balance that out, I'm sure the car would be slower.

Maybe an exhaust upgrade isn't a need to do thing, but it sure pays off when done at the right time. Had I ignored this possibility of gaining 30 RWHP and 30 RWTQ, the only need I would have, is to see a shrink.

[Smokie]

My apologies to maraudernkc. you have a fine effort going here that I am following with great interest, did not mean to highjack.:(

[snowbird]

snowbird, the transmission rebuild has no affect on the Dyno numbers.
Thanks but i didn't expressed myself correctly.
I am just a bit concerned about this: Due to the performance of the kit, is the transmission beefing up 1- mandatory, or, 2- a nice addition that could be delayed quite a bit but could help long run longevity ?

Congrats for your efforts that we watch with enthousiasm. Alos, beside California, Canada would also be a market for a tuned down to 91 octane rating since we have to make it with that fuel ( or maybe a change of pullie for lower boost) :bows:

[Logan]

Keep this thread on topic and respectful to participants, lest ye incur my wrath.

[maraudernkc]

SergntMac, you hit the nail on the head. That DR exhaust mod comined with a blower is a killer combo but you take that same DR exhaust mod on a stock MM and you have about 7RWHP. The diffrence is the volume of air that your now pushing thru with the blower does better thru the DR exaust mod than thru the stock exhaust.




A matter of semantics, Javier. We don't "lose" power in an exhaust upgrade, but low end torque gets relocated to higher up in the power band. With a pure bone stock build, this can be is disappointing in terms of delivering power to the ground early in the launch. Torque moves the car, and the more torque you have available at lower RPM, the quicker the car moves.

MikesMerc is right, the OEM exhaust system on the Marauder is "pretty damn good" and it's important that every owner considering modding his MM exhaust system understands this. Don't mess with exhaust until it's time, and until other mods that will work best to enhance this power shift and turn it around in your favor, are researched and decided upon.

When I added the Reinhart Cobra kit to my MM, I added 30 RWHP and 30 RWTQ, just by installing the kit, no tuning. While my row and column report shows exactly where my power shifted to, that much overall gain from a 900 buck exhaust upgrade is impressive and valuable to the overall performance of any project, and enough to call it a need to do thing.

Had I added this kit and just this kit to a bone stock MM, the overall gain would have been much less, and I would have felt that in my seat of the pants almost immediately. Without other mods to compliment or balance that out, I'm sure the car would be slower.

Maybe an exhaust upgrade isn't a need to do thing, but it sure pays off when done at the right time. Had I ignored this possibility of gaining 30 RWHP and 30 RWTQ, the only need I would have, is to see a shrink.

[maraudernkc]

snowbird, I would talk to some other guys that have 03 MM that have a blower and see if they have stock transmissions. I know that the 2004 MM has a few upgrades to the transmission over the 2003. I am not a transmission expert. I beefed mine up because I did the rear cooling mod and the transmission was already out. It just seemed like the right time to do it.




Thanks but i didn't expressed myself correctly.
I am just a bit concerned about this: Due to the performance of the kit, is the transmission beefing up 1- mandatory, or, 2- a nice addition that could be delayed quite a bit but could help long run longevity ?

Congrats for your efforts that we watch with enthousiasm. Alos, beside California, Canada would also be a market for a tuned down to 91 octane rating since we have to make it with that fuel ( or maybe a change of pullie for lower boost) :bows:

[duhtroll]

Weird - I seem to have gotten more than 7 RWHP out of my exhaust, and I'm N/A. Of course it will be more if I had a blower (than just a blower with stock exhaust - the greater benefit, ya know) but without the dyno to prove it, my times dropped about 0.4 in the 1/4. It would be nice if 7 RWHP accounted for that 0.4, but I doubt it.

-A


SergntMac, you hit the nail on the head. That DR exhaust mod comined with a blower is a killer combo but you take that same DR exhaust mod on a stock MM and you have about 7RWHP. The diffrence is the volume of air that your now pushing thru with the blower does better thru the DR exaust mod than thru the stock exhaust.

[SergntMac]

SergntMac, you hit the nail on the head. That DR exhaust mod comined with a blower is a killer combo but you take that same DR exhaust mod on a stock MM and you have about 7RWHP. The diffrence is the volume of air that your now pushing thru with the blower does better thru the DR exaust mod than thru the stock exhaust.
Precisely. Engines are just big air pumps. Force more air in, and you have to improve the exit, or, you're only getting half the job done.

I wish not to distract from your topic anymore, KC, nice work done so far, I can't wait to hear more. Anyone wants to open another header thread, please do. Lots of newbies here lately, maybe it's time to review simple principles.

[MikesMerc]

I am not sure why you believe opening exhaust in any way lowers your torque numbers

EDIT- forget it. Looks like Mac answered this question quite well.

[MikesMerc]

Mike, you are right I did decide to post the numbers good or bad and I think there darn good for the first go around on a complete from the ground buildup and you are right we do not need exhaust however it can allow you to run less boost with the same amount of HP.

I think that they are darn good as well!!! :beer:

And I also think you've done a great job in a short amount of time. I am pleased that you repsonded about the exhaust work, and the dyno sheet. I think it shows a ton of integrity on your part to offer results based soley on the kit, as well a dyno graph information. It is this info that everyone will want to know in order to evaluate the cost/performance formula. Sp please don't let my questions be taken as being negative. Based on the early results, it sounds to me like your gonna have one highly competitive kit coming out!

[Logan]

Yikes...not sure how to answer you. I guess its just common knowledge that opening up the exhaust lowers torque in most cases. I'd do a search on this if I were you and you will find all the info you need on the topic. Its just a fact that loosing torque throughout much of the power curve is a common side effect of opening up the exhaust.

Remember, there is more to power delivery than peak numbers! Loosing torque on the low and mid range effects seat of the pants performance.

...and while there's SOME truth to that, it completely depends on the engine and exhaust combination. That generalism certainly doesn't apply to a Viper V10 and stock exhaust and a Ford 4.6 with custom headers...

I for one saw great torque improvements across the entire band on my marauder, go look at the chart in my gallery.

Generalism's are crap. Talk specifics with people who've actually been there, done that on the platform in question.

[MarauderTJA]

Great first run. I am sure that after your exhaust mods you'll get a considerable increase in both HP and TQ. What intercooler are you using, if any?

TOM, Cape Coral, Florida




Well it is snowing and 30 degrees in Kansas City. Hope your weather is better.

DR sent me a SCT tunning file which I loaded in my car an headed down to MC Racing today for the first ever ProCharger Dyno.

My base run one month ago was 261.1RWHP 286.7 Torque

My run today was 397.4RWHP 365.3 Torque

That was running 9PSI and no other mods besides the ProCharger and 4:10 Gears and 180 stat. and I had some real good 91 Octane. Who sells 93 Ocatne?

We had to end because of weather but I can tell you that this baby feels strong. I am waiting for my DR exhaust and will be back at the Dyno to finish ASAP. In the mean time I will have the horriable job of testing this baby.

Thanks for all your support and I will get pricing and more data in the very near future.

[MikesMerc]

Talk specifics with people who've actually been there, done that on the platform in question.

There is plenty of documentation in the forums here specific to the marauder that can demonstrate torque loss in the low and mid range when you open up the exhaust. This is especially true with NA and centrifugally blown cars that do not need improved exhaust flows in the low and mid ranges. In fact, here is some very on point specifics regarding the marauder exhaust: link (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=14165&page=2&pp=15&highlight=lidio+cats)

Better yet, if you like, I can ask Lidio to step in and perhaps post some dyno graphs demonstrating it. I know he has seen this first hand on many marauders..its not anyone's single personal example. Lidio has discussed his findings on this topic and I find such hard data based on numerous installations difficult to refute regardless of your "personal experience."

[Dennis Reinhart]

Gee here we have a brand new kit that has not even gone into production its on a test vehicle and to me the numbers are awsome this is a 8PSI kit and its making just under 400 RWHP and its on 91 octane with 4 degrees retarted timing and the cars AF is not even dialed in, No you do not need to have exhaust on this car or buy exhaust with the kit, does exhaust help, of course it does,

Again no matter who's kit you buy, invest in better brakes and the transmission upgrade. I would rather have the car bullit proof than take a chance in something going wrong, The club has already seen N/A Marauders transmissions fail much less adding 200 RWHP to a stock car, again its your choice, Gregg has done a great job in getting this started in record time just wait till the car is dialed in it will be worth the wait. :beer: :beer:

[FordNut]

There is plenty of documentation in the forums here specific to the marauder that can demonstrate torque loss in the low and mid range when you open up the exhaust. This is especially true with NA and centrifugally blown cars that do not need improved exhaust flows in the low and mid ranges. In fact, here is some very on point specifics regarding the marauder exhaust: link (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=14165&page=2&pp=15&highlight=lidio+cats)

Better yet, if you like, I can ask Lidio to step in and perhaps post some dyno graphs demonstrating it. I know he has seen this first hand on many marauders..its not anyone's single personal example. Lidio has discussed his findings on this topic and I find such hard data based on numerous installations difficult to refute regardless of your "personal experience."
Logan and I both added Kooks headers and did before & after dyno pulls. Both picked up lots of low end torque. I don't know what your "personal experience" is but your comments are WRONG.

[maraudernkc]

We are using a ProCharger 2 core sheetmetal design.




Great first run. I am sure that after your exhaust mods you'll get a considerable increase in both HP and TQ. What intercooler are you using, if any?

TOM, Cape Coral, Florida

[maraudernkc]

Mike, I would love to see any Dyno Info you have or anyone else on a Centrifacal Blower on a MM before and after exhaust. More interseted in the DR system.

Thanks, Greg



There is plenty of documentation in the forums here specific to the marauder that can demonstrate torque loss in the low and mid range when you open up the exhaust. This is especially true with NA and centrifugally blown cars that do not need improved exhaust flows in the low and mid ranges. In fact, here is some very on point specifics regarding the marauder exhaust: link (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=14165&page=2&pp=15&highlight=lidio+cats)

Better yet, if you like, I can ask Lidio to step in and perhaps post some dyno graphs demonstrating it. I know he has seen this first hand on many marauders..its not anyone's single personal example. Lidio has discussed his findings on this topic and I find such hard data based on numerous installations difficult to refute regardless of your "personal experience."

[maraudernkc]

Dennis to you have a Dyno with your Vortec kit on a stock MM and then one with your Vortec kit and your exhaust? I think some people thing that adding exhaust to a centrifical MM will lose TQ. Maybe it will but I don't think so It might change the curve.




Gee here we have a brand new kit that has not even gone into production its on a test vehicle and to me the numbers are awsome this is a 8PSI kit and its making just under 400 RWHP and its on 91 octane with 4 degrees retarted timing and the cars AF is not even dialed in, No you do not need to have exhaust on this car or buy exhaust with the kit, does exhaust help, of course it does,

Again no matter who's kit you buy, invest in better brakes and the transmission upgrade. I would rather have the car bullit proof than take a chance in something going wrong, The club has already seen N/A Marauders transmissions fail much less adding 200 RWHP to a stock car, again its your choice, Gregg has done a great job in getting this started in record time just wait till the car is dialed in it will be worth the wait. :beer: :beer:

[David Morton]

Lots of talk about exhaust on a blower thread.

Here's my :twocents: . I learned this in 4-stroke engine theory.

:soapbox:
Valve timing has an "overlap" event when both the intake and exhaust valves are open. This occurs at the end of the exhaust stroke at TDC and at the beginning of the intake stroke. You'd think this would cause exhaust gas to be sucked into the intake where there is a constant vacuum but it doesn't. The column of exhaust gasses in the exhaust pipes has weight to it and it's inertia actually pulls the last of the spent gas out of the cylinder and pulls a little of the intake charge in behind it. This is called "purging". That's why there is an overlap, it makes the engine more efficient. Smaller pipes and crossovers on dual exhausts help the low end on N/A engines at the expense of the high end, so manufacturers try to hit the best compromise by "tuning" the exhaust on high output engines. That's where the design of the manifolds, the location of the crossover, and other factors, even the location of the bends combine to produce the best compromise.

Blowers change everything. With the intake manifold under pressure, this inertia effect is no longer needed and now the smaller pipes do nothing but hold back the purging on the high end that the blower will do. But we also have another concern because too much purging on the low end will just be pushing air and fuel past the valves and straight into the exhaust. This is what happens on the low end with bigger pipes. Oh, we'll be making lots more power with bigger pipes on the high end, and there won't be any loss of power on the low end, but overall fuel efficiency goes way down and it doesn't have to!

Here is where the often overlooked cam timing can help dramatically. Remember the timing on a N/A design supposes a vacuum inside the intake, and is timed to use the inertial purging of the exhaust gasses. But if we are using a blower or turbocharger, we don't need help from the exhaust so we can back off the amount of overlap and not lose any low-end torque and not be over-purging the cylinder either. Then we can open up the exhaust all we want. This is also especially helpful for the turbocharged engines where opening up the exhaust as much as possible will minimize that low-end turbo-lag and is more critical to overall performance.

Blowers are easy, but turbos are more efficient, and better in my opinion, when the whole engine set-up, including camshaft timing, is designed with the turbo in mind. Check out Gale Banks' dual turbo small block chevy kits (http://www.bankspower.com/twin-turbo-products.cfm). Given a good exhaust, they claim almost no noticeable turbo lag. 2+ Hp per cubic inch on pump gas. That's 562+ Hp for our engine. Well over 500 RWHP!

But, since nobody wants to try a dual turbo design, I'm watching this Pro-Charger development with great interest. :D

Now I'm thinking about camshafts...

[SergntMac]

Dennis to you have a Dyno with your Vortec kit on a stock MM and then one with your Vortec kit and your exhaust? I think some people thing that adding exhaust to a centrifical MM will lose TQ. Maybe it will but I don't think so It might change the curve.
I'm answering here KC, because I did the initial testing of the Cobra exhaust for DR. He delivered my Corba manifolds to me at MV-I, in Ennis TX, and I completed the install when the Y pipe arrived via UPS.

I did clean "before" and "after" dynos of just the DR Cobra kit alone, I retained my Ravin Z-55 mufflers and resonator delete tips, both which had been in place for a while. I have the dyno reports here somewhere, just can't put my fingers on them right now. It was a simple and smooth install done in about 2 hours, we didn't even have to pull my MM from the above ground dyno.

As I recall it, there was no loss of power. Net gains totaled 30 RWHP and 30 RWTQ across the power curve. In the "after" dyno, my RWTQ numbers were lower at 2000 RPM, but power came on stronger than ever at 3000 RPM. So, my power shifted up the RPM range just a bit, but it wasn't "lost" and any consideration of that is a twist on words. BTW, I'm running a Vortech blower, V-2, S trim, 9.5 PSI of boost.

For N/A cars with few other mods in place, this shift would cause immediate disappointment in seat-of-the-pants impression, and I don't suggest an exhaust upgrade as one of your first mods to a N/A application. Your power gains will be lower than you expect, but you can overcome this by reducing parasitic drag (electric water pump, UDPs) increased torque multiplication (Stallion TC) and regearing (4:10s?). It can be corrected.

In boosted applications, considering this a "loss of power" couldn't be further from the truth. The power you gain is awesome, and the bang for the buck is remarkable. Anyone who spends thousands of dollars for supercharging, needs to spend the 900 bucks for this added power, it's a no-brainer, yes? One that could be even better that 30/30 gains.

BTW, I bought a complete Kook's system through DR, and I hope to do a side by side dyno test before Spring. I'll need some time to dial in my new engine, but I will get to it soon. Won't that be fun to kick around?

Just my .02c, hope it helps.

[stevengerard]

Thanks David for all that insight. Give us some things to ponder and ultimately just makes me want to spend more money on an exhaust system.

[tmac1337]

Once this kit is finished and correctly tuned at it's price mark, it SOUNDS like there will be a lot of people with left over money to afford the Reinhart exhaust kit too! :banana:

[cyclone03]

Lots of talk about exhaust on a blower thread.

Here's my :twocents: . I learned this in 4-stroke engine theory.

:soapbox:
Valve timing has an "overlap" event when both the intake and exhaust valves Blowers change everything. With the intake manifold under pressure, this inertia effect is no longer needed and now the smaller pipes do nothing but hold back the purging on the high end that the blower will do. But we also have another concern because too much purging on the low end will just be pushing air and fuel past the valves and straight into the exhaust. This is what happens on the low end with bigger pipes. Oh, we'll be making lots more power with bigger pipes on the high end, and there won't be any loss of power on the low end, but overall fuel efficiency goes way down and it doesn't have to!

Here is where the often overlooked cam timing can help dramatically. Remember the timing on a N/A design supposes a vacuum inside the intake, and is timed to use the inertial purging of the exhaust gasses. But if we are using a blower or turbocharger, we don't need help from the exhaust so we can back off the amount of overlap and not lose any low-end torque and not be over-purging the cylinder either. Then we can open up the exhaust all we want. This is also especially helpful for the turbocharged engines where opening up the exhaust as much as possible will minimize that low-end turbo-lag and is more critical to overall performance.

Blowers are easy, but turbos are more efficient, and better in my opinion, when the whole engine set-up, including camshaft timing, is designed with the turbo in mind. Check out Gale Banks' dual turbo small block chevy kits (http://www.bankspower.com/twin-turbo-products.cfm). Given a good exhaust, they claim almost no noticeable turbo lag. 2+ Hp per cubic inch on pump gas. That's 562+ Hp for our engine. Well over 500 RWHP!

But, since nobody wants to try a dual turbo design, I'm watching this Pro-Charger development with great interest. :D

Now I'm thinking about camshafts...

Dave your mixing valvetiming(overlap)and pipe dia.Yes they do relate to each other but the pipe dia and length in this case is what moves the power band up and down (tq) in relation to this subject.The higher flow exhaust does reduce scavaging at lower rpm compared to stock or a lower flow exhaust.Remember the flow we a talking here creates a neg pressure in the combustion chamber to help draw in fresh charge.
Yes a blower(supercharger)will "waste"some charge at lower rpm and more charge is wasted at lower rpm with a higher flow exhaust,but that loss is more than mad up a few hundred to a thousand RPM up scale.
As I have said many times MY KOOKS SYSTEM LOST POWER BELOW 3000RPM over the stock system,but at 3500 and up ,holly cow, it rips!I'm N/A.


You mentioned Turbos,the trick,or balance required with them is significant,0n the inlet side of the turbo our goal is to build,and balance, positive exhaust pressure to run the turbo against not over scavaging the cylinder,a big tude will make great higher rpm power but may suffer undisirable turbo lag while those big pipes build pressure to turn the turbo,small pipe,great lowend without tubo lag but limited highrpm power and you run the risk of the exhaust pressure blowing past the waste gate and getting boost run away.
Now on the down side of the turbo you can just about go as big as you want without any ill effects,just let the turbo spin baby.

[cyclone03]

Well it is snowing and 30 degrees in Kansas City. Hope your weather is better.

DR sent me a SCT tunning file which I loaded in my car an headed down to MC Racing today for the first ever ProCharger Dyno.

My base run one month ago was 261.1RWHP 286.7 Torque

My run today was 397.4RWHP 365.3 Torque

That was running 9PSI and no other mods besides the ProCharger and 4:10 Gears and 180 stat. and I had some real good 91 Octane. Who sells 93 Ocatne?

We had to end because of weather but I can tell you that this baby feels strong. I am waiting for my DR exhaust and will be back at the Dyno to finish ASAP. In the mean time I will have the horriable job of testing this baby.

Thanks for all your support and I will get pricing and more data in the very near future.

Great work and numbers.

[maraudernkc]

David, you are right and it's a proven fact that turbos are the most effiecent and then Centrifical blowers and than roots blowers. This is not a conterversy because we all know that the roots blowers great on the MM.




Lots of talk about exhaust on a blower thread.

Here's my :twocents: . I learned this in 4-stroke engine theory.

:soapbox:
Valve timing has an "overlap" event when both the intake and exhaust valves are open. This occurs at the end of the exhaust stroke at TDC and at the beginning of the intake stroke. You'd think this would cause exhaust gas to be sucked into the intake where there is a constant vacuum but it doesn't. The column of exhaust gasses in the exhaust pipes has weight to it and it's inertia actually pulls the last of the spent gas out of the cylinder and pulls a little of the intake charge in behind it. This is called "purging". That's why there is an overlap, it makes the engine more efficient. Smaller pipes and crossovers on dual exhausts help the low end on N/A engines at the expense of the high end, so manufacturers try to hit the best compromise by "tuning" the exhaust on high output engines. That's where the design of the manifolds, the location of the crossover, and other factors, even the location of the bends combine to produce the best compromise.

Blowers change everything. With the intake manifold under pressure, this inertia effect is no longer needed and now the smaller pipes do nothing but hold back the purging on the high end that the blower will do. But we also have another concern because too much purging on the low end will just be pushing air and fuel past the valves and straight into the exhaust. This is what happens on the low end with bigger pipes. Oh, we'll be making lots more power with bigger pipes on the high end, and there won't be any loss of power on the low end, but overall fuel efficiency goes way down and it doesn't have to!

Here is where the often overlooked cam timing can help dramatically. Remember the timing on a N/A design supposes a vacuum inside the intake, and is timed to use the inertial purging of the exhaust gasses. But if we are using a blower or turbocharger, we don't need help from the exhaust so we can back off the amount of overlap and not lose any low-end torque and not be over-purging the cylinder either. Then we can open up the exhaust all we want. This is also especially helpful for the turbocharged engines where opening up the exhaust as much as possible will minimize that low-end turbo-lag and is more critical to overall performance.

Blowers are easy, but turbos are more efficient, and better in my opinion, when the whole engine set-up, including camshaft timing, is designed with the turbo in mind. Check out Gale Banks' dual turbo small block chevy kits (http://www.bankspower.com/twin-turbo-products.cfm). Given a good exhaust, they claim almost no noticeable turbo lag. 2+ Hp per cubic inch on pump gas. That's 562+ Hp for our engine. Well over 500 RWHP!

But, since nobody wants to try a dual turbo design, I'm watching this Pro-Charger development with great interest. :D

Now I'm thinking about camshafts...

[maraudernkc]

I just learned some interesting information that pertains to my first Dyno run.

1. A Votech uses an air to water intercooler and when on a Dyno for the first run has very cool water which relates into nice cool dense air into the intake.
Now on the second run with no cool down you have nice warm water. You will never get close to the same numbers on the second run.The same theroy applies to the street.

2. A Procharger use a big air to air sheetmetal intercooler that relays on air running thru the intercooler to lower the air tempature to the intake. Well from what I have been told that when your sitting on a DYNO and you have that little fan blowing next to nothing on your car. You are not getting a true reading. Just image driving down the road at 40MPH and Imagne how much air is going thru that intercooler. To make a long story short I was told that you are losing a minimum of 5% loss in RWHP and TQ on the Dyno vs. real world driving.

3. Locking up the converter on the DYNO. This is a practice that alot of people do. They lock up the tourque converter on the Dyno run and it produces higher RWHP and TQ numbers.I did not do this but will on my next run if we want to compare apples to apples.

I want you guys to tell me if you beleive the above to be true or not.

PS. I will post my Dyno sheet Friday my I.T. guy forgot to scan it.

Thanks, Greg (maraudernkc)

[FordNut]

I just learned some interesting information that pertains to my first Dyno run.

1. A Votech uses an air to water intercooler and when on a Dyno for the first run has very cool water which relates into nice cool dense air into the intake.
Now on the second run with no cool down you have nice warm water. You will never get close to the same numbers on the second run.The same theroy applies to the street.

2. A Procharger use a big air to air sheetmetal intercooler that relays on air running thru the intercooler to lower the air tempature to the intake. Well from what I have been told that when your sitting on a DYNO and you have that little fan blowing next to nothing on your car. You are not getting a true reading. Just image driving down the road at 40MPH and Imagne how much air is going thru that intercooler. To make a long story short I was told that you are losing a minimum of 5% loss in RWHP and TQ on the Dyno vs. real world driving.

3. Locking up the converter on the DYNO. This is a practice that alot of people do. They lock up the tourque converter on the Dyno run and it produces higher RWHP and TQ numbers.I did not do this but will on my next run if we want to compare apples to apples.

I want you guys to tell me if you beleive the above to be true or not.

PS. I will post my Dyno sheet Friday my I.T. guy forgot to scan it.

Thanks, Greg (maraudernkc)
1. True, unless you add ice to the water reservoir, then you can achieve "supercooling" in which the intake air charge is even lower than ambient air.

2. True, and one of the reasons I've been holding out for an air-air intercooled system. You can also achieve "supercooling" with these systems but it requires spraying CO2 or Nitrous on the outside of the intercooler. This is against NHRA rules. The same holds true of ram-air intake systems in that the power achieved on a dyno is lower than real-world because the little fan used on the dyno doesn't move nearly as much air into the engine as driving the car. I don't know of any real numerical correlation so the 5% number I'll just have to take your word on.

3. Actually, locking up the tc should produce lower torque numbers since it functions as a torque multiplier in normal, unlocked mode (theoretically, of course... real-world results may not agree). However, by locking the converter and manipulating the down-shifting setpoints in the program, you can get a very good, accurate wide range dyno run from about 1500 rpm up. But since most other folks are doing it this way it is a nice apples to apples comparison. The real issue comes in when you try to just drive in off the street and strap down to the dyno. You can't repeat the test since the real driving program doesn't work this way (unless you have a multiple program chip and setup one program to do this, then just flip a switch and there you go).

Just my 2 cents worth.

BTW, way to go, great numbers for this early in the development process.

[SergntMac]

Greg, nice work on everything so far, you're doing a great job.

The thing to keep in mind about dyno stuff, is to conduct as fair (to you) and impratial (to what you want to know) in running a dyno test. Everything you posted is just about right on the money, but what do you do about it?

Never run a test dyno with a cool engine, it's a waste of time and borderling dishonest. Bring the car to normal operating temps, then strap it down. This should take about 10 minutes, so, allow for 10 minutes rest between pulls, or, monitor the normal engine temps and do your additional pulls when temps are normal again.

When you're doing "before and after" testing of mods, the "before and after" number you post should be three (or more) "before" pulls averaged, and three (or more) "after" pulls averaged. This is fair to you, your testing proceedure, and deliver results impartial to the mod.

You can't really do much about the size of the fan available. DynoJets have minimum standards, and they supply fans with the purchase and install, but not everyone uses them. Whatever size is in use, ask and note the CFM if you can. All the fan is supposed to do is "normalize" the flow of air to what ever induction system is at play. It's not there to cool, and keeping things standardized between pulls is what is important.

Stay objective in your testing, make as much of it as "worst case" as possible. Your power facts will be what they will be, and it's far easier to offer congrats for someone else's "greater gains" than it is explain their "I got less" disappointment.

Remember too, that "peaking out" is not all it's cracked up to be. More often than not, I've seen more lesser powered muscle cars kick azz on the track, than "top performers." If you understand what a "trailer queen" is in muscle cars, there are "dyno queens" too. Forget about them, doing the job on real pavement is where it's at, and your numbers are looking real good right now. Cost is a factor here too.

Thanks again, rock on...

[MikesMerc]

Logan and I both added Kooks headers and did before & after dyno pulls. Both picked up lots of low end torque. I don't know what your "personal experience" is but your comments are WRONG.

My comments have nothing to do with my own personal experience. Instead I base my comments on what is being seen over dozens of installations by qualified folks doing the work. Unfortunately all I seem to get as far as contradictory evidence is nothing but "personal experiences" of those that don't like what they are reading :rolleyes: And what I find really funny is that Mac is saying the same thing I am, yet you folks wish to disagree with me only. But, that kind of crap is just par for the course here on MM.net.

I'm not saying that the trade off in power with an exhaust upgrade isn't worth the gain on the high end. I certainly think it is. That's why I have the Kooks and a full custom 2.5" exhaust. I picked up big power. However, I am smart enough to know that the blower has mitigated the performance loss on the low end. duh.

The more important point is about a blower "changing everything"....well that's just not true. Think about it. How often will your car really be under boost? Do you plan on accelerating at WOT off every stoplight?

Remember, any good blower system has a by pass valve to keep the blower and intake charge temps under control. The back pressure needs to be bled off when the engine doesn't need the boost or the blower becomes way too hot. A by pass valve does this.

A by pass valve is operated by the vacuum condition in the intake. When your throttle is less than approx 75% open, the intake remains in a vacuum state. The vacuum (via a tube) holds the by pass valve open and recirculates the boost helping control back pressure and heat. At WOT, the intake vacuum condition is eliminated, the by pass closes, and the full boost is devilered into the intake.

Now apply this to daily driving. Unless your "on it" the intake is in a vacuum state and the by pass is open. There is NO boost condition.

So the bottom line is whenever you come off a light at anything less than WOT (or near WOT), and whenever you accelerate at less than WOT, your engine will react to your exhaust upgrades just as it would on a normally aspirated motor. So, if you undertsand that opening up the exhaust on a normally aspirated car relocates the power higher in the band, and can lead to a loss of torque on the low end (just as Mac has said), its quite easy to see that opening up the exhaust on a blower car will have the same effect as it does on a NA car when you are not in the boost.

But, hey, you folks can beleive whatever you want if it makes you feel good and sleep at night. Just be aware that there are plenty of results out there showing a loss of TQ in the low and mid range when the exhaust is opened up...be it a NA car, or a blower car when not in the boost. Again, that's not to say the gains on the mid to high end are not worth it. But, if you think there is nothing lost anywhere in the power curve, and only gains to be had, by opening up the exhaust, then feel free to continue kidding yourself.

Its a shame you guys don't read up on all this stuff a bit more.....

[FordNut]

...what I find really funny is that Mac is saying the same thing I am, yet you folks wish to disagree with me only. But, that kind of crap is just par for the course here on MM.net.
Maybe it's not so much in what you say as it is in how you say it.



So, if you undertsand that opening up the exhaust on a normally aspirated car relocates the power higher in the band......
Now this I agree with. The torque and hp peaks are at higher rpm than with the original exhaust.



But, hey, you folks can beleive whatever you want if it makes you feel good and sleep at night. Just be aware that there are plenty of results out there showing a loss of TQ in the low and mid range when the exhaust is opened up...be it a NA car, or a blower car when not in the boost. Again, that's not to say the gains on the mid to high end are not worth it. But, if you think there is nothing lost anywhere in the power curve, and only gains to be had, by opening up the exhaust, then feel free to continue kidding yourself.

Its a shame you guys don't read up on all this stuff a bit more.....
What's a shame is that some people believe whatever they read and do not do any experiments to prove or disprove it. I read up on headers a lot before making any exhaust mods. I had expected some loss in low rpm torque. I was pleasantly surprised to find that did not happen. Yes, I gained more at the upper end than I did at the lower end. But I did gain torque at the lower end also, just not as much. I lost nothing.

If you read up on header design, you will find that what you are saying is true in some cases. With shorty headers, or with manifolds, you should expect to lose some low rpm torque when you go up in size. Even with long tube headers which have excessively large primaris and collectors, you should expect to see a drop in low rpm torque. With long tube headers which do not have excessively large primaries and collectors, you should expect to see an increase in torque even at low rpms. The Kooks headers are not really considered "long tube", as they should have 34" primaries to fit in that category. But they are mid-length, which provides some of the benefit of long tubes.

Check out Headers By Ed at headersbyed.com for lots of good info. I was going to have them make me a set (at a very premium price) but then Kooks came out with theirs.

[Petrograde]

man,... If I win the S/C raffle,... I'm never writing any posts about it. We just can't have a civil friggin' S/C thread. :rolleyes:

[MikesMerc]

Maybe it's not so much in what you say as it is in how you say it.

Perhaps so. I know that my line of questioning and continued skepticism are unpopular at times. But, at the same time, I get an aweful lot of PMs that thank me for driving home points and asking rough questions that they did not want to ask for fear of being flamed. So, its tough to lighten up.


What's a shame is that some people believe whatever they read and do not do any experiments to prove or disprove it.

I agree. But what's worse is that, for an automotive enthusiast site, we have more technical novices here than typical. That has lead to quite a bit of misinformation being perpetuated. That is why I suggest that our members do some reading outside of this site.


If you read up on header design

I am well aware of header design...but thanks for info! Your points are valid in my book.

The tough thing to explain is that for the 3 or 4 "personal experiences" here that claim "no loss" or power in the low end, or even some who claim nothing but gains, there are far more reports of lost power in the low to mid range. Lidio has explained time and again what he has seen on his dyno. Again, its hard not to say that a loss in power in the low range can be expected from an exhaust upgrade when Lidio has documented so many cases of just that.

Anyway...enough off topic stuff. I think it has been hashed over enough for everyone to make thier own judgements. Let's get back to the Procharger kit.

[MikesMerc]

man,... If I win the S/C raffle,... I'm never writing any posts about it. We just can't have a civil friggin' S/C thread. :rolleyes:

What's not civil? There has been no name calling or flaming. Is a little heated debate a bad thing :confused:

[David Morton]

Thanks David for all that insight. Give us some things to ponder and ultimately just makes me want to spend more money on an exhaust system.I think whatever kind of boost system I end up with I'm gonna wind up installing these electric exhaust dumps (http://www.dmhperformance.com/ecutout.htm)and running 3 or 4 inch black lake pipes along the sides. A side benefit will be the ground effect the pipes give when used in conjunction with a front air dam.

I'll be able to have the best of both worlds, nice stock sounding exhaust for the trips to church, funerals and hospitals, etc. or a fully unmuffled, straight through, b@lls on the outside racing exhaust...

...or anywhere in between! :D

[stevengerard]

I think whatever kind of boost system I end up with I'm gonna wind up installing these electric exhaust dumps (http://www.dmhperformance.com/ecutout.htm)and running 3 or 4 inch black lake pipes along the sides. ...or anywhere in between! :D

Pretty cool, though I wonder how long they'd last in Salty Chicago

[David Morton]

Pretty cool, though I wonder how long they'd last in Salty ChicagoThe dumps or the pipes?

Yeah, I see the body is made of aluminum, but I'm no metalologist, no...no metalsmith! no...NO Metalica!... oh, I give up you know what I mean, expert on aluminum alloys. I think the pipes can be made out of stainless steel and powdercoated, don't want anything shiney. Actually I'm more leaning more towards something square that looks like it is supposed to be ground effects and has a rectangular opening at the back.

I know what you could do!

Move to Florida, ya stubborn yankee! :rolleyes:

We just got two more Electoral votes from the last census and we're comin' on strong. We may have lost the war but we're winnin' the peace! 4 out of 5 transplanted yankees agree, bein' a honorary rebel is a lot of fun!

Sunshine State Marauders hog call!

Sooooouuuuuuweeeeee!

Sometimes I just kill me! :D

[stevengerard]

My sister is moving back down there this spring. I'll stick to salt and wind for a while thank you - actually that sounds like Florida's east coast doesn't it.

[maraudernkc]

Attached is the first ever Dyno run with the ProCharger MM project.

Remember this was on maybe 91 octane and the wrong tune and the timing was backed off 4 degrees.

You have to start some where.

Fire away!!!!!!!:beer:

[FordNut]

Attached is the first ever Dyno run with the ProCharger MM project.

Remember this was on maybe 91 octane and the wrong tune and the timing was backed off 4 degrees.

You have to start some where.

Fire away!!!!!!!:beer:
Looking good. You really need to get a program to lock the tc and stop downshifting so you can see a pull from 1500 up. That's where the truth will be told. But it shows a flat torque curve for what you have so far, and I am happy to see that.

[MikesMerc]

You really need to get a program to lock the tc and stop downshifting so you can see a pull from 1500 up. That's where the truth will be told.

Agreed. I always ask for a 2000 to 6500 pull so you can see what's going on. An aweful lot of street driving is done in the low and mid rpm range.

That said, the curve shown thus far does look promising :beer:

[maraudernkc]

I will have DR send me a program to lock the TC on the next run and have then start it down lower. That's why I don't mind showing you guys my fisrt Dyno. I am not a Dyno expert. I have only done two my baseline and this one.




Agreed. I always ask for a 2000 to 6500 pull so you can see what's going on. An aweful lot of street driving is done in the low and mid rpm range.

That said, the curve shown thus far does look promising :beer:

[MikesMerc]

No worries...everyone just needs to be patient. Getting the tune "just right" and running all the testing takes time. The kit is coming together faster than expected anyways!

Keep us posted.

[maraudernkc]

Zack, I wa looking at your RWHP and TQ numbers and there pretty huge.

How was your Dyno run? Are those corrected numbers? What Octane gas? Was the converter locked up? Was the motor cold? Any other engine mods? Exhaust?

Those are great numbers and I am just curious.



This guy has made the fastest progress with a blower than any company here. The tuning process will take some time, and analyzing horsepower and torque numbers without an aftermarket exhaust is kind of pointless if you ask me. Give this guy a little more time, sounds like he's on a road to surprise us all, and fast.

[Zack]

Zack, I wa looking at your RWHP and TQ numbers and there pretty huge.

How was your Dyno run? Are those corrected numbers? What Octane gas? Was the converter locked up? Was the motor cold? Any other engine mods? Exhaust?

Those are great numbers and I am just curious.

I was on a DynoJet, Sae Corrected, 93Octane (Amoco) Yes, converter locked, Motor at operating temp.
I have Kooks Headers and a Stall converter.
My #'s have gone WAY up since then, just waiting to get it tuned at Lidio's this month.

[studio460]

Attached is the first ever Dyno run with the ProCharger MM project.maraudernkc:

That torque curve looks VERY promising! Again, it's GREAT to finally see a test-bed car running 91 octane so I'll know what to expect in California! Keep up the great work! Appreciate all the prompt updates!

[CRUZTAKER]

Hey maraudernkc,

When you do get those tuning issues figured out....the race is off!:D

I'm not that crazy....he he....very nice job you are doing.
And particularly in getting everyones attention and respect around here.

Hoping to meet you and your car someday...not to race!

[sailsmen]

Extremely impressive! :banana2:

Don't let an ingnorant comment dampen your spirit.

Keep up the good work.


The purpose of this board is to educate all of us!