Manual Transmition

[RR|Suki]

Ok I know I have a problem, but I really miss manual. Most guys when they leave the track, like getting in an automatic and lettin it do the work (or so I'm told by the older guys). Me I don't consider shifting work. I love it, so there in lies the problem. I know at some point I'm gonna try it, so I might aswell start lookin now.

Here is what I'm not asking...1- I'm not asking how hard it would be, cuz I already know... I'm plenty aware of what is involved, and really seeing as none of my drivetrain is stock anymore I'm not that concerned.

2- I'm not asking about a cobra trans cuz that's been tried...

3- I'm not asking if I will like having a manual, cuz I already know.

Here's what I am asking...

1- The tranny in the DB9 will it bolt up, is ford that cheap that maybe just maybe they kept the bolt pattern?

2- does ford make any particularly heavy cars over seas that may have a really heavy duty manual trans?

3- would a company like b&m etc. perhaps make such a trans?

4- would a manual trans from a ford truck work? seeing as they use the same auto trans?

any educated guesses would be good thanks :D

[Rider90]

Paul may know the answer to some of your questions as I think he has the only Marauder with a manual transmission.

http://www.paulshp.com/contact.html

Good luck!

[RR|Suki]

Also I had the idea that maybe the manuals from the F-150's and such should work, since they use the same auto trans, and should be strong enough...:confused:

[MarauderMarc]

Transmition?

[RR|Suki]

yeah yeah transmission, I was doin too many things at once when I typed thread :nono:

[MarauderMarc]

Just given ya crap! Im not the perfect speller either. Hukked ohn foniks werkd fer mhe!

[cyclone03]

I,like you,long for a stick.......
Contact D&D they can hook you up with a Tremac TKO600 5spd,that will hold up without a problem,they have the bell housing,clutch(but not linkage) and other parts that will get you started.

The drive shaft,because of it's length,may give you trouble because of vibration at high speeds,but even this remains to be seen....


IMHO! The problem(s) Pauls has with the stick in his Marauder is two fold...
First the power level of his car with the cobra powerplant.
Next the weight of the car,in real life 4400lbs on the track and 5000 or so full of people and stuff.Thats a lot of weight add 350-400(or even 500) flywheel HP and you could be a clutch drop away from walking.



You will have to play with the rear gearing to get the punch you want off the line and cruising down the highway,I think you'll want something in the favorite 4.10-4.56:1 range the over drive in the TKO can be .62 or .82:1.
You could run the stock 3.55 but from a dead stop it will feel kinda dead even with the 3.27 first gear in the trans and become nothing but a clutch punisher with a 2.95:1.
We got a heavy car and dropping the converter will make the engine have to do all the work.

The plus will be at all speeds above 30mph,if your in the right gear the car will feel great with the solid connection from engine to wheels.
Good luck,somebody needs to step up and just do this.

[Zack]

Problem is, 4400lbs and a stick shift dont work well together when you want to go fast without breaking things.
Ive seen Paul break his Marauder once and heard he broke it several other times.

[gpfarrell]

I hear you on enjoying a stick... I flew 1400 miles to get a clean, old-style F250 with 4wd, extended cab, a 460 and the "gotta-have" 5-speed.

Anyhow, I'm not sure a truck tranny would be what you want. Most of them are designed to be in trucks. They typically have much longer shift throws and the synchros aren't set-up for quick shifts. Also, the internal gear ratios might not make any sense for a Marauder. Maybe they would?

Technically, I think what you really need is a bellhousing capable of mating the MM engine to a stout car tranny... I'd think Mustang peices would be the most viable solution for the mechanicals.

[94_302]

What about the tranny in the SRT-10 Ram? That is far from a lightweight and is setup for performance. Is it any beefier than a regular viper t-56?

[RR|Suki]

What about the tranny in the SRT-10 Ram? That is far from a lightweight and is setup for performance. Is it any beefier than a regular viper t-56?

that is the idea I'm going with, there are very heavy cars out there with clutches and manual... the SRT-10 as you said, the DB9, the vanquish (kind of, it has a f1 type shift), maybe some fords build in other countries, the GTO isn't exactly a light car (comes in a around 3800 dry), and I'm sure there are others. This can be done that's why I'm not so interested in the why it can't be done, I know full well what won't work... cobra trans, that doesn't help me. I'm lookin for info on perhaps a different ford application that might use the same bolt up, maybe from a different country, or off of their Austin Martins or something...

[cyclone03]

I said it before I'll say it again.....

ddperformance.com

They list the torque ratings of the T-5,t-45,T-56 Cobra/Viper,Tremec/TKO500/TKO600

They also have install kits including the bell housing you'll need.
I think you could break all of them at the drag strip trying to hook it up in a Marauder, but that Tremec I had never had a problem with 450hp running 11's in my street driven Comet!

On the street and at the trackwithout stickiesI think a TKO would out last our current auto.But you would use up clutches...:)

[rayjay]

From what I've read you should also upgrade the crank and bearings to handle the increased force.

[RR|Suki]

From what I've read you should also upgrade the crank and bearings to handle the increased force.

see sig already done :D ;)

[RR|Suki]

I said it before I'll say it again.....

ddperformance.com

They list the torque ratings of the T-5,t-45,T-56 Cobra/Viper,Tremec/TKO500/TKO600

They also have install kits including the bell housing you'll need.
I think you could break all of them at the drag strip trying to hook it up in a Marauder, but that Tremec I had never had a problem with 450hp running 11's in my street driven Comet!

On the street and at the trackwithout stickiesI think a TKO would out last our current auto.But you would use up clutches...:)
Thanks :bows: :D :D :D :banana2:


BA9 Ford/Viper4.6(Mech.Speedo) 650 lb-ft 2.66 Close Ratio(b) $2999 (http://ddperformance.com/images/46viper001.htm) hells yeah

[rayjay]

see sig already done :D ;)

Doh... :o should learn how to read

[AzMarauder]

I said it before I'll say it again.....

ddperformance.com

They list the torque ratings of the T-5,t-45,T-56 Cobra/Viper,Tremec/TKO500/TKO600

They also have install kits including the bell housing you'll need.
I think you could break all of them at the drag strip trying to hook it up in a Marauder, but that Tremec I had never had a problem with 450hp running 11's in my street driven Comet!

On the street and at the trackwithout stickiesI think a TKO would out last our current auto.But you would use up clutches...:)

Perhaps give some consideration to the cast vs. forged crank as well !
The standard trans will put a lot more stress on the crank!

[RR|Suki]

Perhaps give some consideration to the cast vs. forged crank as well !
The standard trans will put a lot more stress on the crank!
see sig ;) the only thing not redone are the heads

[MikesMerc]

Problem is, 4400lbs and a stick shift dont work well together when you want to go fast without breaking things.
Ive seen Paul break his Marauder once and heard he broke it several other times.

This about says it all. In order to successfully move a marauder fast with a manual you'll need a steel crank, possibly a main girdle, heavy duty flywheel and clutch, tremec trans (or better), upgraded u-joints and driveshaft, beefy rear end (with a girdle), and some 31 spline (or better) axles.

Its not just the fact that the Marauder is heavy. Becuase we all know we've seen very heavy manual transmissioned cars. The issue is that the entire Marauder driveline needs attention if you plan on putting it through the torture. It was never designed to withstand the punshiment.

That don't mean it can't be done. You just can't expect a trans swap will be the end of it without significant breakage issues. The entire driveline needs a soup to nuts upgrade.

[Blackened300a]

That don't mean it can't be done. You just can't expect a trans swap will be the end of it without significant breakage issues. The entire driveline needs a soup to nuts upgrade.

In Other Words, Get used to the Auto or go buy a Cobra.

[RR|Suki]

In Other Words, Get used to the Auto or go buy a Cobra.

why would I go buy a slower car? that would be silly... again read the sig, all the building up is half done, that's why I said IN MY FIRST POST I'm not interested in knowing how hard it is or all that I need to upgrade...

The rear end will be built up by the time I decide to go ahead with this, my motor is already built and driveshaft and such are already upgraded.I know these things, all I'm looking for is a tranny strong enough :rolleyes:

[AzMarauder]

why would I go buy a slower car? :rolleyes:

:lol:

03/04 Cobra.. slower car.... :rofl:

[Rider90]

why would I go buy a slower car? that would be silly... again read the sig, all the building up is half done, that's why I said IN MY FIRST POST I'm not interested in knowing how hard it is or all that I need to upgrade...

The rear end will be built up by the time I decide to go ahead with this, my motor is already built and driveshaft and such are already upgraded.I know these things, all I'm looking for is a tranny strong enough :rolleyes:
Your car is just that, your car. Don't let anyone discourage you from doing what you want - skipping past the nonsense - I don't think you'll find many more answers in this thread. I think the next best thing is to call up some pros and get their opinion, and the first person to call should be the guy that has been there and done that at Pauls High Performance.

Good Luck!

[RR|Suki]

:lol:

03/04 Cobra.. slower car.... :rofl:

you honestly think a stock cobra could out run me? maybe with my stock shoes on....

[AzMarauder]

you honestly think a stock cobra could out run me? maybe with my stock shoes on....


Don't get your panties in a wad....

Stock.. no I don't... best times for Stock Cobra driven VERY well usually came in around 12.80 or so.

But figure out the amount of money you've spent on your car to date. Divide that in half.. spend that on an 03/04 Cobra...

$2500-$3000 spent intelligently and the 03/04 Cobra will run DEEEEEEEP into the 11's.

Ah yes... I think the Cobra would out run you...

[RR|Suki]

Don't get your panties in a wad....

Stock.. no I don't... best times for Stock Cobra driven VERY well usually came in around 12.80 or so.

But figure out the amount of money you've spent on your car to date. Divide that in half.. spend that on an 03/04 Cobra...

$2500-$3000 spent intelligently and the 03/04 Cobra will run DEEEEEEEP into the 11's.

Ah yes... I think the Cobra would out run you...

I bought my car for 24k... you can't get an 03 cobra for 24k ;).. oh and 9k miles

[AzMarauder]

I bought my car for 24k... you can't get an 03 cobra for 24k ;).. oh and 9k miles

I'd have to agree with you there... Cobras held their value a lot better than the Marauders...

But since we are just discussing this... how much money (round figure) do you have in your car? (Purchase price... and whatever additions and repairs you've done to it?)

What horsepower are you turning RWHP?

[RR|Suki]

I'd have to agree with you there... Cobras held their value a lot better than the Marauders...

But since we are just discussing this... how much money (round figure) do you have in your car? (Purchase price... and whatever additions and repairs you've done to it?)

What horsepower are you turning RWHP?

well if you wanna be technical around 5K purchase and all, seeing as I'm paying for it... 6 months of payments, down payment and 1500 for the rebuild dispite being my car I had nothing to do with the issue, and I was getting a full rebuild and a bore out of the deal so I agreed to 1500.
hmm lets see oh 100 and some for some springs and $20 or so on oil filter for the pcv line... $7 for a pcv valve... hmm so $5127 total. As far as power too much, I need to go have it reduced me thinks. 5.1L plus 14psi is a bit too much :nono:
As I've seen it I've made out quite well, better than I would have on many other cars

[cyclone03]

Thanks :bows: :D :D :D :banana2:


BA9 Ford/Viper4.6(Mech.Speedo) 650 lb-ft 2.66 Close Ratio(b) $2999 (http://ddperformance.com/images/46viper001.htm) hells yeah


I think that the 2.66 first gear would need a lot of rear gear to get a Marauder moving,4.56 or so.

McCleod builds some very high dollar clutch set ups ($2000) called Soft Loc (I think) that will go a long way to help keep the trans together.
A little know fact about new vs. old manuals (like the Top Loader from the 60's) is the old gears were "softer" as well as much bigger.These old boxes could take a real hammering compared to the new stuff.The "old School" clutchs hit hard and cause many of the transmission problems the new boxes have.
Softening up the "hit" (letting it slip a little) allows the torque to build against the gear instead of just hammering it.This "slow build" of torque helps the newer,harder,gears live.

This may help a manual Marauder live at the track.

All that said,and I love a stick,your set-up would 1/4mile,or 1/8 mile quicker with an automatic.
Now road racing,open track,or just plain driving the stick will out fun the auto everyday even in traffic if your a man.

[RR|Suki]

I think that the 2.66 first gear would need a lot of rear gear to get a Marauder moving,4.56 or so.

McCleod builds some very high dollar clutch set ups ($2000) called Soft Loc (I think) that will go a long way to help keep the trans together.
A little know fact about new vs. old manuals (like the Top Loader from the 60's) is the old gears were "softer" as well as much bigger.These old boxes could take a real hammering compared to the new stuff.The "old School" clutchs hit hard and cause many of the transmission problems the new boxes have.
Softening up the "hit" (letting it slip a little) allows the torque to build against the gear instead of just hammering it.This "slow build" of torque helps the newer,harder,gears live.

This may help a manual Marauder live at the track.

All that said,and I love a stick,your set-up would 1/4mile,or 1/8 mile quicker with an automatic.
Now road racing,open track,or just plain driving the stick will out fun the auto everyday even in traffic if your a man.

I'm really not worried about drag racing honestly. I'm a street/road track guy
so I'm not even concerned with dumping the clutch at 5k... that's just silly, I like driving my car, I drive my car every single day I drive. Again not concerned about drag racing.

[MarauderMark]

How about a automatic with a manual valve body with a hole shot t/c so you can still get half(shifting) of want you want w/o all the clutch and modding that goes with it.would this be another option?

[RR|Suki]

it would be if I wanted it for the launches and what not. I actually just enjoy having a clutch. shifting when I feel like, that sort of thing. even with a manual valve body, I still only have the choice of 1 or 2.:D

[jimlam56]

I'm really not worried about drag racing honestly. I'm a street/road track guy
so I'm not even concerned with dumping the clutch at 5k... that's just silly, I like driving my car, I drive my car every single day I drive. Again not concerned about drag racing.
I agree with your desire for a manual, and am more interested in everyday driving and road racing also. Please keep us informed on this project if you decide to go forward with it.