Trilogy Marauder grenades motor at Bradenton

[Todd]

A friend of mine called to say a Trilogy powered Marauder appears to have grenaded his motor in some way going down the track in Bradenton a few hours ago.

Does anyone know who was running there this weekend?

And if so(if you can pin down who specifically it was), does anyone know if they have a built motor or were they running a stock short block..?

[DEFYANT]

Jerry B. is down there. I'm sure there will be a complete report on this.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=16386

[King Fubar]

I just talked to carfixer apparently it was Jerry's ride. he was running 14 lbs of boost, It wasn't pretty.

[Zack]

Look down, 10 pounds of boost.

[BlackHole]

And people wonder why I want Cobra internals. This is why 10.1 over 1 compression plus boost big problem :mad2: Its like a grenade with a pin pulled it might not happen 2 months or 2 years but it well happen. Just hope he can get it fixed without to much of a problem or money.

[merc406]

Sorry too hear that, I'm sure he knew he was on the ragged edge and wanted to see just how much abuse it would take, any 1/4 time's before she blew? :burnout:

[MikesMerc]

I just talked to carfixer apparently it was Jerry's ride. he was running 14 lbs of boost, It wasn't pretty.

There's more to it than that. Jerry's car was also set up with NOS and was making more power than anyone else here. Both Jerry. Lidio, and everyone else who knew about Jerry's plans knew this was only a matter of time. Jerry was planning for this eventuality...so no surprises or disappointments here. The motor was bone stock and in no way did anyone think it would last long with the power it was making.

[Smokie]

Jerry was planning for this eventuality...so no surprises or disappointments here. The motor was bone stock and in no way did anyone think it would last long with the power it was making.Jerry is a great guy, one of the best, and I am sorry something went wrong. But doing something to the car that you know is going to blow the motor....why ? Just to see what it looks like in pieces ? :shake:

[MikesMerc]

Jerry is a great guy, one of the best, and I am sorry something went wrong. But doing something to the car that you know is going to blow the motor....why ? Just to see what it looks like in pieces ? :shake:


You completely misunderstand what I posted. But, I'm not surprised that those with little racing expereince would understand.

No one wants to blow up thier motor. Jerry was doing nothing more than just consciously taking the car to the next level. Of course, when you step things up, you hope the motor will last as long as it can. You just can't be shocked when it expires sooner than you would have hoped.

The idea is that you rebuild the motor after it grenades. It makes little sense to spend the money building up the motor before it blows if the motor might last a while as it sits.

[Smokie]

You completely misunderstand what I posted. But, I'm not surprised that those with little racing expereince would understand. Mike you are correct, I have very little racing experience and even less money....hence my perspective. But I understand better than you realize.:)

[MI2QWK4U]

Sorry to hear about Trilogy #1. I was one of the first folks to get a ride in it when Lidio installed the Eaton, instantly changed my opinions about Superchargers. It is fact however that the #1 car was the single most abused supercharged Marauder, ever. How many people has Jerry thrown the keys to at one point or another, I doubt anyone on this forum thought twice about beating on it when Jerry let them drive it at the Marauder Meets the last couple of years. The car has lasted well up to this point. I think its premature to ASSume that it was due to too much boost, when it could have been something else. Besides, #1 was far from being an example of a "typical" Trilogy eqipped car, especially recently when Jerry wanted to push the envelope farther and try some new mods and do some research and development at the same time.

[MikesMerc]

Mike you are correct, I have very little racing experience and even less money....hence my perspective. But I understand better than you realize.:)

No offense meant by my comments:)

When you are in the hardcore racing circles its just very common to hear guys talk about the next bullet proof motor that will be going into the car after the current unit expires. Its just how its done most of the time. Not everyone here on MM.net may understand that so I wanted to make it clear.

[MikesMerc]

Sorry to hear about Trilogy #1. I was one of the first folks to get a ride in it when Lidio installed the Eaton, instantly changed my opinions about Superchargers. It is fact however that the #1 car was the single most abused supercharged Marauder, ever. How many people has Jerry thrown the keys to at one point or another, I doubt anyone on this forum thought twice about beating on it when Jerry let them drive it at the Marauder Meets the last couple of years. The car has lasted well up to this point. I think its premature to ASSume that it was due to too much boost, when it could have been something else. Besides, #1 was far from being an example of a "typical" Trilogy eqipped car, especially recently when Jerry wanted to push the envelope farther and try some new mods and do some research and development at the same time.

Hey Dave, long time no talk:)

Yep, #1 was car beaten constantly over the last few years. I think it held up great considering the constant abuse that car saw.

And you are right about #1 not being the typical Trilogy car. #2 serves that purpose now. #1 is more like Jerry's personal monster car:D

[Cobra25]

I'm sorry to here that happened to Jerry. I hope no one got hurt.

[BillyGman]

The 14 LBS of boost that Jerry was running is much more risky than the standard level of boost that the Trilogy kit comes with (which is 9.5 PSI of boost).Running 14 LBS of boost with 10:1 compression ratio is definately pushing the envelope, and narrows the margin of error much much more than running 9.5 PSI of boost does. This is precisely why I've decided to be content with getting 400 HP to the wheels, rather than having a smaller pulley installed to push that power level to 460 HP and beyond. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Jerry just recently pushed the power level to the 500 RWHP range. So that extra 100 HP will run the engine alot closer to the edge. However, I'll still be looking forward to hearing the details from Jerry.

[sailsmen]

Sorry to hear it happen. I am sure Jerry was planning on a good showing in Florida, it is a lot of logistics, time and effort.

Can't wait to hear Jerry's plan for the new motor!

[djv5150]

Sorry to hear that there was a problem.
Boldly go were know man has gone before.
Jerry make it bigger and stronger.

[MI2QWK4U]

Well, just talked to Lidio from Florida. He said that #1 Trilogy just gave up the ghost after a couple of years of the most intense abuse he has ever seen ANY 4.6 take, mustangs included. The grenading engine thing is a bit exhagerated though, heavy smoke during the run. Block looks intact though. That was one hell of a motor! Jerry should have it bronzed!

[tmac1337]

Sorry to hear about JB's car.

[MARAUDER S/C #5]

:thinker: Is there going to be a fund raiser for Jerry and his motor also ??? :hmmm:

http://mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=14756
http://mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=14863

[DEFYANT]

:thinker: Is there going to be a fund raiser for Jerry and his motor also ??? :hmmm:

http://mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=14756
http://mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=14863
WHAT? I just "donated" $6000.00 three weeks ago! You can too:D

[Tallboy]

I was there.

The motor was under 13-14 lbs. of boost. Not 10.
The motor grenaded halfway down the track.
The car was smoking and pieces of the block littered the track.
The car still ran a 12.50

Jerry and Lidio were both prepared for this, as Jerry has another crate engine ready to go in this car. He was not surprised or disappointed. He took this car to the edge on purpose, so people can see what the results can be.

[MikesMerc]

I believe that Jerry just recently pushed the power level to the 500 RWHP range

Yep...this is the real issue here. We simply have too much HP for the stock short block over several years of intense abuse.



Can't wait to hear Jerry's plan for the new motor!

Jerry and I spoke about what his plans are when something like this happended (again, no one close to Jerry is surprised by this. A bit bummed out for him, but not surprised). And let's put it this way. he plans on addressing the motor with the same enthusiasm he has addressed the rest of the car with. It'll be a monster.:D

[DEFYANT]

This is exactly what we need to hear! As a customer I want to know what not to do. Though from my mustang experiance, I know these engines cant withstand that sort of abuse (500hp).

If I am not mistaken, this is all R&D anyway...

[carfixer]

Yes, I was there and please don't misunderstand what was said.

Jerry's car did give up the ghost, but not specifically because of the high levels of boost. Jerry got this car new and the S/C was installed with zero miles on the car. It now has 41,xxx miles the odometer. A very hard 41K miles. I think I heard he is on the 7th set of tires and too many 1/4 mile runs to count, not to mention the burnouts this car has endured. Nobody he has thrown the keys to has ever just "taken a spin". Jerry won't allow it. He makes you beat on it.

Compare this to a normally driven S/C car: 1 driver, track occasionally, tires last 10-15K (exceptions noted). I would estimate Jerry's car has the equivelent of 100K miles on it, easily.

Over the winter, the car was upgraded to the max with headers, NOS and a smaller pulley but the stock long block remained. You add the above to this and you've gotta expect things are gonna let go, and he did and is ready for it.

Jerry's reaction to the engine giving it up: "you ain't racin' if you don't break occasionally" and yes, he considers this R&D.

Have no fears, Trilogy1 will be back and stronger than ever.

[FordNut]

...doing something to the car that you know is going to blow the motor....why ? Just to see what it looks like in pieces ? :shake:
One good reason is to get everything dialed in on a tired motor, then swap the goodies over to a fresh powerplant.

...I've decided to be content with getting 400 HP to the wheels, rather than having a smaller pulley installed to push that power level to 460 HP and beyond. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that Jerry just recently pushed the power level to the 500 RWHP range. So that extra 100 HP will run the engine alot closer to the edge.Yep, I know of several 4.6 stock bottom ends letting go at 450. That's why most tuners won't give you a 500 rwhp tune with a stock bottom end.

Well, just talked to Lidio from Florida. He said that #1 Trilogy just gave up the ghost after a couple of years of the most intense abuse he has ever seen ANY 4.6 take, mustangs included. The grenading engine thing is a bit exhagerated though, heavy smoke during the run. Block looks intact though. That was one hell of a motor! Jerry should have it bronzed!Ain't that the truth... I remember the MV1 burnouts and test rides. And it made many road trips after that, and countless 1/4 mile passes. Sounds like it didn't break a rod like most broken mod motors do, probably killed a piston. If so, the block and heads may still be good for a buildup with forged internals.

[Bootlegger]

Yes, I was there and please don't misunderstand what was said.

Jerry's car did give up the ghost, but not specifically because of the high levels of boost. Jerry got this car new and the S/C was installed with zero miles on the car. It now has 41,xxx miles the odometer. A very hard 41K miles. I think I heard he is on the 7th set of tires and too many 1/4 mile runs to count, not to mention the burnouts this car has endured. Nobody he has thrown the keys to has ever just "taken a spin". Jerry won't allow it. He makes you beat on it.

Compare this to a normally driven S/C car: 1 driver, track occasionally, tires last 10-15K (exceptions noted). I would estimate Jerry's car has the equivelent of 100K miles on it, easily.

Over the winter, the car was upgraded to the max with headers, NOS and a smaller pulley but the stock long block remained. You add the above to this and you've gotta expect things are gonna let go, and he did and is ready for it.

Jerry's reaction to the engine giving it up: "you ain't racin' if you don't break occasionally" and yes, he considers this R&D.

Have no fears, Trilogy1 will be back and stronger than ever.
Also, to add to Carfixers statement, Jerry wasn't spraying NOS when the engine let go.

[Todd]

Guess I will look deeper into the Fox Lake forged short block and maybe ported heads.......

I dont think I am going to go the Trilogy route but will be going forced induction. I want to go at least the 40k miles that he did if not more.

His car is basically a rolling advertisement...! Which is cool to have as part of your business. I would if I could.

[MI2QWK4U]

This is exactly what we need to hear! As a customer I want to know what not to do. Though from my mustang experiance, I know these engines cant withstand that sort of abuse (500hp).

If I am not mistaken, this is all R&D anyway...

That is it exactly, research and development, follow Jerry after this...See what he does and take notes.

[bigslim]

Sorry to hear about my buddy's car but he already had plans for something bigger in the works. I can say one thing, when I had the #1 car for a day during last years Dream Cruise I showed it no mercy. I do believe as everyone else here has said it was the most beaten supercharged car here. It is a good testiment to how much you guys want to do to your car without spending major dollars. I will say that when Trilogy #1 is put back together it will probably the baddest one here. Should be interesting when it is done and lines up next to Todd's MM.

[MARAUDER S/C #5]

Should be even better when it lines up next to Marty's ! :cool:

[BillyGman]

From what I've been told about what the Trilogy #1 car, it's been beaten to death for atleast a year and a half now. One of the board members here told me the following story about it:

"At the MaraudervilleI get together, Jerry Barnes not only raced the car at the track all day, but he repetedly threw the keys at people there telling them to go and romp on it. I was one of the passengers during one of those romps. There were four of us in the car, and we were flying down the highway. We were then pulled over by a cop on the highway....so the cop walks up to the driver's window, and he said that this was the 7th or 8th time that same day that he saw this Black car doing 100+MPH down this same stretch of highway, and if he sees this car there one more time, he's going to put all of us in jail!"

I'll never forget that story.

[maraudernkc]

Jerry, I admire you pushing the envenlope of Marauder performance.

You have at least 60 Super charger kits out there with no problems.

When you surpass the limit anything can happen.

I appreceite the fact that you have the courage to go where no Marauder has gone before.

Now you will most likely have all the forged goodies and the real fun will begin!


Maraudernkc

[sailsmen]

Per Lidio;
"Any way to rap it all up. Jerry car on our Dyno-Jet Dyno with the new Kooks headers and a full 2.5” exhaust has now produced 462-RWHP and 469-RWTQ. This is on 93 octane with the stock throttle body. A couple of other MM’s with the same exact combo will make 470 to 480 RWHP when the have the large oval T/B we some times use.

Then when we used the shot of NOS on Jerry’s car with 100 unleaded in the tank…. The RWHP jumped to about 530!!. I say “about” because theirs a little spike at the end of the pull. And the RWTQ jumped to a max of 575ft lbs !! Not to shabby.

Jerry’s number – 1 Marauder now has just over 40K on the ODO since the Trilogy blower went on. So far the motor still sounds and feels like new. This car is not lucky. Its living proof that with a safe tune, these modern 4.6L’s with their non forged pistons can live for quite some time with even 10-12psi of boost. Not just the stock 9.5psi of a Trilogy kit. Its hard to say how much longer Jerry’s T - 1 will live at the level of power its going to now make especially with the NOS. My own has now gone about 18-19K with the blower and the NOS and lots of mostly high 11 second passes and several very mid 11 second passes. And its gona get it just as hard the 05 season when my Mach-1 is resting."

[MikesMerc]

Per Lidio;
"Any way to rap it all up. Jerry car on our Dyno-Jet Dyno with the new Kooks headers and a full 2.5” exhaust has now produced 462-RWHP and 469-RWTQ. This is on 93 octane with the stock throttle body. A couple of other MM’s with the same exact combo will make 470 to 480 RWHP when the have the large oval T/B we some times use.

Jerry’s number – 1 Marauder now has just over 40K on the ODO since the Trilogy blower went on. So far the motor still sounds and feels like new. This car is not lucky. Its living proof that with a safe tune, these modern 4.6L’s with their non forged pistons can live for quite some time with even 10-12psi of boost. Not just the stock 9.5psi of a Trilogy kit.

Jerry was running race gas and race tune when it let go. So you can add another 40 RWHP to his numbers. That put him OVER 500 RWHP without NOS at the track:)

[TechHeavy]

Jerry, I'm sorry to hear about Trilogy #1 my friend. But I think the sentiment is correct here in that we members are probably more sorry about this than you are. I imagine the grin on your face as you are already working out the details of the new "goodies" like a kid in a candyshop!
The upgrades you and Lidio have done to that car, and the fast and accurate reports of the productivity of those upgrades are what led me to Trilogy in the first place. I would much rather have a performance company representative who isn't afraid to take these chances, (and report the outcome) than some nickle-and-dime outfit who may only tell me, "We're not sure what will happen to your car if you do that....":dunno:

Jerry, thanks again for all your hard work to help us make our cars all they can be! This community has been served once again with your experiences.

[MARAUDER S/C #5]

Ditto, well said. :up:

[RoyLPita]

I was there.

The motor was under 13-14 lbs. of boost. Not 10.
The motor grenaded halfway down the track.
The car was smoking and pieces of the block littered the track.
The car still ran a 12.50

Jerry and Lidio were both prepared for this, as Jerry has another crate engine ready to go in this car. He was not surprised or disappointed. He took this car to the edge on purpose, so people can see what the results can be.

What he said. BTW, I was there, too.

[cyled]

Now you know why Mecury sent these out without a supercharger, only 310 Horsepower and a high stall converter. Warranty, Warranty, Warranty. They did not want to be replacing engines under warranty.

The fact that car lasted as long as it did with almost 500 HP pushing through it is amazing. I am amazed that it lasted over 40,000 miles through all the mods and "test" drives. It does show that the engines are built farily well from the factory, but to think you can take a stock block and push almost an extra 200 ponies (abused ponies that is) without modification is crazy.

Too bad it blew, but Jerry knew what he was doing. It is great there are guys out there that are willing to sacrifice for the R&D. It only makes him that more knowledgeable when doing mods for people. I believe he has proven to us that careful planning when trying to push the envelope is very important.

[Smokie]

I don't think he meant Jerry was running 10 lbs of boost.





Zack:

Look down, 10 pounds of boost.
<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->__________________
- 476 rwhp 423rwtq
Vortech S/C 10lbs Boost
11.62 @ 116.88

[BillyGman]

I don't think he meant Jerry was running 10 lbs of boost.





Zack:

Look down, 10 pounds of boost.
<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->__________________
- 476 rwhp 423rwtq
Vortech S/C 10lbs Boost
11.62 @ 116.88

Yeah, he could've meant to reduce the boost next time to 10 LBS, but I guess that because his statement was so brief, and vague, there's no way of knowing that.

[RoyLPita]

From what I've been told about what the Trilogy #1 car, it's been beaten to death for atleast a year and a half now. One of the board members here told me the following story about it:

"At the MaraudervilleI get together, Jerry Barnes not only raced the car at the track all day, but he repetedly threw the keys at people there telling them to go and romp on it. I was one of the passengers during one of those romps. There were four of us in the car, and we were flying down the highway. We were then pulled over by a cop on the highway....so the cop walks up to the driver's window, and he said that this was the 7th or 8th time that same day that he saw this Black car doing 100+MPH down this same stretch of highway, and if he sees this car there one more time, he's going to put all of us in jail!"

I'll never forget that story.



This is a good story. I wish that I was a "fly on the wall" when that was going down.

[BillyGman]

This is a good story. I wish that I was a "fly on the wall" when that was going down. Yep, John (aka "Jet") told me that when I saw him at the drag strip, and at a later date, another board member who was there at the time also confirmed the story.

[RoyLPita]

Which car magazine would have something to say about this???? Any thoughts?

[MarauderTJA]

Look down, 10 pounds of boost.
Those are impressive numbers with 10 lbs of boost. You must be using a forged bottom end, right?

[Tallboy]

Those are impressive numbers with 10 lbs of boost. You must be using a forged bottom end, right?
Trilogy1 was under 14lbs. of boost and had been for a while.

[MarauderTJA]

No offense meant by my comments:)

When you are in the hardcore racing circles its just very common to hear guys talk about the next bullet proof motor that will be going into the car after the current unit expires. Its just how its done most of the time. Not everyone here on MM.net may understand that so I wanted to make it clear.Mike, I think you will agree, that there is no such thing as a true destructive proof bullet motor. Period. Those that have been involved in extensive drag racing can testify that even motors built to take extreme power can and will break...That is the nature of the beast. Those at the recent NMRA Spring Break shootout will agree. How many RACE cars blew motors this past weekend? Several. You have to tune a motor, forged or not, to be within as safe a limit as you can for it's intended use within "reasonable power." Just because a motor can dyno out at 450 RWHP, making it safer at 420 RWHP it will last far longer. And lets face it guys, it also has to do with how much and often you want to get into it.....

[Captain Steve]

blah blah blah... 10 pounds of boost ... blah blah blah Guys, Zack runs 10 psi of boost.. it's in his signature.

He also makes about 475 rwhp with that setup. Which is close to what the #1 car was making with 14psi.

[MikesMerc]

Guys, Zack runs 10 psi of boost.. it's in his signature.

He also makes about 475 rwhp with that setup. Which is close to what the #1 car was making with 14psi.

LOL....ummm....yeah whatever.

[MikesMerc]

Mike, I think you will agree, that there is no such thing as a true destructive proof bullet motor. Period.

You missed my point and took the comment out of context completely.

What I was explaining is that it is not uncommon for those big into racing to blow up a motor. Its just part of the hobby. And that guys like to talk about "the next motor" that's going to go into the car when the current one blows up. Typical bench racing stuff.

[Lidio]

I kinda didn’t want to get to involved or involved at all in this thread but I feel compelled to clear the air or help out some what. And make a couple of points that a few of you guys are not gona like. First off Jerry Barns was not running 100 unleaded race fuel when it let go. It only had 93 octane in it. The weekend earlier in Orlando FFW he did run a little 100 unleaded an the car ran some 12.00’s and an 11.9 some thing with the 93 tune in the computer still, which is great for that car for starters after adding Kooks this past December. But he ran it out and only put 93 back in it for the Bradenton race.

Jerry has not NOS’d the car at all out side of the dyno a couple of months ago. I didn’t want him to spray the car at the track until I was present and in the car with some monitoring equipment. With pure 100 unleaded and the appropriate tune it should go faster then mine with out the NOS and also faster then mine with the NOS. We were hoping for 11.60’s w/o and 11.20-11.30’s with the NOS.

Jerry’s may have let go (blown up) because of how long its been beaten or because the tune could have been to aggressive ( I wont deny that) maybe he got some crappy pump fuel? It happens. We all know what we’re getting our selves into at the level of power and boost he, myself and several others that are at that level and more. It must be remembered that we’re pushing these couple of MM’s a lot more then the normal 9psi kit that with its included tune runs excellent and have no problems with durability. This case should not worry potential interest in a future blower purchases be it a Trilogy or some thing else.

One thing about the whole boost thing that has to be understood is that even though we roots guys say we’re at 14psi, that’s only in the mid range. Our roots blowers boost and air flow starts to fall off as the revs get higher and higher.

Jerry’s and several other I’ve done at 14psi make that only in the mid range, then the boost will fall off as much as 2-4psi by the time they get to 6400rpm. I don’t have mine and Jerry’s boost curves in front of me but they do drop off to about 11.5 to 12psi at the end of the pull. And the roots just plain become less efficient at the real high revs. This is where centrifugals “come on”. The centrifugals do and will make more steam up top with out a doubt, but they are dead down low, very dead. This is why for a centrifugal equipped MM they require a loose converter to get them going at a dead stop. This is why the centrifugals pretty much have to have a 4.10 or better in the axle. And this is why the centrifugals require exhaust work to run there best where their at their best…. The higher rpms.

This is why a Trilogy equipped MM with only the stock Trilogy and absolutely nothing else done to the car will run in good conditions and traction very, very low 13’s in the qtr mile and potentially even 12.90’s. Notice how I said “WILL “”RUN”” VERY LOW 13’s IN THE ¼ MILE”. Not what it will peak at on a chassis dyno. The Trilogy guys know the difference between what makes a car feel good and run good, not just a big peak number at the rear wheels which is what most centrifugals only have to brag about. I know the centrifugal guys don’t want to hear this and of course and we all have our creative ways of defending our causes and beliefs. But I’m gona say what needs to be said. What does a centrifugal equipped MM run in the qtr mile with only the bower added and its related components. And at a boost level that’s some what common and livable like 8-10psi. The different blowers have been out for a couple of years now for the MM’s and maybe I’m wrong but I don’t think a centrifugal equipped with only the blower and no other peripherals has ever posted what it can do? Sorry, I haven’t seen one lately. I know several MM’s with Trilogy’s are quite glad and open to posting what they run totally stock other then the Trilogy.

What does a MM with only Centrifugal run in the qtr mile, what does it zero to sixty MPH?? Big peak dyno numbers are not every thing. Actually moving the 4400lbs is the real deal.

I’ll start it. Jerry’s number one MM in May of 2003 at Columbus on a 55-degree morning during an NMRA race ran 12.95 in the qtr with only the Trilogy blower kit. Even the stock tires in the rear. We did it with the same kit then that Trilogy puts in a box today. Trust me… the 6K they get for that kit and the net results cant even begin to be compared to any thing else.

[MI2QWK4U]

Well said Lidio. Think what you may, Lid knows what he is talking about and in the 16 years i have known him, he calls it the way it is, refreshing thought.

This is from a post when Jerry had me run his car at the strip, bone stock on stock tires and rims:
11-09-2003, 08:23 PM
MI2QWK4U
Contributing Member
Member #: 252
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Motor City
Posts: 1,574
Photos: 155


Almost Beat Lidio's Time in Trilogy #1!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I didn't realize until I got back from Lapeer today, I tied Lidio for the best time in Trilogy One! Nice sunny 42 Degree day at Lapeer dragway today, I made 16 runs with Jerry's #1 car. After settling in and getting used to launching with the street tires, the car ran consitantly in the mid 12 second range.
Best runs were:
12.421 @ 110.62 1.89 60 ft time
12.443 @ 109.98 1.90 60 ft time
12.461 @ 111.02 1.91 60 ft time
12.484 @ 109.96 1.94 60 ft time
12.567 @ 110.19 2.03 60 ft time

These runs were on the stock size rims/BFG tires. Jerry had ordered new Nitto Drag radials, but they didnt come in Friday, so stock tires was the result. The cold air really affected this car, once the car launched and hooked up, it was off to the races. The car ran the best I have driven, or seen it run. I can tell you what a difference the 4:10's and the extra pound of boost made over my car. I think the best I have run in my #2 car was 12.98 @ 108.86 MPH. With the weather as cool as it was, if I had the Nittos, Lidio feels like this car would have been down to the low 12.3X's times. I agree!
__________________

Link to actual thread from above excerpt (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=6057)


As for the #2 car of mine, I made a run at 12.98 @108mph on stock tires with only the blower kit installed...if I recall, it was one of only a couple of trips before I felt comfortable with handling the car with the new power to actually add more mods that went from the 9lbs boost and 387 rwhp to 14lbs boost and 465 rphp.

[stevengerard]

What does a MM with only Centrifugal run in the qtr mile, what does it zero to sixty MPH?? Big peak dyno numbers are not every thing. Actually moving the 4400lbs is the real deal.

I have Vortec on a stock car. I'd love to be able to disagree with you but I can't even push it half way the tune is so bad. So I'd bet my 1/4 mile time is close to 14.5 right now. Once I have you tune it maybe for the heck of it we can try a run before the TC and the Kooks go on. For whatever its worth I'm sure you are right on the money, yet there are some guys like me that don't mind adding the other items necessary for a centriifugal. Heck if it was only about what was best bang for the buck we'd have all Vette's on the road and no Porche's

[Rider90]

Well said Lidio. Well said.

[BillyGman]

I think that what Lidio has stated, pretty much sums it up. And I also think that people should keep in mind that Lidio has installed plenty of centrifugal superchargers on 4.6L engine equipped Mustangs, so it isn't like he doesn't have any experience tuning, and driving centrifugal equipped cars.

[MarauderTJA]

I kinda didn’t want to get to involved or involved at all in this thread but I feel compelled to clear the air or help out some what. And make a couple of points that a few of you guys are not gona like. First off Jerry Barns was not running 100 unleaded race fuel when it let go. It only had 93 octane in it. The weekend earlier in Orlando FFW he did run a little 100 unleaded an the car ran some 12.00’s and an 11.9 some thing with the 93 tune in the computer still, which is great for that car for starters after adding Kooks this past December. But he ran it out and only put 93 back in it for the Bradenton race.

Jerry has not NOS’d the car at all out side of the dyno a couple of months ago. I didn’t want him to spray the car at the track until I was present and in the car with some monitoring equipment. With pure 100 unleaded and the appropriate tune it should go faster then mine with out the NOS and also faster then mine with the NOS. We were hoping for 11.60’s w/o and 11.20-11.30’s with the NOS.

Jerry’s may have let go (blown up) because of how long its been beaten or because the tune could have been to aggressive ( I wont deny that) maybe he got some crappy pump fuel? It happens. We all know what we’re getting our selves into at the level of power and boost he, myself and several others that are at that level and more. It must be remembered that we’re pushing these couple of MM’s a lot more then the normal 9psi kit that with its included tune runs excellent and have no problems with durability. This case should not worry potential interest in a future blower purchases be it a Trilogy or some thing else.

One thing about the whole boost thing that has to be understood is that even though we roots guys say we’re at 14psi, that’s only in the mid range. Our roots blowers boost and air flow starts to fall off as the revs get higher and higher.

Jerry’s and several other I’ve done at 14psi make that only in the mid range, then the boost will fall off as much as 2-4psi by the time they get to 6400rpm. I don’t have mine and Jerry’s boost curves in front of me but they do drop off to about 11.5 to 12psi at the end of the pull. And the roots just plain become less efficient at the real high revs. This is where centrifugals “come on”. The centrifugals do and will make more steam up top with out a doubt, but they are dead down low, very dead. This is why for a centrifugal equipped MM they require a loose converter to get them going at a dead stop. This is why the centrifugals pretty much have to have a 4.10 or better in the axle. And this is why the centrifugals require exhaust work to run there best where their at their best…. The higher rpms.

This is why a Trilogy equipped MM with only the stock Trilogy and absolutely nothing else done to the car will run in good conditions and traction very, very low 13’s in the qtr mile and potentially even 12.90’s. Notice how I said “WILL “”RUN”” VERY LOW 13’s IN THE ¼ MILE”. Not what it will peak at on a chassis dyno. The Trilogy guys know the difference between what makes a car feel good and run good, not just a big peak number at the rear wheels which is what most centrifugals only have to brag about. I know the centrifugal guys don’t want to hear this and of course and we all have our creative ways of defending our causes and beliefs. But I’m gona say what needs to be said. What does a centrifugal equipped MM run in the qtr mile with only the bower added and its related components. And at a boost level that’s some what common and livable like 8-10psi. The different blowers have been out for a couple of years now for the MM’s and maybe I’m wrong but I don’t think a centrifugal equipped with only the blower and no other peripherals has ever posted what it can do? Sorry, I haven’t seen one lately. I know several MM’s with Trilogy’s are quite glad and open to posting what they run totally stock other then the Trilogy.

What does a MM with only Centrifugal run in the qtr mile, what does it zero to sixty MPH?? Big peak dyno numbers are not every thing. Actually moving the 4400lbs is the real deal.

I’ll start it. Jerry’s number one MM in May of 2003 at Columbus on a 55-degree morning during an NMRA race ran 12.95 in the qtr with only the Trilogy blower kit. Even the stock tires in the rear. We did it with the same kit then that Trilogy puts in a box today. Trust me… the 6K they get for that kit and the net results cant even begin to be compared to any thing else.
You are right on Lidio in your comparison in roots vrs centrifugals superchargers. It really is a matter of choice, experience and needs. This post is not intended to start Supercharger wars. What I admire about this web site is the great information we all exchange. We all love our Marauders whether they are bone stock, NOS equiped, Trilogy, Procharger or Votech equiped. Everyone has opinioins on their personal choices for power adders and defend them. For a person who wants great power and performance with no hassels, without question Trilogy is one way to go. But don't overlook the Procharger kit either. It is all what you are lookng for in a performance car. Day to day driveablility is far better with a Procharger. For those, like myself who want to have the capability to go a step further down the road, the new Procharger Kit was my choice (Kit#2) and it is being "safely tuned" as of this post. I enjoy my car everyday. When I start to get bored with the power, I will put a forged bottom end in the car and step up the blower to a D1SC, go with Kooks exhaust, tranny work, axles etc. I like the flexibility that a centrifugal superchartger allows. Again, this is "my opinion and my choice."

I have had a Procharger w/3 core intercooler in my 01 GT Mustang for 4 years. No problems and I like the driveability. Being familar with the Procharger, when the Greg came out with his kit and I was in the market to supercharge my Marauder, I started my research. I will admit that I knew there were going to be some issues down the road, but Greg has resolved them with CarFixer's, TMAC and my consistant input. My Marauder is my company car that I have already taken on a 5K trip from Florida to Mass, NY, PA, OH, KY and home. Prior to getting my Marauder I took my Mustang on trips occasionally for business. My mileage on the highway was virtually unchanged and averaged 23 MPG. I drove up to Bradenton and back to Cape Coral this past Sunday with my Procharger equipped Marauder with a base tune on the car and got 21 MPG. Pretty impressive. Virtually no difference in gas mileage at all before and after installation of the Procharger Kit.

My Marauder has stock transmission, converter and exhaust, except for Flowmaster Super 40's. After the final tune I'll post the dyno graph. And Lidio is right, RWHP ratings really do not mean much of anything. Big HP numbers do not mean low numbers on the track. When I take it to the track, I will post my numbers on my Marauder Procharger Kit. In the meantime, what really counts is who hits the beams at the 1320 first..

It all boils down to personal choices. We have choices in Superchargers for our Marauders which I think it great. Let's all keep up the professionalism we have exhibited on Mercury Marauder .net and show that our group just plain love our cars, like no other group in the car enthusiast world....

[tmac1337]

It is no secret that a roots type blower makes it's power down low and the Centrifigals perform best in the mid to high RPM ranges.

But very dead down low, I don' think so! And I am not even going to compare my car against what was just said, because I have had 4:10 gears, a PI 3000 Stall TQ converter, and modified exhaust for well over a year before I installed a Procharger Kit.

But I hardly think it is a necessity that a car equipped with a Centrifigal "must" have a modified exhaust to perform well in the high range, or need a loose converter to get off the line. With all my previous mods my car would not burn up any rubber or would barely even turn a tire until I just installed the Procharger kit. So now that it does do so, the only difference is the Procharger kit.

But, we do have a car in FL equipped with a Procharger kit that has no exhaust, no TQ converter, and is a stock car.

The tuning on that car should be done today or tomorrow.

Let's say we just wait for some honest track times and those results will speak for themselves.

As for why Centrifigal equipped bone stock cars have not been posting, I can only speak for the Procharger Kits. There is mine, which I have been very open about detailing it's performance, and now Tom's stock car which he can provide some more data also. Let's not forget the kit just arrived on the scene.

If a Procharger car went head to head with a Trilogy at the track, I do admit the Trilogy would take off quicker, but watch out the Procharger car would start coming on strong and the first one to the finish line is only conjecture at this point.

If Tom wants to offer up his car head to head against another stock Trilogy at Bradenton soon, that's up to him.

I know I would love to see it!

Until then I'll go back to my new resolution of not bad mouthing other cars on line.

[sailsmen]

I think it is % that we have N/A cars running 13.2 to 13.7.

We have S/C running from 11.4 to 13.3.

We have 60' times from 1.608 (S/C) to 1.966 (N/A).

I also think it is amazing that my N/A car on KDW2 can run a 1.966 60'.

The timeslip page provides good information.

[bigslim]

It is no secret that a roots type blower makes it's power down low and the Centrifigals perform best in the mid to high RPM ranges.

But very dead down low, I don' think so! And I am not even going to compare my car against what was just said, because I have had 4:10 gears, a PI 3000 Stall TQ converter, and modified exhaust for well over a year before I installed a Procharger Kit.

But I hardly think it is a necessity that a car equipped with a Centrifigal "must" have a modified exhaust to perform well in the high range, or need a loose converter to get off the line. With all my previous mods my car would not burn up any rubber or would barely even turn a tire until I just installed the Procharger kit. So now that it does do so, the only difference is the Procharger kit.

But, we do have a car in FL equipped with a Procharger kit that has no exhaust, no TQ converter, and is a stock car.

The tuning on that car should be done today or tomorrow.

Let's say we just wait for some honest track times and those results will speak for themselves.

As for why Centrifigal equipped bone stock cars have not been posting, I can only speak for the Procharger Kits. There is mine, which I have been very open about detailing it's performance, and now Tom's stock car which he can provide some more data also. Let's not forget the kit just arrived on the scene.

If a Procharger car went head to head with a Trilogy at the track, I do admit the Trilogy would take off quicker, but watch out the Procharger car would start coming on strong and the first one to the finish line is only conjecture at this point.

If Tom wants to offer up his car head to head against another stock Trilogy at Bradenton soon, that's up to him.

I know I would love to see it!

Until then I'll go back to my new resolution of not bad mouthing other cars on line.
Bigger, heavier cars need a little help getting off the line. This is why the loose converter is needed. A lighter Mustang has no problem getting out of the hole so one is not needed. Our cars are not the quickest of the line so it needs the TQ to get it moving. Once off the line the centrifical blower will take over in the midrange. You really can't say what your car would be like as you stated earlier because you have already done these mods. You said now your car burns rubber, that is because of the TQ and 410's helping your blower. My car with just a chip and 410's leaves rubber. I don't know what to say about yours.

[tmac1337]

Bigger, heavier cars need a little help getting off the line. This is why the loose converter is needed. A lighter Mustang has no problem getting out of the hole so one is not needed. Our cars are not the quickest of the line so it needs the TQ to get it moving. Once off the line the centrifical blower will take over in the midrange. You really can't say what your car would be like as you stated earlier because you have already done these mods. You said now your car burns rubber, that is because of the TQ and 410's helping your blower. My car with just a chip and 410's leaves rubber. I don't know what to say about yours.

How about this....enough talk by everyone.

Tom has agreed to go head to head with his stock car equipped with a Procharger against any stock Trilogy car in South Fl at Bradenton Speedway.

Let the numbers speak for themselves!

The Trilogy should be running the stock pulley that produces 9.5 PSI with no other mods.

Who is going to step up and face off with Tom at Bradenton?

[TechHeavy]

How about this....enough talk by everyone.

Tom has agreed to go head to head with his stock car equipped with a Procharger against any stock Trilogy car in South Fl at Bradenton Speedway.

Let the numbers speak for themselves!

Who is going to step up and face off with Tom at Bradenton?
Man, I'd LOVE to be in Florida right now, but there's no way I can do it! Come on Troop Trilogy! It's a challenge! :D :banana2:

[MI2QWK4U]

How about this....enough talk by everyone.

Tom has agreed to go head to head with his stock car equipped with a Procharger against any stock Trilogy car in South Fl at Bradenton Speedway.

Let the numbers speak for themselves!

The Trilogy should be running the stock pulley that produces 9.5 PSI with no other mods.

Who is going to step up and face off with Tom at Bradenton?

We already know what a Marauder with an Eaton Trilogy kit will run with everything else being bone stock, read a few posts back. Its a matter of public record. If he wants to post his results in this thread, so be it.
And as for another mistaken fact, just because the eaton starts to level off, or even begin to fall off towards the very end of a run, really doesnt allow for much catching up. In fact, some of the centrifigal cars I have beat, I actually was sleeping at the light and ran them down and beat them.
This isnt meant to bash anyones setup, only state the facts. As Lidio pointed out, with the big car, the eaton alone is enough to make any owner very happy, with no other mods needed. The Centrifigals feel good, but really come alive and feel much better when you add things like the stall and rear end. To each their own....any way you slice it, whatever you go with makes the car a rocket. I think everyone can agree with that.

Please ask Tom to post his times when he runs.

[maraudernkc]

Lidio, thank you for the Information on how a centrifical MM runs or does not run.

We have two MM in Florida that have our Procharger kits. One of them has 4:10 Gears and some aftermarket mufllers. It has the stock converter and the rest of the exhaust is stock.

We would like to run this MM Procharger with a MM Trilogy car that has about the same mods.

We want to run 93 octane, factory tires and the cars must be at operating tempatures when they run down the track.

I am quite sure that the Procharger car will not have any problems competing with the Trilogy car.

I have no problems with the Trilogy cars but if you must keep bringing up the whole roots vs. centrifical deal on a 4400 lb. car than let's just take care of business at the track with spectators there to see all.

Maraudernkc


I kinda didn’t want to get to involved or involved at all in this thread but I feel compelled to clear the air or help out some what. And make a couple of points that a few of you guys are not gona like. First off Jerry Barns was not running 100 unleaded race fuel when it let go. It only had 93 octane in it. The weekend earlier in Orlando FFW he did run a little 100 unleaded an the car ran some 12.00’s and an 11.9 some thing with the 93 tune in the computer still, which is great for that car for starters after adding Kooks this past December. But he ran it out and only put 93 back in it for the Bradenton race.

Jerry has not NOS’d the car at all out side of the dyno a couple of months ago. I didn’t want him to spray the car at the track until I was present and in the car with some monitoring equipment. With pure 100 unleaded and the appropriate tune it should go faster then mine with out the NOS and also faster then mine with the NOS. We were hoping for 11.60’s w/o and 11.20-11.30’s with the NOS.

Jerry’s may have let go (blown up) because of how long its been beaten or because the tune could have been to aggressive ( I wont deny that) maybe he got some crappy pump fuel? It happens. We all know what we’re getting our selves into at the level of power and boost he, myself and several others that are at that level and more. It must be remembered that we’re pushing these couple of MM’s a lot more then the normal 9psi kit that with its included tune runs excellent and have no problems with durability. This case should not worry potential interest in a future blower purchases be it a Trilogy or some thing else.

One thing about the whole boost thing that has to be understood is that even though we roots guys say we’re at 14psi, that’s only in the mid range. Our roots blowers boost and air flow starts to fall off as the revs get higher and higher.

Jerry’s and several other I’ve done at 14psi make that only in the mid range, then the boost will fall off as much as 2-4psi by the time they get to 6400rpm. I don’t have mine and Jerry’s boost curves in front of me but they do drop off to about 11.5 to 12psi at the end of the pull. And the roots just plain become less efficient at the real high revs. This is where centrifugals “come on”. The centrifugals do and will make more steam up top with out a doubt, but they are dead down low, very dead. This is why for a centrifugal equipped MM they require a loose converter to get them going at a dead stop. This is why the centrifugals pretty much have to have a 4.10 or better in the axle. And this is why the centrifugals require exhaust work to run there best where their at their best…. The higher rpms.

This is why a Trilogy equipped MM with only the stock Trilogy and absolutely nothing else done to the car will run in good conditions and traction very, very low 13’s in the qtr mile and potentially even 12.90’s. Notice how I said “WILL “”RUN”” VERY LOW 13’s IN THE ¼ MILE”. Not what it will peak at on a chassis dyno. The Trilogy guys know the difference between what makes a car feel good and run good, not just a big peak number at the rear wheels which is what most centrifugals only have to brag about. I know the centrifugal guys don’t want to hear this and of course and we all have our creative ways of defending our causes and beliefs. But I’m gona say what needs to be said. What does a centrifugal equipped MM run in the qtr mile with only the bower added and its related components. And at a boost level that’s some what common and livable like 8-10psi. The different blowers have been out for a couple of years now for the MM’s and maybe I’m wrong but I don’t think a centrifugal equipped with only the blower and no other peripherals has ever posted what it can do? Sorry, I haven’t seen one lately. I know several MM’s with Trilogy’s are quite glad and open to posting what they run totally stock other then the Trilogy.

What does a MM with only Centrifugal run in the qtr mile, what does it zero to sixty MPH?? Big peak dyno numbers are not every thing. Actually moving the 4400lbs is the real deal.

I’ll start it. Jerry’s number one MM in May of 2003 at Columbus on a 55-degree morning during an NMRA race ran 12.95 in the qtr with only the Trilogy blower kit. Even the stock tires in the rear. We did it with the same kit then that Trilogy puts in a box today. Trust me… the 6K they get for that kit and the net results cant even begin to be compared to any thing else.

[MarauderTJA]

We already know what a Marauder with an Eaton Trilogy kit will run with everything else being bone stock, read a few posts back. Its a matter of public record. If he wants to post his results in this thread, so be it.
And as for another mistaken fact, just because the eaton starts to level off, or even begin to fall off towards the very end of a run, really doesnt allow for much catching up. In fact, some of the centrifigal cars I have beat, I actually was sleeping at the light and ran them down and beat them.
This isnt meant to bash anyones setup, only state the facts. As Lidio pointed out, with the big car, the eaton alone is enough to make any owner very happy, with no other mods needed. The Centrifigals feel good, but really come alive and feel much better when you add things like the stall and rear end. To each their own....any way you slice it, whatever you go with makes the car a rocket. I think everyone can agree with that.

Please ask Tom to post his times when he runs.Your right in making a car a rocket. The Trilogy Kit is a tried and proven kit. No one is arguing that point. But come on guys, give us Procharger guys a chance. Power is power, whether down low at mid-range or the top end. It is all choice. Choice is good. That is what makes all this interesting. I love a centrifigal blower. I have had them in three of my cars. I wanted one in my Marauder and I have it. It will be great, fast and smoke most anything on the road. The bottom line, it is a Mercuary Marauder.... That is all that counts...

[sailsmen]

The only way to know is to run 2 cars side by side at the track and compare the ET.

Weather and track conditions can account for .7 in the 1/4.

Look at the time slip page there is some interesting information there.

[maraudernkc]

Sailsmen, You are exactly right and that is why I say run the Trilogy and the Procharger cars at the same time with the same mods. We will make this happen. :burnout:


The only way to know is to run 2 cars side by side at the track and compare the ET.

Weather and track conditions can account for .7 in the 1/4.

Look at the time slip page there is some interesting information there.

[MikesMerc]

Yes, the time slip page has good info. Look at the top 10 performers. How many centrifugal blowers vs roots kits are there? Both the Vortech and Trilogy kits have been out long enough to see the pattern emerge. Its pretty obvious.

And, frankly, I discount anyone who doesn't post a timeslip. As far as I'm concerned those times are not legit. Just my opinion, but it doesn't effect which blower cars dominate the timeslip page anyway.


MarauderTJA,

I have also owned several centrifugal blown cars as well. It is what I learned with those cars that lead me to go roots style for the marauder. Frankly, I am shocked to hear that anyone with hands on experience with a centrifugal would actually choose a centrifugal blower for the 4200lb marauder. That choice is absolutely contrary to supercharger 101. Its basic knowledge that the heavier the car, the more the roots style blower makes the better fit. I won't argue the point. Pick up any decent reading material on superchargers, or talk to the pros at the track, and they will tell you the same thing.


Day to day driveablility is far better with a Procharger
This comment alone reeks of fanboy-ism. What is your basis for this comment? Have you driven a Trilogy car day to day? Do you have some comparison data on day to day driveability of the Trilogy versus Procharger kit?

What is so funny about this comment is that it runs contrary to the Trilogy's primary stength...and that is street performance. The fact the the centrifugal blowers make thier power up top, and that the roots make it down low points to obvious conclusions. I don't want to be having to run my motor above 4000rpm to feel the power come on. Most street driving is done in the low rpm range where the roots makes it power. That's why the roots s known to make that "big block" feeling. The same cannot be said for centrifugal blowers.

Last point and I'm off this silly thread. Lidio has installed more blowers than anyone we know. He was one of the FIRST Vortech installation centers in the country 10+ years ago. The guy sells ALOT of centrifugal blowers. He sells far more centrifugal blowers than Trilogy kits. So, when you have someone who can sell you what you need, who understands and has experience with all of the options, who gains nothing from installing one blower over another becuase he sells both, and his primary concern is to do you right so you come back for more....its pretty hard to ignore that kind of expert advice.

Pick what SC floats your boat. They are all fun. They are all good choices.

[tmac1337]

There Can Be Only One!

Enough Talk

Head To Head: Procharger Vs Trilogy

Who Is Going Take The Challenge?

I Thought That Multiple People Would Be Jumping At The Chance From All The Posts I Have Read Over A 2 Year Period.

[Hack Goby]

Well I dont know how soon that will happen but remember that the friday During MaraudervilleIII we have Milan Dragway rented and we will be doing it just like last year so somethime during elimanations it would have to happan.

[tmac1337]

Well I dont know how soon that will happen but remember that the friday During MaraudervilleIII we have Milan Dragway rented and we will be doing it just like last year so somethime during elimanations it would have to happan.

There are a few Trilogy kits installed on Marauders here in FL already...stock Marauders otherwise.

[MI2QWK4U]

There Can Be Only One!

Enough Talk

Head To Head: Procharger Vs Trilogy

Who Is Going Take The Challenge?

I Thought That Multiple People Would Be Jumping At The Chance From All The Posts I Have Read Over A 2 Year Period.


Bring it on...bring your best. I thought the time slip page would speak for itself, but you wont let it go...thats cool. My best time is 12.01 at 114 mph, do you have a time slip yet? I will be totally honest, the only car besides another Trilogy car I even consider a remote challange would be Zack's. I will run you....like I said...bring your best.

[MikesMerc]

There Can Be Only One!

Enough Talk

Head To Head: Procharger Vs Trilogy

Who Is Going Take The Challenge?


LOL...and this comes from a guy who hasn't even had his car to the track yet:D

There's plenty of data floating in this forum to draw a conclusion. When you finally get your car to the track and post some numbers that might be competitve, let me know.

[CRUZTAKER]

Cool!!!

If I promise to only give my baby a leeetle shot of the gas....can I play too?:D

[MikesMerc]

Cool!!!

If I promise to only give my baby a leeetle shot of the gas....can I play too?:D


Absolutely! MM Smackdown!

[tmac1337]

LOL...and this comes from a guy who hasn't even had his car to the track yet:D

There's plenty of data floating in this forum to draw a conclusion. When you finally get your car to the track and post some numbers that might be competitve, let me know.

More Talk......get one of your pals to step up!

[Hack Goby]

Marauders at Milan 2005

[MI2QWK4U]

Dave's Top Ten List of Supercharged Marauders from MM.Net Timeslip Page!


1 Lidio S/C + Nitrous 472.0 1.680 7.351@94.74 11.470@121.32
2 Zack S/C 476.0 1.608 7.385@91.67 11.627@116.88
3 BillyGman S/C 400.0 1.650 7.656@89.70 12.007@114.25
4 MI2QWK4U S/C 460.0 1.810 7.674@91.44 12.010@114.66
5 JET S/C 460.0 1.879 7.772@91.88 12.028@117.01
6 MikesMerc S/C 448.0 1.876 7.820@90.19 12.153@114.23
7 MarauderMark S/C 426.1 1.832 7.804@89.71 12.187@112.94
8 Nathan S/C 365.0 1.904 8.203@86.95 12.745@108.65
9 BUCKWHEAT S/C 425.0 1.948 8.353@84.00 13.025@106.53
10 Tallboy S/C 389.0 1.921 8.471@84.19 13.134@104.31


Of the top ten......
8 are Eaton Roots Blower Cars
2 are Vortech Centrifugal Blower Cars

Looks like 80% to me...pretty good odds for spending your hard earned Money!

[maraudernkc]

Two cars
Two Blowers
One Centrifical
One Roots
One 1/4 Mile track
One winner

[MI2QWK4U]

More Talk......get one of your pals to step up!


I let my timeslips and Marauder do the talking! Not my azz!
When your car is in the ballpark with mine, maybe we will settle this like Gentlemen, untill then...give it up!

[tmac1337]

I let my timeslips and Marauder do the talking! Not my azz!
When your car is in the ballpark with mine, maybe we will settle this like Gentlemen, untill then...give it up!

Timeslips are like azzzes, everyone got one......

Enough talk

[MikesMerc]

More Talk......get one of your pals to step up!

Me talk? LOL. Where are your timeslips?

Oh, that's right, you don't have any :neener:

I think its clear who is doing all the talking:rolleyes:

[BillyGman]

I agree with Mike about it being a questionable practice to post quartermile times without posting a timeslip, however, the last time that I went to the track (which was "Jet" and I raced) I tried to post one of my new timeslips, and that feature on this board for doing that would NOT work, and I tried to post it a few weeks later, and it still wasn't working.


I also agree with Mike concerning the comment from somebody else here about a centrifugal equipped car being more dependable, or more streetable than a roots equipped car. My Marauder gets driven every single day back and forth to work 12 months out of the year (even in the snow) and the driveability is still perfect, and has NOT taken a hit at all. Not bad for a 4,200 LB car that turns 12.0's in the quartermile, uh?

[MI2QWK4U]

Two cars
Two Blowers
One Centrifical
One Roots
One 1/4 Mile track
One winner


Sounds great to me!

[MikesMerc]

Timeslips are like azzzes, everyone got one......



Except you.....

[Deebar]

You tell em' Trilogy #33 is comin to MVIII, AND HELL'S COMIN WITH ME, YOU HEAR!?! HELL'S COMIN WITH ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !

[MI2QWK4U]

Timeslips are like azzzes, everyone got one......

Enough talk

I don't have anything to prove with my car. I know what it is capable of. I have launched that beast close to a hundred times. I am not the one suffering from Blower envy! Not only do I know how my car runs at the track, but also in the real world of everyday driving, full of asswhomping kills by one of the fastest Marauders on this board!

[MikesMerc]

I agree with Mike about it being a questionable practice to post quartermile times without posting a timeslip, however, the last time that I went to the track (which was "Jet" and I raced) I tried to post one of my new timeslips, and that feature on this board for doing that would NOT work, and I tried to post it a few weeks later, and it still wasn't working.


Billy,

No offense meant my friend. I'm just a stickler about the timeslip page being for timeslips. I know that sounds kind picky:)

[MI2QWK4U]

You tell em' Trilogy #33 is comin to MVIII, AND HELL'S COMIN WITH ME, YOU HEAR!?! HELL'S COMIN WITH ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !


Hell yes! Bring it!

[HwyCruiser]

There's more smack talk flying around here than just before a championship professional wrestling match! I love it!

Youse guys need to get this on pay-per-view! :lol:

[MI2QWK4U]

There's more smack talk flying around here than just before a championship professional wrestling match! I love it!

Youse guys need to get this on pay-per-view! :lol:


Now that is a great idea....we need a satalite uplink from Milan dragway for the big showdown!! Great way to raise money for the site....Logan? How can we do that!

[merc]

Has anyone contacted Don King Productions? :popcorn: If the man wants a hair dryer under the hood, that's his choice. What happened to our friendship? Power is a multiple of money; the more money you have the faster you go. Let's not start dividing ourselves into the haves and have nots. I personally like killing the competition, not other Marauders. We have lost too many good members to unproductive conversations on this site. :argue: PS: One of the fastest Marauders on this site has a powerchanger without a time slip listed and let's not forget about Mac. When you break it down, it's all about the Benjamin’s. :cowboy:

[MarauderTJA]

Man, talk about everyone getting frisky here....Hey we are ALL Marauder guys, this is just for fun. And yes, a challenge of a matched set of Marauders (gears, mufflers) with different blowers would be fun for us all. I personally do not care who wins, It is all in fun. Let's keep it that way...How about it?:P

[sailsmen]

Just look at the lowest 1/4 and 60' times.

The only way to compare is 2 cars side by side at the track!

I can't wait to hear about it because I think the cars are going to be close as in within 2 tenths!

Spot me 3 tenths for being N/A and I will take on any MM that is stock + a S/C! :)

[FiveO]

I won't chime in on the majority of this thread...but I will say:

I deleted my 1/4 times earlier this year because I'm looking for waaay better ones. Soooo...my 1/4 times should have probably been in the top 9-11 spots. Close!

Soon to come... 11's or bust!

And nkc can attest to our fun (IE: Head to Head: coming up at Cedar Falls in May.

I'm not sure why nkc is claming 550rwhp...via PM :) (any problems we need to know about nkc?) Bottom end built up? Just a want? Or a necessity due to problems?

Should be interesting though. My 451rwhp Trilogy against his claimed 550+. I'm not selling...I'm racing :D

I'll be in the 11's this year....hopefully early this year. I'm not in any way claiming low 11's...but 11.8-9's are in the ballpark.

I'll be in all the fun at Woodward and MV3!!!! MILAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!



PS: I'm going to push my car to the limit this year. If she blows..she blows and I'll admit it. Within a few months she'll be back...and better than ever..just like Trilogy #1. Although I'll be planning on a few more ponies...say 650-700?

[Jerry Barnes]

O.K. I was in Florida and did not see another Non-Trilogy blown car. And I was looking for one. I even posted that I would be down there both weekends. Tmack, you missed your chance. But, I love a challenge. I will meet you half way. Trilolgy #2 is bone stock with our body kit and widened wheels. I can change the wheels back to stock and use the car that is in the SEMA photos.

I like having fun with ALL of the Marauder folks, supercharged or not. It will be a great event! I'm in!!!!!

Second, Carfixer is the newest Trilogy customer. He is kit #71 or #72.

Let the games begin!

Jerry

[MI2QWK4U]

I won't chime in on the majority of this thread...but I will say:

I deleted my 1/4 times earlier this year because I'm looking for waaay better ones. Soooo...my 1/4 times should have probably been in the top 9-11 spots. Close!

Soon to come... 11's or bust!

And nkc can attest to our fun (IE: Head to Head: coming up at Cedar Falls in May.

I'm not sure why nkc is claming 550rwhp...via PM :) (any problems we need to know about nkc?) Bottom end built up? Just a want? Or a necessity due to problems?

Should be interesting though. My 451rwhp Trilogy against his claimed 550+. I'm not selling...I'm racing :D

I'll be in the 11's this year....hopefully early this year. I'm not in any way claiming low 11's...but 11.8-9's are in the ballpark.

I'll be in all the fun at Woodward and MV3!!!! MILAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!



PS: I'm going to push my car to the limit this year. If she blows..she blows and I'll admit it. Within a few months she'll be back...and better than ever..just like Trilogy #1. Although I'll be planning on a few more ponies...say 650-700?


Where did 550 rwhp Procharger come from?

[MI2QWK4U]

O.K. I was in Florida and did not see another Non-Trilogy blown car. And I was looking for one. I even posted that I would be down there both weekends. Tmack, you missed your chance. But, I love a challenge. I will meet you half way. Trilolgy #2 is bone stock with our body kit and widened wheels. I can change the wheels back to stock and use the car that is in the SEMA photos.

I like having fun with ALL of the Marauder folks, supercharged or not. It will be a great event! I'm in!!!!!

Second, Carfixer is the newest Trilogy customer. He is kit #71 or #72.

Let the games begin!

Jerry

Congratulations Claude!! You are going to love the Blower! Dang...another Trilogy Brother.....life is good....

[FiveO]

Where did 550 rwhp Procharger come from?


maraudernkc's PM to me in reference to our head to head meet in Iowa in May.

Quote from PM: Sorry maraudernkc...its all public if you make claims like this:


You sure you want to run down the track?

I just got my forged cobra bottem end in last Friday.

I am going to a D1sc with 3 core Intercooler and will run about 15 PSI at 6800 RPM should be about 575RWHP on 93 octane.

I can hardly wait.




If you're running a stoked bottom end my question is why? You haven't even proven you're stock kit at the track? Just curious...not ready to start problems.

See you in May :)

[Jerry Barnes]

FiveO,

Does this mean that I can bring Trilogy #1 instead of Trilogy #2. Let's keep things even. I will build a forged bottom end on Trilogy #1 by next month. Games have to have rules, and as long as the rules are the same for everyone, I'm in!!!!!!!!!!!

I love this site!!!!!!!

Jerry

[CRUZTAKER]

Oh hell....if everyone is gonna cheat....

I'm comin' after all of ya WITHOUT a blower. Just a bottle and a 'pocket full of change'...!

:P ;) :coolman:

[maraudernkc]

FiveO, That was my PM to you. You are right about that one item. You wanted to run me and I told you what I was doing because it would not of been a fair race. I am building a motor and I told you I was doing so. I am not satasfied at 455RWHP. It is a 4.6 L all forged bottom end with 9.2 to 1 compression. So you go ahead and post PM's that get sent to you. I guess that says a little something about yourself.


maraudernkc's PM to me in reference to our head to head meet in Iowa in May.

Quote from PM: Sorry maraudernkc...its all public if you make claims like this:



If you're running a stoked bottom end my question is why? You haven't even proven you're stock kit at the track? Just curious...not ready to start problems.

See you in May :)

[FiveO]

FiveO,

Does this mean that I can bring Trilogy #1 instead of Trilogy #2. Let's keep things even. I will build a forged bottom end on Trilogy #1 by next month. Games have to have rules, and as long as the rules are the same for everyone, I'm in!!!!!!!!!!!

I love this site!!!!!!!

Jerry

Sounds fair to me. If I can't take 'em...you can surely take a shot at 'em!!!

Just don't show up my hamster...he'll be hurt ;) :D

[FiveO]

FiveO, That was my PM to you. You are right about that one item. You wanted to run me and I told you what I was doing because it would not of been a fair race. I am building a motor and I told you I was doing so. I am not satasfied at 455RWHP. It is a 4.6 L all forged bottom end with 9.2 to 1 compression. So you go ahead and post PM's that get sent to you. I guess that says a little something about yourself.


You wanna keep the playing field even...do so.

PM's are private...but make claims like 575rwhp and its all fair game. Go ahead and post some of my PM claims. I'll live up to them. Simply put.

Why are you building up your bottom end? Just because? :bs:

Blow your engine beforehand? Please tell?


If you wanna run at Cedar Falls...then I'm there. But don't brag about a "jacked up bottom end" and then not be able to explain why? Just because? Not enough.

We as fellow relaxed forum members would like to know why you are building up your engine block from stock RIGHT after supercharging it...without giving your engine a chance to prove its point.

Friendly as always...just asking for an explanation.


Mark
AKA:FiveO

[Glenn]

Mark:

Hope to see you at FFW in Commerce, GA on April 15/16. You would really impress some of the Mustang drivers with your MM.

Glenn

[maraudernkc]

FiveO, I already told you why I am building a rocket motor. 455 RWHP is not enoughf for me. This is not my everyday driver.


You wanna keep the playing field even...do so.

PM's are private...but make claims like 575rwhp and its all fair game. Go ahead and post some of my PM claims. I'll live up to them. Simply put.

Why are you building up your bottom end? Just because? :bs:

Blow your engine beforehand? Please tell?


If you wanna run at Cedar Falls...then I'm there. But don't brag about a "jacked up bottom end" and then not be able to explain why? Just because? Not enough.

We as fellow relaxed forum members would like to know why you are building up your engine block from stock RIGHT after supercharging it...without giving your engine a chance to prove its point.

Friendly as always...just asking for an explanation.


Mark
AKA:FiveO

[FiveO]

FiveO, I already told you why I am building a rocket motor. 455 RWHP is not enoughf for me. This is not my everyday driver.

You had 455rwhp for how long before deciding this?

Just asking for a simple friendly explanation.

[maraudernkc]

I am 42 and have been building cars since I was 15. 455RWHP in a 4200 lb. car is not that much.


You had 455rwhp for how long before deciding this?

Just asking for a simple friendly explanation.

[tmac1337]

You had 455rwhp for how long before deciding this?

Just asking for a simple friendly explanation.

Maybe he should tell you in a private message, after all, we all know now how ethical you are.

[FiveO]

Maybe he should tell you in a private message, after all, we all know now how ethical you are.




Tell me in PM...no problem. I'll keep it private. BUT: Make claims like nkc has...without reason...and its very very suspect.

I still find it suspect that nkc wants to hide why he is building a forged block supercharged motor from stock AFTER supercharging it in the first place?

I'd like a simple question answered:


maraudernkc: Did you blow your motor, in any way shape or form, on 'a' dyno when testing the Procharger Kit.


I'm just asking. Truth or not. Please tell.

If not...and you're being truthful...I'll see you in Iowa :)

[merc406]

Damn I love Supercharger threads :burnout:

[Joe Walsh]

:popcorn:

:duel: :argh:

[FiveO]

Maybe he should tell you in a private message, after all, we all know now how ethical you are.




Ethics prevail. Be honest about your car and your intentions, and what your car has done...before posting "brags" or things your car can do before its done them.


My car has done 12.5's on stock tires. Whats your car done?


I "HOPE" to hit the 11's": Notice the word "HOPE"? This is where true relaxed friends come along. I hope to hit the 11's with my upgraded pulley, tune and racing gas along with slick tires, etc.

If you and nkc keep posting garauntee's or threats or challenges? Its all for naught...just please post a time slip and then people will start believing.

If I see a timeslip...I (and my little mouse below) will be one of them.



Sincerely,


Mark
AKA:FiveO

[FiveO]

455RWHP in a 4200 lb. car is not that much.



Nothing more true has ever been said.


So if you knew the weight beforehand...why didn't you set her up this way? With 600rwhp? Whats with the original kit? Why not just build her up right away?

If you wanted to test this kit beforehand...why not test her on the track before building her up to your 575hp?

Still waiting for a friendly answer:


I'd like a simple question answered:


maraudernkc: Did you blow your motor, in any way shape or form, on 'a' dyno when testing the Procharger Kit.




I'm asking for a clarification.

Friendly yes...nothing more.

Please tell.

[drgnrdr33]

Damn I love Supercharger threads :burnout:


Ditto! Ya'll are mighty entertainin'

[Bigdogjim]

Has anyone contacted Don King Productions? :popcorn: If the man wants a hair dryer under the hood, that's his choice. What happened to our friendship? Power is a multiple of money; the more money you have the faster you go. Let's not start dividing ourselves into the haves and have nots. I personally like killing the competition, not other Marauders. We have lost too many good members to unproductive conversations on this site. :argue: PS: One of the fastest Marauders on this site has a powerchanger without a time slip listed and let's not forget about Mac. When you break it down, it's all about the Benjamin’s. :cowboy:
Problem is they can't see the forest for the trees.

[BillyGman]

I still find it suspect that nkc wants to hide why he is building a forged block supercharged motor from stock AFTER supercharging it in the first place?

I'd like a simple question answered:


maraudernkc: Did you blow your motor, in any way shape or form, on 'a' dyno when testing the Procharger Kit.


I'm just asking. Truth or not. Please tell.

:)An interesting question^ .............. hmmmmmmmmm :hmmm:

[tmac1337]

Does anyone know how that Trilogy car blew up in Texas?

[BillyGman]

Does anyone know how that Trilogy car blew up in Texas?As far as I know, it happened on a roadcourse which lasted a few hours from what I was told. This is according to what buckwheat himself posted about this incident. So I think that many street cars would have a tough time lasting through a race like that. BTW, what does that have to do with this thread? What I mean is, what makes you bring that up? Is this your attempt to divert the attention from Five O's question?

[TechHeavy]

O.K. I was in Florida and did not see another Non-Trilogy blown car. And I was looking for one. I even posted that I would be down there both weekends. Tmack, you missed your chance. But, I love a challenge. I will meet you half way. Trilolgy #2 is bone stock with our body kit and widened wheels. I can change the wheels back to stock and use the car that is in the SEMA photos.

I like having fun with ALL of the Marauder folks, supercharged or not. It will be a great event! I'm in!!!!!

Second, Carfixer is the newest Trilogy customer. He is kit #71 or #72.

Let the games begin!

Jerry
Now we're talking! I'll be posting time slips soon, and I WILL be ready at Milan.

" Are you crying? There's no crying -- there's no crying in baseball!" Tom Hanks (Jimmy Dugan) in A League of Their Own

See you guys at Milan.

[tmac1337]

As far as I know, it happened on a roadcourse which lasted a few hours from what I was told. This is according to what buckwheat himself posted about this incident. So I think that many street cars would have a tough time lasting through a race like that. BTW, what does that have to do with this thread? What I mean is, what makes you bring that up? Is this your attempt to divert the attention from Five O's question?

Billy, not trying to butt heads with you....but...Lidio was the one who started all this with a disertation about Centrifugal Blowers which is inappropriate as he is a Vendor himself, alligned with another Vendor, competing with other Vendors. So I guess it's okay now for all the Vendors to take the gloves off. If anyone was attempting to divert attention from the title of this thread that basically states that a Trilogy equipped car grenaded, it was him.

And now Maraudernkc is being disrespected with a question, which by the nature of the question is DIVERSION at it's finest! If NKC feels like lowering himself to answer that question, that is his business and has nothing to do with my question.

And asking what happened to another Trilogy equipped car that recently blew up has more to do with this thread than a lecuture on Centrifugal Blowers.

But anyway, there is a Trilogy equipped car that runs 13.1's consistently on the FL West coast so Tom can run his car at Bradenton soon and see what his times are and post a slip. As will I the next time I'm over there.

This has all been a waste of time so........hasta luego!

[Jerry Barnes]

Does anyone know how that Trilogy car blew up in Texas?


It would be very helpful for us at Trilogy to understand what happened to Buckwheat's car. Buckwheat could you let us know.

Thanks

Jerry

[David Morton]

This thread reminds me of a joke...

Lil' Abner told Daisy she was lookin' under the weather so she got on the mule an rode over to Doc Johnsons. When she came back she looked puzzled and said, "He said I looked allright but tole me to go and come back with a "yearn sample"? (urine) Sounds like somthin' ya have a hankerin' for. Whut am I gonna do?" So Abner told her to go see Jessie the Midwife, "She knows all that medical talk."

So Daisy goes over to Jessies and when she gets back her hair is all messed up with mud and grass, she has a black eye and her clothes are torn. When Abner asked her what happened she said she'd got in a fight! Abner was pleased, "Fight! Soory I missed it. Say, who'd you fight!". "Jessie." came Daisy's reply.

Now puzzled Abner said, "Why in the world was you fightin' with her! You'se over there askin' fer her help!" and Daisy replied...

"I don't know what in the world was wrong with that woman. It was all her fault. I went up an asked her about that there "yearn sample" just a nice as you please, an you know what she said to me? She said, "You go pi$$ in a coke bottle." So I said, "Well then why don't just go and $h!t in a mason jar you old b!tch!".

"Next thing I knowed we was fightin'!"

The tongue is mightier than the sword.

[jstevens]

Hey Techheavy, I'm looking forward to Milan, but I don't want to race you LOL.

Remember, opening day is just around the corner 02Apr.

[maraudernkc]

FiveO, Yes I Blew my motor with a ProCharger.

Looks like you blew your motor with a Trilogy!




Tell me in PM...no problem. I'll keep it private. BUT: Make claims like nkc has...without reason...and its very very suspect.

I still find it suspect that nkc wants to hide why he is building a forged block supercharged motor from stock AFTER supercharging it in the first place?

I'd like a simple question answered:


maraudernkc: Did you blow your motor, in any way shape or form, on 'a' dyno when testing the Procharger Kit.


I'm just asking. Truth or not. Please tell.

If not...and you're being truthful...I'll see you in Iowa :)

[BillyGman]

FiveO, Yes I Blew my motor with a ProCharger.

Looks like you blew your motor with a Trilogy!So then I take it that the dyno numbers that you had posted were accomplished by blowing up your engine. Correct?

[BruteForce]

So then I take it that the dyno numbers that you had posted were accomplished by blowing up your engine. Correct?

I think you missed the joke. In this case blew = blower as in "i blew my engine by installing a blower. It is now blown".

All of which do NOT mean that the engine failed.

[TechHeavy]

Hey Techheavy, I'm looking forward to Milan, but I don't want to race you LOL.

Remember, opening day is just around the corner 02Apr.
It may still be snowing April 02! I hope not. I'm ready! Which reminds me... I need to get my Nitto's. :D

See ya there!

[BillyGman]

I think you missed the joke. In this case blew = blower as in "i blew my engine by installing a blower. It is now blown".

All of which do NOT mean that the engine failed.Yep, you're right.....but since that wasn't a direct answer, I wonder if there's more to this story.......

[BruteForce]

Yep, you're right.....but since that wasn't a direct answer, I wonder if there's more to this story.......

I think there is a fair amount of chain yanking going on too. :D