Need to make a tough decision

[Detmack81]

Ive been doing alot of research on the kooks headers with x pipe and the pi torque connverter. Can somebody also explain the basics of a new torque converter I dont understand the slang like lockup etc. But the sad part is that I can only get one of these great mods. Can you guys tell me which one i will enjoy the most. These are the mods i already have underdrive pullies, k&n kit, flowmaster 40's, 4:10's, chip

[SergntMac]

Everyone will have their own opinion here, and mine is go with the Stallion PI. Building power is half the fun, getting it to the ground is the other half. Happy motoring!

[Rider90]

-POST DELETED-

[Directedby]

I heard the TQ converter is too much for a daily driver and doesn't make much sense, and that Kooks was one of the best mods for a daily driver. Just what I've heard.

I have the TQ on my daily driver and love it - no problems.

I think the TQ will give you a stronger powerband. The car will pull harder and keep pulling.

The headers will increase mid-upper range power and will make the car sound mean.

[valleyman]

I have the 3k stall Stallion T/C and my MM is my daily driver. Drivability is not affected at all. Except that it makes the car more of a "neck snapper" when you want it to be.

[MarauderMark]

At least for me i was running 13.4's as soon as the T/C went in it brought me down to 12.4's.

[MikesMerc]

I'd get the exhaust work. I just don't appreciate the "lurching" feeling from a bigger stall. I like my brisk accelerations from a stop to be buttery smooth. But, something like this is very subjective.

[stevengerard]

I have both, the Torque converter is much more stealth than the Kook's. This is just my opinion but get the pi first as it really helps off the line and helps get the hp the Kook's produces to the ground. I have a 3500 rpm stall and its just fine, the car is my dailey driver too. The Kook's are great but the pi is a cheaper bang for the buck.

[cyclone03]

I also have both,but I do not have gears.

The converter WILL make the car pull hard from a stop,and at low engine RPM.


The headers WILL give the car a soft feel at low engine speeds, below 3000rpm an area of the torque curve you spend a lot of time in if you drive in traffic. Your gear will help this but I don't know how much.


With over a year on my converter I can tell you my city milage has gone from 17-18 to 15-16mpg my highway mileage runs about 22-24 with a 25 in there if I'm road tripin'.
The converter REQUIRES a retune of the computer to really work,I have mine set up to lock the converter in OD and 3rd at light throttle at about 45mph.With the stock gears I have too much slipage in OD with the converter unlocked.


The term lock-up converter meens the converter has a built in clutch disc that prevents the RPM slipage between the engine and transmission.
If you have driven a stick shift you know how a locked up conveter feels when locked.
My trans tune with the converter locked feels just like a stick in 3rd and OD.

Hope this helps.

Oh and one more thing 14.86 in the 1/4 mile before the converter and headers 14.20 after.

[Rider90]

I just wanted to make it clear I am not against the TC, I have no experience with one in the Marauder so I'm not bashing. I just wanted to throw out what I've heard when the subject came up. Carry on :P

[SergntMac]

Considering all benefits of both mods, it's still not an easy question to answer. I say again, buy the T/C first, here's why. First, the easy stuff to consider.

1) It's the cheaper of the two mods you ask about.
2) It's less visible to the warranty police, which may be a point to consider.
3) It's less invasive to the car as a mod that may have to come off someday, for what ever reason.
4) It will provide performance gains equal to the Kook's exhaust, just not on a dyno.

The Kook's exhaust system will produce new X RWHP and X RWTQ and you can see this power improvement instantly in before and after dyno charts. This is new power at play, power you did not have before adding the mod. Kook's are a power "building" mod.

The PI Stallion TC is not a power building mod. It does not develop new power not present prior to adding the mod. What it does, is take the power you have available at the flywheel today, and move it through the drivetrain with greater efficiency.

All drivetrains drain flywheel power, some as much as 25 percent, some as little as 5 percent. The actual percentage of loss isn't important here, other than to recognize that you lose power to the drivetrain. Installing a TC that is less of a drain on power while transferring more native power to the wheels, is more efficient. Getting more of your on-board power to the rear wheels is the goal, because it's torque that moves the car forward.

You will not see any significant power gains in before and after dyno charts, a dyno won't show this power because the car isn't really moving, or, pulling it's own weight against traction and the friction of wind resistance. The industry standard dyno for testing is a DynoJet, and this style of dyno machine calculates power based on the movement of a static 3400 pound drum. A computer does the thinking and you get numbers, and they are accurate as an index of performance growth. However, a Stallion TC shows it's true worth when it's job is really moving the car forward.

I've tested the single plate PI Stallion TC, and it developed nominal numbers on a dyno. However, it resulted in more than a .50 reduction in ET at the track, and a .50 reduction from any single mod alone is remarkable. It works, and it's worth every penny. If you cannot fit it into your budget today, start making plans for it. You won't be competitive on the track, or, at the stop light without it...IMHO.

Just my .02c...

BTW, I never heard of any diveability issues with the single plate, and I had one on my first MM for about 10K miles. The triple plate can emit a low volume rattle with negative load at idle, and it must use Mercon V fluid, but there's not many triple plates on the street anyway. I own the first triple plate made for our Marauders, and after 20K+ of supercharged power-beating, I returned it to PI for inspection, and it was pronounced 100 percent healthy.

Okay, that's .04c now...

[Detmack81]

I have both, the Torque converter is much more stealth than the Kook's. This is just my opinion but get the pi first as it really helps off the line and helps get the hp the Kook's produces to the ground. I have a 3500 rpm stall and its just fine, the car is my dailey driver too. The Kook's are great but the pi is a cheaper bang for the buck.


WHAT KIND OF LABOR CHARGES SHOULD I EXPECT TO INSTALL THE CONVERTER

[merc406]

Ive been doing alot of research on the kooks headers with x pipe and the pi torque connverter. Can somebody also explain the basics of a new torque converter I dont understand the slang like lockup etc. But the sad part is that I can only get one of these great mods. Can you guys tell me which one i will enjoy the most. These are the mods i already have underdrive pullies, k&n kit, flowmaster 40's, 4:10's, chip



Don't blow your dough, save it for a supercharger.

[Detmack81]

Don't blow your dough, save it for a supercharger.

MAN I WISH DONT HAVE THAT KIND OF MONEY

[merc406]

Enter the blower raffle at the top of the page, one never knows, just 100 bucks. Good luck.

[stevengerard]

Can't tell you what price - don't remember. And I'm supercharged and I'm still glad I went with it.