loose thing in the back & early tire wear

[rayaa]

what is that irritating noise i hear in the back (passenger?) quarterpanel area? seems i ve seen it mentioned here b4 and now i am hearing it for the last few day? what is it and will the &^%$(*!@ dealer fix it?

also- 10700 miles on my bought new MM and the tires are shot- all 4- any1 have a similar expereince and if so what did you do about it- other than 600$ worth of new rubber?

[carfixer]

what is that irritating noise i hear in the back (passenger?) quarterpanel area? seems i ve seen it mentioned here b4 and now i am hearing it for the last few day? what is it and will the &^%$(*!@ dealer fix it?

also- 10700 miles on my bought new MM and the tires are shot- all 4- any1 have a similar expereince and if so what did you do about it- other than 600$ worth of new rubber?

What year is your car? When does it make the noise? What does the noise sound like?

My rears last 9k miles, my fronts went 20K. Get an alignment with the camber and toe set near zero to get the most life out of the fronts. Do a search on rear tire wear to see the different opinions. My rears wear due to driver habits :burnout:

[MENINBLK]

My rears wear due to driver habits :burnout:

How do you explain the fronts ???

[David Morton]

How do you explain the fronts ???I'll get this one. First, camber is how even the tire rides on the road, leaning in at the top is negative, out is positive. Negative tends to wear the inside of the tire, positive, the outside.

Now look at your front tires as they turn. See how the inside tires' negative camber becomes positive while the outside tire gets even more negative? Now put a jack underneath the "inside" side of the car to simulate the body rolling action of the G-forces during that turn and you will see the tires are heading back to zero camber. I think the factory alignment specs are to give you the best handling possible. In a hard turn they're pretty flat on the road.

But my experience says it wasn't enough to be noticeable. Now I did get mine changed very soon after I got it, pretty much like carfixer says, nearest zero on camber, but I didn't notice much of a loss of cornering ability. Stock it still handles like a rollerskate on a rail compared to my old Grand Marquis. But I can tell you from my experience, because I've set many alignments in my career, that camber of -0.7 together with a -0.13 degrees of toe is gonna wear the pi$$ out of the inside of the tires because those are the settings when the tires are pointed straight ahead and (I've never seen a study, but) I think most of us spend most of the time driving that way, in a straight line.

But I guess the test track in Dearborn doesn't reflect that. As a matter of fact I've seen some of it and it seems to be mostly turns.

Doh!

[AzMarauder]

I'll get this one. First, camber is how even the tire rides on the road, leaning in at the top is negative, out is positive. Negative tends to wear the inside of the tire, positive, the outside.

Now look at your front tires as they turn. See how the inside tires' negative camber becomes positive while the outside tire gets even more negative? Now put a jack underneath the "inside" side of the car to simulate the body rolling action of the G-forces during that turn and you will see the tires are heading back to zero camber. I think the factory alignment specs are to give you the best handling possible. In a hard turn they're pretty flat on the road.

But my experience says it wasn't enough to be noticeable. Now I did get mine changed very soon after I got it, pretty much like carfixer says, nearest zero on camber, but I didn't notice much of a loss of cornering ability. Stock it still handles like a rollerskate on a rail compared to my old Grand Marquis. But I can tell you from my experience, because I've set many alignments in my career, that camber of -0.7 together with a -0.13 degrees of toe is gonna wear the pi$$ out of the inside of the tires because those are the settings when the tires are pointed straight ahead and (I've never seen a study, but) I think most of us spend most of the time driving that way, in a straight line.

But I guess the test track in Dearborn doesn't reflect that. As a matter of fact I've seen some of it and it seems to be mostly turns.

Doh!
Dave,

So what camber / toe-in do you recommend for our cars?

[MENINBLK]

But Dave,

I've got 20,000 miles on my front tires and they don't look like anything you've described.
I also run the pressure on my tires at 38psi, but the wear is even,
and I should get another 20k on these tires. according to the tread gauge.
My rears only had .2" at 20k miles so I replaced them.

The best place for you to get tires is Tirerack...
The Rears are only $88 and the Fronts are $128.
You can have them mounted and balanced at any shop Tirerack recommends,
or have them done at your own garage.

You won't get a better price anywhere...

[David Morton]

I had mine set to -0.0D camber both sides, zero toe.

Caster at specs (6D). 0.5D less on the left if you like to cancel out road crown. Even (6D both sides), if you want it to go straight down the dragstrip and corner equally. Mine's even.

I got a friend that works at Firestone and he picked me up my new rears (at 7000 miles! :rock: ) for $81 each plus EPA disposal fee and tax, mounted and balanced, but that was back in October when Tirerack had them for $81 too.

[Stocker]

At 15000 my tires look good. I keep a good eye on the air pressure. The fronts about 40psi or higher and the rear about 24 for even treadwear across. The most common high wear problem is not enough air in the front and too much in the back.........and.............. ................aggressive driving habits!!!!!!!!!!!

[LordVader]

At 15000 my tires look good. I keep a good eye on the air pressure. The fronts about 40psi or higher and the rear about 24 for even treadwear across. The most common high wear problem is not enough air in the front and too much in the back.........and.............. ................aggressive driving habits!!!!!!!!!!!At 17K I still have the originals on, and they are still wearing pretty well (knock on wood). Based on the recommendations of a lot of the site members I run high in the front (38) and a little low in the back (30) and check them regularly.

[TripleTransAm]

For those who think their fronts are wearing evenly on the factory alignment... jack the car up and have a look on the extreme inside. Even with the wheel completely turned, I never got to see the extent to which the extreme insides of my front tires had been munched until I saw them with the car up in the air. The tires are sitting against the wall in my garage... if you look at them from any angle except straight onto the inside edge, they look brand new. :(

I'll take a photo of the tires this evening and provide measurements. The rear tires are so worn down the middle that there is a visible cupping down the center, just by looking at them from six-seven feet away. If it wasn't my own $$ going down the drain in premature tire wear, I'd be laughing my arse off, it's so funny to see a car do this.

[Pantherman]

Based on the recommendations of a lot of the site members I run high in the front (38) and a little low in the back (30) and check them regularly.[/QUOTE]


Not many of us have every tested the true handling limits of our Marauders.
One caution on running significantly higher front and/or lower rear pressures--normal handling will feel a little looser and steering a little less precise. Depending on your driving style, that may be OK. Unfortunately, you will also lose significant emergency handling capability. If something bad happens, that may not be OK.

[MENINBLK]

I never trust my eyes, and I always measure the tire tread depth.
That's how I know I'm getting even wear...

[MENINBLK]

Based on the recommendations of a lot of the site members I run high in the front (38) and a little low in the back (30) and check them regularly.

Not many of us have every tested the true handling limits of our Marauders.
One caution on running significantly higher front and/or lower rear pressures--normal handling will feel a little looser and steering a little less precise. Depending on your driving style, that may be OK. Unfortunately, you will also lose significant emergency handling capability. If something bad happens, that may not be OK.

You should run your rears with just as much pressure as the fronts.
Not enough pressure in the rears will cause them to wear more in the center.

You also have to remember that its not the tires that support the car's weight
but its the air pressure in the tires that supports the car.
Higher pressure maks the tires harder, and they will flex less.
This can be beneficial in some instances, but not in others.
But the main reason we run with higher pressure is because our cars are HEAVIER than most vehicles,
and they should have more pressure in the tires to support their weight...

[Stocker]

You should run your rears with just as much pressure as the fronts.
Not enough pressure in the rears will cause them to wear more in the center.

You also have to remember that its not the tires that support the car's weight
but its the air pressure in the tires that supports the car.
Higher pressure maks the tires harder, and they will flex less.
This can be beneficial in some instances, but not in others.
But the main reason we run with higher pressure is because our cars are HEAVIER than most vehicles,
and they should have more pressure in the tires to support their weight...
It's the other way around. just like when you have a flat tire, now your riding on the sidewalls. When you add more air it makes the tire "stand up" . It's very easy to see... try adding air to a tire and watch how it comes off the edges. The more pressure the taller the tire. On Z rated tires the sidewalls are so stiff that you actually have to lower the air below 20 before you start to see the sidewalls bulge out more than normal.

[FordNut]

It's the other way around. just like when you have a flat tire, now your riding on the sidewalls. When you add more air it makes the tire "stand up" . It's very easy to see... try adding air to a tire and watch how it comes off the edges. The more pressure the taller the tire. On Z rated tires the sidewalls are so stiff that you actually have to lower the air below 20 before you start to see the sidewalls bulge out more than normal.
Trust me, these are opposite what we have learned over the years. Run the rears at 28 and they will wear quicker in the middle than at 35. Run them at 38 and they last longer. I'm on my 3rd set and learned the hard way...$$$$

[Stocker]

There are too many variables in day to day driving to say that a specific tire pressure for a specific car is accurate. The best way to check tire pressure is by reading the tire. If you look closely, you can actually see where the tire contacts the road. When the tire touches the road it picks up dirt. If you look close at the edge, you can see where the dirt starts. If you have too much air the clean spot will be closer to the inside, tire standing up. There is also a clean spot on the inside edge of the tire. If both edges read the same the alignment is good. Try looking at other cars as you walk by them. The rear tires are the easiest to spot because most people run too much air in them. What I do is put more air in and the let a little out at a time, drive for a day or two, and watch the pattern. When I'm close to the edge where the tred angles down I stop... Full tread foot print. Then check the pressure and note it. But I'm constantly watching the clean spot at the edges. It takes a good eye and a lot of practice. Best is on a flat dirt surface. Check other cars around you, once you see it, you won't forget it. Let me know what you find. PM me or just post.

[MENINBLK]

It's the other way around. just like when you have a flat tire, now your riding on the sidewalls. When you add more air it makes the tire "stand up" . It's very easy to see... try adding air to a tire and watch how it comes off the edges. The more pressure the taller the tire. On Z rated tires the sidewalls are so stiff that you actually have to lower the air below 20 before you start to see the sidewalls bulge out more than normal.

If you were right, I'd agree 100% with you but according to NHTSA, Tire Manufacturers,
and Vehicle Manufacturers, the only thing your tires do for you is provide traction.
They do NOT support your vehicle.
There are different characteristics of tires based on the design, size, tread pattern, and compounds used,
and they are also rated on loading levels as well.
But all of this refers to the integrity of the tire, and if the vehicle you are planning to mount the tire on
is going to surpass the tires load rating, you can easily disrupt the tire's integrity.

The Air inside the tire is what takes on the load of the vehicle they are mounted to.
The Tires can expand, within safe limits, up to the maximum amount of PSI indicated on the sidewall.
This is the tensile strength of the tire itself.
Tire wear is a factor that can only be measured over time, and according to MAINTENANCE, and driving patterns.
If you "drive like you stole it" all of the time, you'll see how and how fast your tires wear.
If you drive like your are the chauffer for Miss Daisy, if you don't maintain the proper pressure
to support Miss Daisy's a**, she'll be ripping you a new one when its time to change the worn out tires...

There are a lot of discussions on the board about our OEM BFG KDW tires, and through our experiences
we've all tried several different pressures, and it seems that the slightly higher pressures
allow us to get much more cruising mileage out of our BFG tires.

Now for those that AutoX, and open up their Marauders on the 1/4 mile,
your pressure needs will be different, and so will your tire wear patterns.

Try out each one of our suggestions, and measure your tread.
Drive for 5,000 miles and see how much tread you've lost and where.
you'll learn just like we did...

[STLThunder]

[QUOTE=rayaa]what is that irritating noise i hear in the back (passenger?) quarterpanel area? seems i ve seen it mentioned here b4 and now i am hearing it for the last few day? what is it and will the &^%$(*!@ dealer fix it?

I don't know, but I seem to have the same thing. It sounds like there is a loose screw rolling around inside something somewhere.

[Marc]

[QUOTE=rayaa]what is that irritating noise i hear in the back (passenger?) quarterpanel area? seems i ve seen it mentioned here b4 and now i am hearing it for the last few day? what is it and will the &^%$(*!@ dealer fix it?

I don't know, but I seem to have the same thing. It sounds like there is a loose screw rolling around inside something somewhere.



I've got the same thing, and have had it for a while. I took it in and the dealer said it was a latch or something in the front right door and replaced it. It was OK for about 2 weeks and now its back, but not as frequent. I usually hear it the loudest if I stop hard while going down a steep hill, and then it sounds like its something sliding forward.

The biggest mistake the dealer made is when he gave my a Lincoln as a loner. That was one quiet ride.

[SouLRioT]

I had a lose nut in my rear driver's side door. Maybe you do too?

[STLThunder]

I had a lose nut in my rear driver's side door. Maybe you do too?

The only loose nut in my car is the one behind the steering wheel!

[STLThunder]

[QUOTE=Marc]I've got the same thing, and have had it for a while. I took it in and the dealer said it was a latch or something in the front right door and replaced it. It was OK for about 2 weeks and now its back, but not as frequent. I usually hear it the loudest if I stop hard while going down a steep hill, and then it sounds like its something sliding forward.

I have almost the exact same syptoms.