Here's a new one for ya....

[natedog1284]

Well, kinda. My passenger side head is ticking! What a surprise! Problem is, these aren't stock heads; I have FR500 heads. I had the stock ones replaced because one of them was cracked, (from the factory I would guess) and was causing the car to overheat, (which is probably why it was traded in with only 15,000 on the odometer, and after 4 thermostats failed to fix the problem). So what gives?! I read that loose valves in the stock heads were the cause of a lot of ticking /blue smoke on startup, (which I used to have, btw), but now I have a completely new set of racing heads and cams, and I still have ticking, but no blue smoke, thank God. So what the heck is going on here? I only noticed it this morning, when I had the radio off, so I don't know if it's been doing it since I got it back, but I guess it probably has. Is this just the nature of the beast, do I have a piston/connecting rod/bearing/block problem, or are my heads fubar again? I seem to get a different diagnosis everytime I go to a different place; getting a straight answer around here is like pulling teeth. I'm going to call Ford Racing Performance Parts tomorrow, but in the mean time, I figured I'd tap the pool of infinite Marauder knowledge to see what you guys had to say. Any ideas? Thanks.
-Nate

P.S. there is absolutely no sign of overheating this time; the temp. needle points right at 20 on the speedo.

[RR|Suki]

I asked VT (the guys who built my motor) Cuz I have a slight tick. They looked at em for me and said all was good, it's just a sound the valvetrain has sometimes the fact that I don't have any smoke or anything, and my tick is pretty quiet makes a diff too. I would imagine that an extra loud tick + smoke is a very different sound.:confused:

[natedog1284]

I don't have any smoke or overheating like I said before, and at idle the heads are a little noisier than stock heads, but I don't think that's bad. It's just when it rev's to around 18-1900 rpm that it seems louder, and at any time after that, it ticks when the rpm's are increasing; in other words, it does it at said rpm range all the time, and at 2000 and up, it won't do it if the idle holds at any given speed, but it will when the idle increases until it holds at another speed, at which point it quiets down again. Also, it doesn't do it when the idle drops, just when it increases. It also appears to be coming out of the forward side of the passenger head. It almost sounds like "piston slap" when in that rpm range, but no where near as bad, and I haven't noticed any oil consumption/loss of gas mileage as people with GM's have experienced.
Below is a link to a sound clip from a GM comiserators' site:
http://www.pistonslap.com/photos.htm

As I said, mine is no where near as bad; I only noticed it when I had turned the radio and heater off. And again, it otherwise runs great, starts normal, my gas mileage is just like it was stock, and there is no smoke on start-up. Oh, and one other thing; when it's really cold out, when you can really see the steam from the exhaust, there is more steam/exhaust visible from the passenger tailpipe than from the driver's. I don't know if that means anything, but it's just an observation I made before I even heard any noises.

[Zack]

I had a similar noise after when my engine was re done.
Turned out the Large camshaft sprocket bolt came loose and rattled around.
Luckily I got under the valve cover before any damage occured.
Pull the valve cover and look around.

[thePunisher]

nate where did you buy your car? i test drove a black one last year at shakers lincoln merc...half way thru the test drive it began to overheat....and it had 15000mi on it....did you buy from them???

[natedog1284]

Lol, yes it was them, I bought my car just over a year ago. Didn't do it to me for a while, but then it became a regular occurance, (heat up, cool down, heat up cool down) then the cooling down part just stopped.

Zack, thanks for the suggestion. I'll pull the cover off this weekend and look for any loose/missing parts. Do you by chance happen to know the torque values for tightening those down?

[thePunisher]

wow small world...i almost bought that car...i remember when i drove it the radio was missing.......did they fix the heads under warranty??? ...a loose cam sprocket will definitely cause a noise....

[Paul T. Casey]

You say a slight tick. I've heard what some people think are valve ticks which are nothing more than the injectors clicking. Also, check the exhaust sealing (either header to block, or manifold to block). A small leak here my also sound like a tick. IMHO, no smoke no worries.

[natedog1284]

wow small world...i almost bought that car...i remember when i drove it the radio was missing.......did they fix the heads under warranty??? ...a loose cam sprocket will definitely cause a noise....

Yeah, sometimes I wish you had, lol. I was delayed 2 days because they had to take it up to Hartford to put a new radio in it. No, they did not fix the heads, because it was diagnosed after I had the headers put on. Not wanting to fight with the warranty nazis I just had the FR500's put on. This solved the overheating problem, sure enough, but now this has me a little concerned.

Paul, I tend to want to agree with you. There is no smoke, it doesn't run hot, doesn't use oil or coolant, so I'm thinking (with fingers crossed) this may just be a characteristic of these heads. It is more than just a tick; it's noticeably louder in one spot than in any other. As I said, these heads are noisy, and I can live with that; I just don't want to have to rebuild my bottom end. I'm gonna call Ford Racing when they open today, to see if they can give some thought to the issue, then I'll call the shop that put them on. We'll see what they say.

[hitchhiker]

Well, kinda. My passenger side head is ticking! What a surprise! Problem is, these aren't stock heads; I have FR500 heads. I had the stock ones replaced because one of them was cracked, (from the factory I would guess) and was causing the car to overheat, (which is probably why it was traded in with only 15,000 on the odometer, and after 4 thermostats failed to fix the problem). So what gives?! I read that loose valves in the stock heads were the cause of a lot of ticking /blue smoke on startup, (which I used to have, btw), but now I have a completely new set of racing heads and cams, and I still have ticking, but no blue smoke, thank God. So what the heck is going on here? I only noticed it this morning, when I had the radio off, so I don't know if it's been doing it since I got it back, but I guess it probably has. Is this just the nature of the beast, do I have a piston/connecting rod/bearing/block problem, or are my heads fubar again? I seem to get a different diagnosis everytime I go to a different place; getting a straight answer around here is like pulling teeth. I'm going to call Ford Racing Performance Parts tomorrow, but in the mean time, I figured I'd tap the pool of infinite Marauder knowledge to see what you guys had to say. Any ideas? Thanks.
-Nate

P.S. there is absolutely no sign of overheating this time; the temp. needle points right at 20 on the speedo.

I have a question if you don't mind.

What are FR500 heads and are they a good performance mod?

Thanks,

Dave

:)

[Warpath]

The 03 Cobra heads that were recalled had bad valve guides. Maybe your FR500 heads were built with the same guides.

[natedog1284]

The 03 Cobra heads that were recalled had bad valve guides. Maybe your FR500 heads were built with the same guides.

Perhaps; that's something else I'm going to look into. I called Ford Racing this morning, and they told me it was more than likely an improper tappet gap. He also told me this was not really a serious problem, just an annoyance; in other words, it won't cause any damage. I called the shop that installed them as well, and he suggested it was an exhaust leak, but I'm thinking no. The bolts aren't loose at all, and the noise is very localized to the front part of the head. I'm bringing it back there on Monday, so hopefully they can take a quick look at it (and they better not charge me!)
As far as the exhaust, (more out of the passenger-side tailpipe), I think this is nothing more than just a slightly crooked muffler. (It's not draining the condensation like it should, so it steams up more than the other side.) I also noticed that there was water droplets under the driver's side, and not on the passenger's side, which would seem to substantiate this theory. (BTW, I can't take credit for that, as it was explained to me by a former mechanic I work with, who worked for a Dodge, Ford, and a Chevy dealership.) But, in the mean time, until I get it looked at, I'll take it easy on it, just to be on the safe side :)

As far as the heads themselves, they are the same heads/cams used on Ford Racing's FR500 race car, (google it, you'll learn more than I can tell you) (Here's a link to the heads: http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField= 5398) I do know it had about 415 flywheel horse and I believe it was naturally aspirated (don't smack me if I'm wrong please, I'm just going by my very faulty memory!) Anyway, the guys at Ford Racing claim they will add about 60 horses to a naturally-aspirated or supercharged car, when combined with the right parts. I have all (well, my own version) of those, and although there has been some debate among some guys here as to whether or not that claim is true, I can honestly attest that if you intend to stay NA, then this is the way to go. The idle sounds pretty much stock, despite the cams, and I DEFINATELY got all of 60 hp out of them. But, they are expensive, so between these and a supercharger, well, choose wisely. (I wanted to make it about as fast as I could NA, then supercharge....hey, I'm single, I might as well spend money on my car! :D) By all estimates, I should have between 350 and 360 rwhp, and this is substantiated by the fact that my friend's 400 horse (at the crank) 1988 Z28 Camaro and my car are dead even from a stop or from a roll, and we've probably raced in the area of 20-30 times (when there are no ricers to toy with!) I have yet to get some actual dyno numbers, as I missed my last appointment because I was sick (sick enough to miss my dyno appt.; yes, it was that bad). Ok, I think I've done enough typing here. I just wanted to thank all those who put in their .02. See, this is why I love this site; everyone helps eachother out. You guys rock! I'll let you all know what happens on Monday. Thanks again.
-Nate

P.S. Below are pictures of the exhaust, (taken with my phone) so you can all see I'm not crazy! :lol: It's not at all as white as it looks in the pictures, it's just steam. If it was that white I'd know I had a problem!

8914 8915

[rayjay]

Great info Nate, Thanks. Me be thinking you have more HP than your buddies Camaro if you are dead even in a race. How much lighter is his car? Hope the head issue is not major. Keep breaking ground young man, we'll be watching :D

[natedog1284]

Great info Nate, Thanks. Me be thinking you have more HP than your buddies Camaro if you are dead even in a race. How much lighter is his car? Hope the head issue is not major. Keep breaking ground young man, we'll be watching :D

Aye sir, that I will. :) His car is about 3600 lbs, give or take, and like I said, from a dead stop and from a roll, we're dead even; even on the highway, and I had an extra person, (whom I call "the ballast", but is known here as 2003CTMarauder, (sorry Tim :P )). We've never raced with just me and him; our friends/brothers are always along for the ride. LOL we were each hoping that our respective cars would be faster then the other's, but such wasn't the case. I guess that's what we get for competing :rolleyes:. Anyway, it sounds like this is not a major issue, so I hope and pray it will get resolved on Monday.

[thePunisher]

nate if you want me to have a listen when i have time i will...i live right around the corner....im a ford master techician....ive heard my share of engine noises.....

[natedog1284]

nate if you want me to have a listen when i have time i will...i live right around the corner....im a ford master techician....ive heard my share of engine noises.....
Well isn't that convenient! I believe I'll take you up on that, if you're free on Sunday. I'll send you a PM when I'm back in town. Thanks!

[SergntMac]

nate if you want me to have a listen when i have time i will...i live right around the corner....im a ford master techician....ive heard my share of engine noises..... When you're considering things, consider valve lash adjusters. It's been my experience they are very sensitive to oil weight and stick compressed. Loosness like this will result in a tick. Just an idea, good luck.

[thePunisher]

yep...or if the oil is too heavy they over pump...and hold the valves open...only in extreme cases....

[natedog1284]

You know, come to think of it, I remember reading on the reciept that they used Royal Purple 10w-30 rather than the 5w-20 that is clearly written on the oil cap :shake: . Think this could be an issue? And if it is, then shouldn't I just be able to change it back?

[thePunisher]

imo...i dont think the oil is that much heavier to cause any real problems...but next time i chamge it id put the recommended oil in.....

[2003CTMarauder]

Aye sir, that I will. :) His car is about 3600 lbs, give or take, and like I said, from a dead stop and from a roll, we're dead even; even on the highway, and I had an extra person, (whom I call "the ballast", but is known here as 2003CTMarauder, (sorry Tim :P )). We've never raced with just me and him; our friends/brothers are always along for the ride. LOL we were each hoping that our respective cars would be faster then the other's, but such wasn't the case. I guess that's what we get for competing :rolleyes:. Anyway, it sounds like this is not a major issue, so I hope and pray it will get resolved on Monday.

Ballast!!! What you calling me fat:lol:

[natedog1284]

No, just huge....

[2003CTMarauder]

No, just huge....

Ok just checking:flamer: