Slap an Escape, got hit in return [Archive] - MercuryMarauder.net Forums

View Full Version : Slap an Escape, got hit in return

snowbird

01-14-2006, 06:49 AM

Yesterday early in the morning, we had the perfect conditions for black ice formation. About a mile from home, going to work, there was an Escape on a stop in front of me. I was about 30 feet away, maybe at 10 miles an hour coasting myself to the stop and (this just happened in a second and a half – two seconds) felt a massage under the brake pedal. Yes, black ice. Too late. Since the #?$%*&%?(*%?% ABS kicked in with rage on the ice, I had virtually ZERO PSI brake pressure allowed and did slap the Ford Escape in the back at maybe 7-8 miles an hour (a passionate kiss would have been my favorite but I found out later it was a slap). My last mistake (hit) was 20 years ago, sh--.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com[IMG] /><o:p></o:p>
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PLEASE DON’T LOOK AT THE PICS RIGHT NOW. Rather, ask yourself what would you think would be the damage costs and read on the following extra info:<o:p></o:p>
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PLEASE DON’T LOOK AT THE PICS RIGHT NOW. Rather, ask yourself what would you think would be the damage costs and read on the following extra info:<o:p></o:p>
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- The Escape was showroom stock with 2 male passengers aboard, about 3 900 pounds total, the smallest (lowest ?) SUV from Ford in the market The whole intersection is covered with the finest quality black ice, very slippery. He is finishing his stop (off the brake) and just at the verge to give it the go pedal to be on his way.<o:p></o:p>
- The Marauder was about 4500 pounds with me , alone, aboard. My actual setup is stock springs in front but quite a bit taller 235-70-16 winter tires on steelies. The front end is about an inch and a half higher than stock which should help frontal collision. I’ve got some mods but beside a 100 pounds or so penalty, nothing to influence the outcome beside a behind the grille intercooler which was very lucky NOT TO BE TOUCH. We’ve got (so I thought) a strong body on frame design and the car is known to survive severe cop duty and New York taxi usage, in short: a Sherman tank. Finally, I’ve got the kinetic energy on my side (or was it ?) at 7-8 miles an hour and hit with virtually no nose dive with the ABS very busy.<o:p></o:p>
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The result: When I hit, I heard one of those terrible sound of metal and plastics being bent and crushed. The Escape went, like a pool ball (pretty funny sight I might add) in a split second on the other side of the intersection on the slippery ice. Luckily, the one before last car that did his stop was about 50 feet away, out of harms way. My car just did like when you hit the white ball very low with the stick. It stopped right at the Escape spot, quietly idling (I know, I know, a white ball doesn’t idle. It was just an image).<o:p></o:p>
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We cleared our cars from the intersection, exchanged coordinates in a civilized way. No arguments, I’m in fault ( I did not did the American graffiti movie trick to yell at him that HE backed up on me !) The Escape had a slightly bent hitch and a slightly, maybe a quarter inch deeper, intact bumper cover and no apparent other damage.<o:p></o:p>
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I had only three teeth lefts in the grille, the bumper cover was stabbed trough by the Escapes hitch and scratches on the top edge were seen (evidently, his bumper slipped on the top on mine. The stabbing effect of the hitch might as well have helped to keep the 2 bumpers absorbing the energy). The bumper wasn’t recessed like the Escape. The lights, hood, fender were intact except a slight off adjusted stance from the hood. The intercooler unit and tubing, transmission cooler lines were intact, no leaks. I was still pretty pissed but very lucky in the same time.<o:p></o:p>
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I called my boss for a day off and went to a body adjuster afterwards. The car needs: a grille, a bumper cover, the two under the skin plastic crash-energy absorbent and the big backing plate that hold the grille and lights and other front end parts. Parts= 3100 CDN $ and 1 700 CDN$ labour, taxes and paint = 4 800 CDN $ total or 4 000 US $. I just found out that there aren’t anymore springs in the bumper architecture to absorb energy or steel for that matter. Just about very costly moulded plastics that are very trigger happy to crack. And the fight with the insurance adjuster is not started yet. That will be my next Monday morning happy hour. When he’ll found out the price of a bumper cover (over 2 000 CDN$ with taxes) …<o:p></o:p>
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NOW LOOK AT THE PICS. Pretty amazing as the damage don’t look AT ALL like the price of repairs.<o:p></o:p>
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4 grand for a slight touch on a stop? I’m not so proud anymore. Where is that body on frame strength ? I know it’s my fault. I just lost it on the ice. BUT Damn with those kinds of very costly design, greed from the insurance guys, body guys and manufacturers that come to dig in my pockets like that. Sorry for the rant but IMO, in the fifties, I would have probably just rechromed the bumper for 20$ with no other damage. And ABS, yes it is good but again IMO - maybe - it should be switch adjustable, with a off feature below 10 or 20 miles per hour. On the ice, it give you NO BRAKE for a trade in control. Control isn’t everything. Technology in the plastic industry isn’t everything when replacement costs isn’t taken into account. They should think a little more about the consumers interest too.<o:p></o:p>
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The car will survive this and so do I. I’ll check closely the body guys on their way to repair the car in a professional way. The New York taxi bumpers, aka those Australian ones, don’t look so bad anymore isn’t it ?.<o:p></o:p>
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One last thing. I won’t laugh anymore at those Friday the 13th freaks !!

Bluerauder

01-14-2006, 07:08 AM

NOW LOOK AT THE PICS. Pretty amazing as the damage don’t look AT ALL like the price of repairs.
Sorry to hear about your incident. :( Repair costs always look deceptive. Sounds like your airbag didn't even deploy. ???

My son had a similar incident (without the ice) when he "tapped" the rear end of a Nissan Pathfinder at slow speed with his '98 Mystique. Repair cost was $3850 as I recall. Insurance impact was much, much worse .... :rolleyes: He hit the rear mounted spare on the Pathfinder.... which took out the grill piece, cracked the headlights, buckled the hood about 6", and tilted the radiator back about 6". It was still driveable to get it to the body shop; but looked like H3LL !! :o

jimlam56

01-14-2006, 07:11 AM

Sorry for your bad day!
Repair costs seem quite high, you ought to check around to see if you can get the bumper cover cheaper.

snowbird

01-14-2006, 07:13 AM

Sorry to hear about your incident. :( Repair costs always look deceptive. Sounds like your airbag didn't even deploy. ???

Yeah. Luckily, they didn'y deploy.

merc6

01-14-2006, 07:17 AM

front bumper support still looking good since they are rated 5 mph?

snowbird

01-14-2006, 07:23 AM

Sorry for your bad day!
Repair costs seem quite high, you ought to check around to see if you can get the bumper cover cheaper.
That's the tricky part. The body guy told me the stab can be repaired for about 250$. And that's probably what he will be suggesting to the insurer. The insurer is likely to jump on that alternative ... As for the price, the dealer offered a rebate but since it will going to pass trough the insurers, is offer would be only valid if I would be the buyer. That's what he said. Greed, greed.

snowbird

01-14-2006, 07:26 AM

front bumper support still looking good since they are rated 5 mph?
Well , the support didn't survive. It was cracked at 2-3 places including the plugged supports for the grille. It's a 500 hundreds $ something part that will have to be replaced.

Hotrauder

01-14-2006, 07:41 AM

Snowbird, yours looks a lot like mine, except I also lost the drivers side headlight and marker light asssemblies. I also had one of Zacks great custom badgeless grills and my heat exchanger/radiator for the S/C was damaged. The car wash has paid the tab. $4951.00. Sorry for your misfortune but the repair costs based on mine seem to be about the same. Not right but the same. Dennis:cool:

MM2004

01-14-2006, 07:49 AM

Condolences,...Know how that feels :bigcry:

BTW, the below damage was ~$3,500.00 IIRC and all plastic/fiberglass.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/files/2/9/8/9/WreckFront2.JPG

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/files/2/9/8/9/WreckFront9.JPG

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/showcase/files/2/9/8/9/DSC00003.JPG

TripleTransAm

01-14-2006, 09:27 AM

Sorry to hear about the impact, Yvon.

While these cars are built on a sturdy frame, it's all the little exterior bits and pieces that will break on an impact. Short of an armour-plated box with no trim on it, there's nothing keeping an accident from adding up $$. Keep in perspective that if it had been a smaller unibody car, you would have had to spring for fenders and a hood as well, along with any other internal structural damage.

By the way the Escape slid after the impact, I'd say it was more than just black ice... we're talking sheet ice. Down here, we've been getting rain for a few days and the temps will drop tonight, I will most likely be experiencing your driving conditions this afternoon and evening. And unfortunately I have no choice but to be on the road, with my entire family in the car... I will allow extra braking distance with this in mind.

With the road surface this bad, ABS or not, you would have slid. The coefficient of static friction is higher than the coefficient of dynamic friction, usually. That means the grip between two surfaces is higher when they are not rubbing or sliding against each other. Same reason why it's always harder to get a large piece of furniture moving from rest, and once it's moving it's easier to keep it moving (ie. not as much force required). So in this situation, it's a comparison between having very little contact friction between a sliding tire and ice, and alternating between having occasionally better braking force between a gripping tire and the ice and having no braking force at all. It's the latter that gives the tire a chance to keep the car in control (or respond to steering), as the sliding tire won't care what direction it's pointed in as it's sliding. ABS doesn't pull braking altogether... it just very quickly alternates between allowing the wheel to grip the road and applying the desired braking force, as long as it sense a difference in wheel speeds as you apply the brakes.

The coefficients of friction are directly related to the tire compound. Do you have a good ice tire? My driveway is slightly downhill and earlier this week I was testing the ice situation by idling forward and jamming the brakes... the ABS did go bananas dealing with this ultra slippery situation as the car slid forward without hardly any braking... after almost 2 seconds of this, I began to worry but the car slowed to a halt, on an icy slight downhill. That means the compound really works hard to grip on ice. Not all winter tires have good ice performance, there isn't much that a tread design can do to grip on hard flat ice... it's all about the compound.

Best of luck with the repairs. In the meantime, you can always buy a Mercury front badge and market your new design: you can compete with the popular badgeless grille design with your patented grille-less badge version! :lol:

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=84 15&d=1137246166

HwyCruiser

01-14-2006, 09:58 AM

Oh man, that sucks Yvon. Good luck with the repairs, and may I suggest that you get a winter beater that'll take a good crack or two at a trailer hitch.

snowbird

01-14-2006, 10:05 AM

Sorry to hear about the impact, Yvon.

Best of luck with the repairs. In the meantime, you can always buy a Mercury front badge and market your new design: you can compete with the popular badgeless grille design with your patented grille-less badge version! :lol:

Triple T,
Thanks for the elaborate answer and the laugh at the end :)

snowbird

01-14-2006, 10:07 AM

Oh man, that sucks Yvon. Good luck with the repairs, and may I suggest that you get a winter beater that'll take a good crack or two at a trailer hitch.
Thanks JD,

I was thinking about a beater for winter ...

blackf0rk

01-14-2006, 10:31 AM

The reason it costs so much is because they charge the insurance so much. It's an endless cycle of increasing insurance costs. Plus, they charge an arm and a leg for labwhore (labor).

stevengerard

01-14-2006, 01:21 PM

bummer, they sure add up. My quarter panel dent and repaint of the bumper was 1700. But I only needed one part - a tail light and I got it here from "the Dealer"

Dark_Knight7096

01-16-2006, 12:34 PM

Sorry to hear about your car man, that sucks. I know how angry I was at my accidents. I'm still really angry about them and i try not to think about them, I will be regaining your ranks as soon as I possibly can though. I hope you nothing but the best with your car and the repairs.

MarauderMarc

01-16-2006, 09:20 PM

Pretty good excuse to go with a custom grille.....Zack, heres where you come into play.

ckadiddle

01-17-2006, 08:33 AM

Ouch. Explains why I stay insurance-poor.

Marauder2005

01-17-2006, 10:04 PM

You knocked the cars teeth out!

Hope everything works out :(