Locking the TQ converter at WOT, a few questions.

['03BlkMM]

My SCT computer flash currently locks the TQ cnvt at WOT in both 2nd and 3rd. It locks in 2nd about 2 secs after the 1-2shift. 3rd gear does the same and locks right after the 2-3 shift. When it locks it you can feel it load the engine down and it doesn't drop the rpm's but they stay constant for about 1 sec. My thoughts are that it might be more beneficial to hold off on the lock-up until it hits the peak power point at around 5000-5200 rpms. This would put put the 1sec pause right at the point the car is pulling its best and might improve the times slightly. Have any of you ever played around with the TQ conv lock-up point at WOT?

[torinodan]

anyone got anything?

[Marauderjack]

I have an SCT program that is about like Lidios and it is supposed to hold TC lockup out until 4th gear above 60 MPH?? :bows: During normal to moderate driving it does just that but if I accelerate hard....say from 30 MPH in 3rd gear it downshifts with no TC interference but at WOT it feels like it is trying to lockup (bogging feeling)!! :argue: If I lift slightlt it takes off like a shot of nitrous?? :bows:

I have talked to Lidio about it and called the SCT people and they have no answers?? :confused: I was thinking it since the TC lockup has to do with line pressures maybe the computer cannot control it and backing out of the throttle causes it to stop the lockup function?? It is annoying as HELL to have a bunch of power but not be able to use it without first backing off the throttle!!! :bigcry:

Maybe Jerry W. will read these posts and respond since he had a hand in developing these transmissions?? :(

Marauderjack :bandit:

[CRUZTAKER]

If this is the problem I am thinking of....a bit of a bog, a hesitation, just after the 2 shift....

We had a video in the gallery, I still have it, not sure if it is still in the gallery, but this issue was common amongst many of us. Particularly after a new T/C install.

The bog, dead spot, was very annoying, and for awhile there was no fix readily available. It ALL had to do with the T/C lockup at WOT going from 2 to 3.

Lidio was the first to correct the problem with tuning. He fixed mine, and I have never had the bog again. Dennis also offered a fix soon thereafter.

If this is the problem you have, it is easily fixed by tuning. However, you must find someone to do it for you, or aquire the values from someone for your tuner.

Good luck.

More threads regarding this issue can be found by searching 'hesitation'.

['03BlkMM]

I was thinking it since the TC lockup has to do with line pressures maybe the computer cannot control it and backing out of the throttle causes it to stop the lockup function??
Marauderjack :bandit:

Actually the TQ conv has its own map and the lockup/unlock points are completely adjustable just like the transmission gear shift points. If you have the tune file you can make the changes yourself with the free quicktune software that you can download from SCT's site. I know Lidio won't give the tune file out, so if your using him you'll have to talk with him. But DR will give it out and I'm sure there are others that will as well. I'm going to start playing with mine some and see how it feels holding off on the lockup until later in the rev band. In fact I'm supposed to go to the track next weekend. I'll make a couple of different programs with the TQ conv lockup at different points later in the rev band at WOT and see how the car responds. I'll let you guys know if there is any improvement to be had by doing this.

[Lidio]

The custom tune that I offer for the MM’s and many other Fords that have electronic controlled transmissions and electronic locking converter in no way locks the converter at WOT in any gear. I only let it lock in OD at about 63-66mph. This has proven to be a very satisfactory way of reworking lock-up from stock, and from what I can see, its driven other tuners to copy my way of doing it or doing it by request because others are passing along that it works or feels good. I’m not saying that I invented this way of not locking till OD gear, just made it more popular and accepted by people who are interested in better part throttle response and feel.

The tune is what controls lock-up in every way. Be it at part throttle or WOT. For the most part lock up is for fuel economy and also creates less heat in the trans when the converter is locked and no longer slipping or sheering fluid. Lock-up at WOT is OK when huge amounts of power are being produced, and when a really loose converter is being used as well. For instance in a mild or non Blower or non NOS’d MM I will not let it lock at WOT ever. But when they start to produce over 480 RWHP or so then I start to some times lock in 3rd shortly after the 3rd gear shift occurs. This in some cars with big power will make them ET a little better and show a little more MPH at the end of the qtr mile. With relatively tight, stock type converters…. Locking at WOT doesn’t do much good or are better off staying unlocked for the duration of the qtr mile.

In some case I will actually lock them at WOT in the middle of second gear and let it shift into 3rd while locked, but this can cause an awkward shift because the factory does not allow them to stay locked 100% during a shift. They actually slip or briefly unlock the converter during a shift so as not to make the shift to harsh and damaging. I’ve wired them to not unlock or not slip during a 2-3 shift, but we’ve hurt parts doing that and it causes a much more severe rpm drop/luging during the 2-3 shift.

Other then the special trans tune that I use for dynoing only, I typically don’t allow lock-up at WOT on most of what I do…. Other then as I said at about 60-63mph in OD only.


Thanks

['03BlkMM]

Thx Lidio, I was hoping that a tuner would chime in here! I had read somewhere(can't remember where)that locking the converter in the 1:1 gear at WOT usually resulted in slightly better ET's and trap speeds. But I was also worried about converter clutch wear. If there is no benefit to locking it then there is no need to wear on the conv clutch everytime I go WOT. I'll probably experiment with it at the track and see if there is any measurable improvement.

[metroplex]

I've been locking the TC in OD at around 40 mph for better fuel economy in local driving.

[AzMarauder]

The custom tune that I offer for the MM’s and many other Fords that have electronic controlled transmissions and electronic locking converter in no way locks the converter at WOT in any gear. I only let it lock in OD at about 63-66mph. This has proven to be a very satisfactory way of reworking lock-up from stock, and from what I can see, its driven other tuners to copy my way of doing it or doing it by request because others are passing along that it works or feels good. I’m not saying that I invented this way of not locking till OD gear, just made it more popular and accepted by people who are interested in better part throttle response and feel.

The tune is what controls lock-up in every way. Be it at part throttle or WOT. For the most part lock up is for fuel economy and also creates less heat in the trans when the converter is locked and no longer slipping or sheering fluid. Lock-up at WOT is OK when huge amounts of power are being produced, and when a really loose converter is being used as well. For instance in a mild or non Blower or non NOS’d MM I will not let it lock at WOT ever. But when they start to produce over 480 RWHP or so then I start to some times lock in 3rd shortly after the 3rd gear shift occurs. This in some cars with big power will make them ET a little better and show a little more MPH at the end of the qtr mile. With relatively tight, stock type converters…. Locking at WOT doesn’t do much good or are better off staying unlocked for the duration of the qtr mile.

In some case I will actually lock them at WOT in the middle of second gear and let it shift into 3rd while locked, but this can cause an awkward shift because the factory does not allow them to stay locked 100% during a shift. They actually slip or briefly unlock the converter during a shift so as not to make the shift to harsh and damaging. I’ve wired them to not unlock or not slip during a 2-3 shift, but we’ve hurt parts doing that and it causes a much more severe rpm drop/luging during the 2-3 shift.

Other then the special trans tune that I use for dynoing only, I typically don’t allow lock-up at WOT on most of what I do…. Other then as I said at about 60-63mph in OD only.


Thanks
Lidio,

For those of us in the hotter climes... will leaving the TC unlocked (Ref your statement about fluid temp above) cause any heating issues for the trans?

[Lidio]

Lidio,

For those of us in the hotter climes... will leaving the TC unlocked (Ref your statement about fluid temp above) cause any heating issues for the trans?

With a stock converter, heat is not an issue with my tune not locking as much as the stock tune would. The factory MM trans cooler is very good. With a looser after market converter, heat in the trans will be higher and will need to be watched a little closer.

[AzMarauder]

With a stock converter, heat is not an issue with my tune not locking as much as the stock tune would. The factory MM trans cooler is very good. With a looser after market converter, heat in the trans will be higher and will need to be watched a little closer.
Lidio,

Thanks.... sometimes being on the frontier we face different challenges than the mainstream car market. (91 octane... high elevation... high temp)

[metroplex]

Yeah but rust isn't a problem.
The only time I spent in AZ was in between a trip from NTC to Nevada, but it seemed rather pleasant, especially near the Colorado?? River.

[AzMarauder]

Yeah but rust isn't a problem.
The only time I spent in AZ was in between a trip from NTC to Nevada, but it seemed rather pleasant, especially near the Colorado?? River.
There are positives and negatives about every place. I think the positives outweigh the negatives for Arizona. Sun is very harsh on rubber, paint and interiors. But as you say, if you stay out of the white mountains (where they have hella snows) we don't have a snow or salt problem. Bodies of the cars last forever.

[Haggis]

There are positives and negatives about every place. I think the positives outweigh the negatives for Arizona. Sun is very harsh on rubber, paint and interiors. But as you say, if you stay out of the white mountains (where they have hella snows) we don't have a snow or salt problem. Bodies of the cars last forever.
Ahh... :sunshine: gotta love it. As I told someone last week while on vacation, 'It never gets to hot in Tucson.' Home Sweet Home...maybe someday, I really do miss it. Been back almost a week and I am already homesick. :hankie:

:hijack: