Kenny Brown Marauder write up in

[tomd]

Car and Drive. Says the Accord will beat us to 60 by half a second. :(

That's ok still love my Marauder! :banana2:

Article covers everything we already know about the FAST Kenny Brown Marauder

[TAF]

Car and Drive. Says the Accord will beat us to 60 by half a second.

I don't know about that...but they won't look as good doing it in that "grocery getter"...

Now a Sable....THAT'S a DIFFERENT story...

[Macon Marauder]

I dunno about those magazine guys. They always seem to have "agendas."

Is C&D the one that tested Marauder and got 0-60 time of 7.5 seconds? That can't be right, can it?

Maybe it's all in the technique. I saw 6.89 in another mag...

[B-26]

Don't sell the farm based on a magazine test. No telling who drove or under what conditions. Politics advertising money and a few other things can sway results.

[jwheeler]

I myself have clocked my bone stock MM at 6.71 with a gtech pro. That was a least 2000 miles ago. I'm going to check again one of these days, as I now have 9200 Miles on her. I also have a least a 100lbs of speakers and amp in the trunk.

So I don't agree with the Car and Driver numbers.


-J:coolman:

[looking97233]

Car and Driver in thier review of the Marauder was the oddball that said thier best 0-60 time was 8.5sec.

[jwheeler]

I just took her out for another spin and on ran a 6.67. But, it's still to cold up here in Iowa to get the tires to hook up(15 degrees). I think I can pull a 6.5 when it warms up a bit. Remember I have a least a 100 extra poumds of car stereo in the trunk.

Car and Driver be Damned!:shot:

-J:D

[vaderv]

(SHIVER SHIVER) Please don't say Sable. It's the only car I'm afraid of when I drive anymore... The power of the darkside is nothing compared to the all mighty Sable.

[Paul T. Casey]

well, it's the second most fun 8.5 seconds that I can think of!!!

[gonzo50]

The article states that Kenny Brown said that a Roots Type blower wouldn't fit underneath the Marauder's hood, how did Trilogy Motorsports fit one in. :confused:

According to the article, the Marauder S only has one size tire on all four corners, 255/45ZR-18, is this correct ? :help: Also what are the Headlight option listed for $151.00 ? ;)

Maybe Mensrea can clarify.

[prchrman]

Motor Trend..July 02...0-30 at 2.62; 0-40 at 3.78; 0-50 at 5.16; 0-60 at 6.89; 0-70 at 8.89; 0-80 11.30; 0-90 at 14.44; 0-100 at 18.34; 1/4 mile-15.42/92.57....so blah, blah, yackety smackety...

[LincMercLover]

You gotta remember, C&D supposively helped along with the development of the "Lounge Lizard" from a CV. SOHC and A LOT of more readily aviable parts. MM hits the scene looking like a carbon copy of their Lizard, so of course they're biased. But we've got heritage. :up:

[kbmg]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by gonzo50
[B]The article states that Kenny Brown said that a Roots Type blower wouldn't fit underneath the Marauder's hood, how did Trilogy Motorsports fit one in. :confused:

According to the article, the Marauder S only has one size tire on all four corners, 255/45ZR-18, is this correct ?


That does not mean that a roots type blower would not fit under the hood, it means that the compressor and package that Kenny wanted to use would not fit. For the 4.6L DOHC application the Vortech centrifugal supercharger was a better fit from an engineering standpoint. Kenny has plenty of experience with the 4.6L DOHC engine and I can't think of one single time I have seen him use anything but the Vortech for that application. The centrifugal unit fits within the OEM envelope a little better than the roots package would have and it certainly fits the theme better.

I am quite sure anyone could take a roots-based system and create a cobbled mess with it on the Marauder. Many of you may have actually seen that mess at the Woodward Cruise last year. If not, let's just say it was less than impressive and certainly no comparison to the Kenny Brown product in terms of fit, finish and function. In addition, from first hand experience, the car ran terrible. Kenny was obviously more interested in the bigger picture.

Also, the tires are 255-45/18 front and 255-50/18 rear. Those are Pirelli P-Zero tires of course.

The headlight option is most likely the PIAA super-white bulbs or other.

[kbmg]

Originally posted by LincMercLover
You gotta remember, C&D supposively helped along with the development of the "Lounge Lizard" from a CV. SOHC and A LOT of more readily aviable parts. MM hits the scene looking like a carbon copy of their Lizard, so of course they're biased. But we've got heritage. :up:



LincMercLover:

Tru C&D did play a key role in the "Lounge Lizard" project. Unfortunately back then there were not enough parts for the 4.6L SOHC engine. Not for that project anyway. Remember that Ford OHC engines only share architecture and not every component or electronics. It is in no way to be considered mix & match componentry. Knowing that, the "Lounge Lizard" project was all engineering rather than bolt-on. The whole thing was actually a collaborative effort between C&D, Kenny Brown and Ford's Panther Group.

I don't think the numbers are a product of bias, but rather a product of the test itself. When the Marauder was tested by C&D they most likely did not generate the performance numbers at an actual dragstrip. The same applies to Kenny's Marauder S which WAS NOT tested at a dragstrip. You should expect other numbers to be better than the C&D numbers due to the fact that many of the magazines do test at a dragstrip. With that in mind, it is safe to assume that Kenny's Marauder S is actually faster that the 4.5 second 0-60 time and 13.2 second 1/4 mile time that was published. Also, Kenny's car was tested in virtually zero degree temperatures (dead of winter in Detroit) on a stiff sidewall tire.

Granted, the whole Honda Accord comparison was a little off base. Nonetheless, those were their results. I bet you will find that the results of the Marauder S will be better when the other magazines publish their results. I am scheduled to take the Marauder S to IRP with AutoWeek TV on March 24. We will see what the results are then.

Seems to me that you Marauder owners have a good handle on what the truth is. Mid-6 second 0-60 should be about right for the stock vehicle. Someone also commented on the many variables involved in this kind of testing as well as the skill level of each party doing the test. They could not have been more correct. The truth always lies more in the seat of the pants rather than the actual posted test results. That is why Kenny never publishes or advertises the "real" performance numbers of his products, but rather tends to under-state them. Essentially, the numbers don't mean a thing!

[LincMercLover]

I didn't care for the MM owners may think a few plug wires may be loose or something under there when they feel the soft pedal of the stock MM. My car is VERY jumpy, and can be driven like none other. Later on they go to say they'd pass on the TC? WTF...?

Makes me wonder, did this DPS really help promote the MM?!?! :confused:

I still say C&D has fallen to a European/Exotic trend.

[prchrman]

LML...I concur...if it's not foreign or looks foreign it's nowhere to them...

[gonzo50]

Thanks kbmg, you broke it down nicely. The Marauder S is with out a doubt a complete package perfection Hot Rod, thanks for the clarification. :D

[WolfeBros]

Originally posted by LincMercLover
I still say C&D has fallen to a European/Exotic trend.

I agree LML they have been there for quite awhile. I bought a Marauder so I would not blend in with all the Mercedes, BMW's and Lexus's. If I had 60 - 75 K to put in a car then maybe I would play in that arena.
For now the RWD American V-8 4 door sedan works very well for me.

[BODYMAN]

I will have some true #'s once I get mine back from KB. In a week and a half. A group of people I know will be renting out Gateway raceway in 3-weeks and I will run my Marauder-S then so I will have some non biased #'s. I do agree I think C&D were not very kind to the stock Marauder! I cant wait to see what the car will do with some cheater slicks on it!!!!

[LincMercLover]

93,

Wha wha? PM me about this!

[kbmg]

Originally posted by LincMercLover
I didn't care for the MM owners may think a few plug wires may be loose or something under there when they feel the soft pedal of the stock MM. My car is VERY jumpy, and can be driven like none other. Later on they go to say they'd pass on the TC? WTF...?

Makes me wonder, did this DPS really help promote the MM?!?! :confused:

I still say C&D has fallen to a European/Exotic trend.



I doubt that any of the owners thought that comment was amusing. When I first drove Mensrea's car back from dropping him at the airport all he had installed prior was 4.10 gears. My first impression was WOW this car has balls. I was so impressed that I called SB at Ford's Panther Group and told him - This car is great!

I was not that miffed by the comment concerning the TC, it does have a very aggressive feel. Something that most media people are not very fond of. He did not have any bad comments to say about it, just that he would pass on it. My guess is that about 25% of the people on this forum would say the same thing after driving the car. The best way to describe the TC is - HOT ROD!

Forgive my ignorance, I am not sure what DPS is. In regards to whether or not the article helped promote the MM - My guess is that it did. We always see an upward trend in new car sales after a big media hit like the one in C&D and the one that came out today in AutoWeek. We call this the "Halo Effect". Beleive it or not, many new cars are sold on the "idea" that the owner can go into the aftermarket and buy performance parts for it. No doubt you will see people who buy the MM solely because of what Kenny can do to it. A perfect example is the original C&D "Lounge Lizard" article. You can bet that the Panther Group used that as leverage to bring the MM to market. It is not that uncommon for individual Ford brands to partner with Kenny Brown to develop image building programs to strengthen the brand or increase new cars sales through the promise of having aftermarket parts available to improve performance. Another example is the Kenny Brown V-6 based CSR Mustang which was a collaborative effort between Team Mustang and Kenny Brown to give the car a performance image and get away from the "girls car" stereotype. The results were staggering for the V-6 Mustang and the Ford Mustang brand name. That one project alone garnered over $20,000,000 in favorable media product placement for the V-6 Mustang. It also created a booming performance market that had been completely non-existent before then.

The other point of view would be that the article was the "kiss of death" for the MM. My hope is that it will prolong the life of the vehicle by helping to boost sales. That is what we should all be hoping for!

[MI2QWK4U]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by gonzo50
"The article states that Kenny Brown said that a Roots Type blower wouldn't fit underneath the Marauder's hood, how did Trilogy Motorsports fit one in."


[QUOTE]Originally posted by kbmg
"That does not mean that a roots type blower would not fit under the hood, it means that the compressor and package that Kenny wanted to use would not fit. For the 4.6L DOHC application the Vortech centrifugal supercharger was a better fit from an engineering standpoint. Kenny has plenty of experience with the 4.6L DOHC engine and I can't think of one single time I have seen him use anything but the Vortech for that application. The centrifugal unit fits within the OEM envelope a little better than the roots package would have and it certainly fits the theme better.

I am quite sure anyone could take a roots-based system and create a cobbled mess with it on the Marauder. Many of you may have actually seen that mess at the Woodward Cruise last year. If not, let's just say it was less than impressive and certainly no comparison to the Kenny Brown product in terms of fit, finish and function. In addition, from first hand experience, the car ran terrible. Kenny was obviously more interested in the bigger picture."

Now for my own 2 cents......

First off, I think a lot of folks here thought the Eaton roots blower looked pretty OEM if I remember.

Secondly, I have seen, and driven, the Marauder equipped with the Eaton, and I don't think it was a "cobbled mess". As for fit and finish, look at the pictures. And for function, I thought the Kenny Brown Dyno showed 382 max HP and 379 for max torque, and the Eaton Dyno showed 387 max HP and 353 for max torque. While I have not had the pleasure of driving a the Vortech equipped Marauder, I did drive an Eaton equipped car, and can say that the car ran strong and hard. I will say this, I believe that a SC is the way to go on these cars, I am just weighing the pros and cons of each, and think its important to keep in mind that there are more than one efficient and productive ways to get the job done.

[TAF]

The other point of view would be that the article was the "kiss of death" for the MM. My hope is that it will prolong the life of the vehicle by helping to boost sales. That is what we should all be hoping for!

That would be (I feel safe to say for most of us here) the hope. I'm afraid (as most of us are) that it will not be the case.

However, this sort of "platform" either under the Marauder or SVT Blackhawk nameplate (maybe you boys can help them with that) which would be available in '06-'08, when I will be ready for another step would be GREAT!!!

[Murader03]

There is also a 2 page write up on the Marauder-S in this weeks AutoWeek.

[SergntMac]

Originally posted by MI2QWK4U
Now for my own 2 cents...First off, I think a lot of folks here thought the Eaton roots blower looked pretty OEM if I remember. Secondly, I have seen, and driven, the Marauder equipped with the Eaton, and I don't think it was a "cobbled mess". As for fit and finish, look at the pictures. And for function, I thought the Kenny Brown Dyno showed 382 max HP and 379 for max torque, and the Eaton Dyno showed 387 max HP and 353 for max torque. While I have not had the pleasure of driving a the Vortech equipped Marauder, I did drive an Eaton equipped car, and can say that the car ran strong and hard. I will say this, I believe that a SC is the way to go on these cars, I am just weighing the pros and cons of each, and think its important to keep in mind that there are more than one efficient and productive ways to get the job done.

I agree, and an Eaton system is what I want to see under my hood. It just looks more natural to me, and the performance of an Eaton against a Vortech, is a draw. Both can be fine tuned to perfection, and that perfection would not show a supreme winner. Both are great systems, and both perform to the same standard, they just take different highways.

MI2, you're up against a public relations pro here, not a street tuner. You're not going to win the argument, he gets paid to win on KB's behalf. Best you can do, is share more Eaton new with us, and we will decide what goes under our hood. Thanks for pitching in though, please send me your e-mail addy to SergntMac@aol.com, k?

[kbmg]

MI2QWK4U & SergntMac:

Your points are well taken. I don't think the interpretation of the crude-looking roots prototypes that showed up 6 months ago was at all un-fair. I have seen the pictures of Lidio's supercharger system and you are all correct. The system does look very good and is packaged in a very OEM manner. It is by far the best packaged roots-based sytem I have seen to date. Kudos to Lidio, he has done some very amazing things with his Mustang race cars and his Marauder is no exception.

The first Kenny Brown Marauder S dyno sheet to pop up in the enthusiast furums showed rear wheel HP at 382. Not too bad for right out of the box and more than anyone actually anticipated. Based on the production cars Kenny has built to date, that would be the average low number. Depending on customer specified options the number can be much higher. In the case of the car that C&D tested, it was a few ticks or more over 400 HP rear wheel. Calling the performance of the two units a draw might not be a fair assumption in the end. We shall see.

In regards to which system is better, well that's for you to decide. I think it's great that everyone has a choice. Lidio's product offers Marauder owners a choice to do it themselves. The Kenny Brown car is an actual production vehicle, which in many cases is what people will want. The Marauder S is designed and engineered to be as close to an OEM production vehicle as any tuner car can be. As far as doing yourself, that is why they call it vehicle personalization, but in some cases that can also come with a price. Anyway, the fact that everyone has a choice of systems that meet their needs and fit within their budgets, is a good thing!

[TAF]

^^^^Well said AND well handled^^^^^


MI2, you're up against a public relations pro here, not a street tuner. .... he gets paid to win on KB's behalf.

[russ in VA]

C&D, I'm sorry, what "plug wires" are you talking about exactly? I can't seem to find any on the parts fische.

The best Marauder musings in this month's C&D lie not in Larry Websters' article on the KB car, but in Pat Bedard's column describing "authorized vehicles" (same issue, pg. 24). I quote, "This thing moves like a fullback earning fun money as a bouncer at Hooters. Leg into the four-cam V-8, and a happy howl comes out. I remember the days when big Detroiters could outrun and outswagger anything the foreigners could throw at us, and this 4300-pound jock takes me back to them. I'm thoroughly amused." Sounds like something Sarge might have said!

[RCSignals]

The plug wire comments and Accord comments in the article are out of line.

I finally picked up the issue. One thing I find interesting is comparing the Marauder S numbers data and price to the also featured "Goldstrand Signature Edition Corvette" numbers data and price.
The little 281 cu in Marauder S looks pretty good in performance next the the 422 cu in Goldstrand 'vette

[RCSignals]

Here is a link to the Autoweek article



Web version (http://www.autoweek.com/cat_content.mv?port_code=autow eek&cat_code=reviews&loc_code=index&content_code=01859921&1759041956)


Printer version (http://www.autoweek.com/cat_print.mv?port_code=autowee k&cat_code=reviews&loc_code=index&content_code=01859921&90695904)