Blown "Blown" engines

[Dan]

The confessional is now open. :)

The cars are 4 years old now if you consider that an 03 MM could have been bought in 02. Many of us have installed various power adders to our cars.

Let's start a tally to see whose blown engines have blown. Please confess only if you have had an engine blown AND that engine was upgraded with either a turbo or a super charger (either variety.) Then let us know whose kit you had installed and how many miles you got before the "blow."

Thanks. I think it will be interesting to see if what data we can collect on this.

Best,

Dan

[RoyLPita]

I know of 4 Trilogy engines that blew.

[Smokie]

You are not interested in blown engines that were not blown?.........

[Breadfan]

I'd list all blown engines, NA and blown. If blown, don't just state the kit, also state if it was the stock kit or if you modded beyond that. Unfair to any kit to say the motor blew under it when in reality you had pulley changed it to run 13.5psi on our non-forged motors.

I think this can be very informative and an interesting thread, sadly though my stock ticker is indicating a rise in the price of "JiffyPop" stock...let's hope that is wrong.

[RF Overlord]

I concur with Smokie and Breadfan...to have this poll mean anything, you need to know both ends...how many have a power adder AND how many of those have broken.

I've had my power adder for a little over 11,000 miles and a recent UOA shows the motor to be in good shape. I realise of course that a simple UOA is not like a thorough tear-down would be, but if my motor were starting to disintegrate, I think it would show up in the oil analysis as a higher wear-metals count and mine is going down...besides, if Dave's (MI2QWK4U) insane motor hasn't come apart yet, I feel reasonably confident that mine won't... :D

[RoyLPita]

I know of 4 Trilogy engines that blew.
Correction make that 6.
Trilogy 1 (was there to see it happen)
Lidio's
Five O
Buckwheat (Logan's #2)
Joe B (stupid salesman and manager put 87 octane in and floored it)
G-Man (valve fell apart)

Vortech (4)
NAVCHAP (2)
MarauderMark (2)

Paxton (1)
RR/Suki

Procharger (3)
Maraudernkc (prototype)
Too Many Fords
Tmac1337

Turbo (1)
Todd

u/d pulleys (1)
Mad 3R


This is just from memory. However, I could be wrong.

[Breadfan]

The main reason to include NA is that if you want to analyze failures of these engines based on mods you want to know your baseline failure rate of a motor that is NA. There's a very fair number of motor failures in the NA category, so logical to assume those with blown blown motors may have had a failure if they stayed NA.

Obviously any blown motor will have a higher probability of early failure, but the NA motors aren't perfect in terms of their ability to stay together...I know a few personally who can attest to that...

Also extremely important to indicate boost levels or other items (NOS for example). The kits out there are tuned and setup for a certain PSI that is deemed safe, anything beyond that is adding more risk to this game. Adding NOS to either NA or blown motors does the same thing.

[TooManyFords]

Yep, as Breadfan says, mine was not the stock FIT kit. I went with a more radical pulley putting me in the 13psi range and ran it that way for 25000 miles before it went out with a wimper... (actually that was me that wimpered that night, but thats a story when someone buys me shots!)

LOL

If this next motor pops, I'm going all the way to a 557 385-series and put the new blower on that bad boy! Not that I'm trying to do this, just so everyone knows I do have a backup plan. You play, you pay!!

John

[Rider90]

I know another Vortech that has been blown up, but the owner shall speak for himself.

Mine is still together, but I'm sure the clock is ticking.

[BigGuyBigCar]

Dan -

As a research scientist, I can tell you now that your survey will not give us any useful results. There are too many variables. Obviously (as others have pointed out), what else has been done to the engine, but also how it has been driven. WOT now and then? Burn-outs? Street racing? On the track?

[MikesMerc]

Without knowing the full population of ALL blown cars by brand along with those that blew up (so you can run a calcualtion as a % of SC cars that blew up) the stats are meaningless. And, as a few have already stated, you must account for any and all mods beyond the stock kits. Driving habits including track use are important too. As are extenuating circumstances such as bad gas, etc.

[Dan]

Guys,

Who started this thread? :)

I mean no disrespect but hardly any comments in this thread, so far, have answered the original post in the manner which was requested.

Not complaining, just pointing something out.

I'm not looking for impirical nor scientific data. I am just looking to "rough it out." If someone else wants to go scientific on this I welcome that but I don't have the time or desire to get too technical on this point.

Rather than starting a new thread let me restate the original request....

Please confess only if you have had an engine blown AND that engine was upgraded with either a turbo or a super charger (either variety.) Then let us know whose kit you had installed and how many miles you got before the "blow."

If you know of someone whose blown engine has blown AND you have all of the specs feel free to post on their behalf. Otherwise, please don't put up any numbers at all unless they are your own.

Thanks,

Dan

PS: If my manner of addressing this seems too terse it is not intentional. I'm not upset in any way and I'm not trying to be terse. I am being hollered at by my wife to get off the computer and don't have time to pretty this up all that much. :)

[Smokie]

I don't think Dan was trying to be scientific, just wants a head count: how many? what kind? Sometimes simple is best. Since he is the one asking the question, only he can decide how useful the feedback he recieves is.:)

[Dan]

:up:

Yes. If, after giving the requested info, someone wants to "confess" with details like other mods, how they were driving at the time or if they did something that they felt was "dumb" that would be good.

Like I said, it's a confessional. :)

Best,

Dan

[FiveO]

Might blew in very very late March.

Being rebuilt as we speak. Got another little surprise today when I stopped by the shop...you're not going to believe it...

I was pushing 450rwhp, 13.5psi boost, Kooks, custom Lidio tune, etc, etc, etc....all the goodies.

More pics in my thread in an hour or two.

PS: Mine is Trilogy Kit #48...wait..lemme check my shirt...yup #48 :)

[BigGuyBigCar]

Dan - I apologize for getting up on my chair, but it's partly your fault for using the "d" word (data), when what you meant was the "s" word (story).

[Marauderman]

All this seems to be is a post to start a war on whose engine blew and what kind was it and whose was it from to make one think that the engine from that particular person was the problem or cause=-===notta gonna go there=-I don't think we should tally ourselves in such a post number thingy.......its unfair to the provider and the buyer of said S/C'er--cause there are too many factors that caused the engine to go "phoop"---

So I ask you all-- WTF does this post represent and provide --NAGDT!!..
my 2 c's

[merc]

I would like to see this tread continue. I may not ever get a supercharger, but always interested in the information that other share on this site. It’s terrible to have an engine failure that is caused by a modification, abuse, or an undetermined problem. No one is proud about talking about personal disasters, but sharing personal experiences is what this site is all about

[FiveO]

My blown engine was caused by one thing...what several of use have done here...:

Push the envelope between safe with stock internals : and unsafe. There is a fine line.

Its somewhere around 450rwhp or just above.

If you look at the blown engine list lets see who was above this...? I haven't been around in awhile but I can tell you playing with fire will get you burned...and 450rwhp is the 451 Farenheit level... :)

Play with fire and you're bound to get burned. It may not happen now but it will happen. It did to me and I'm rebounding and coming back stronger than ever.

I would personally say that 400rwhp shouldn't have any problems on the stock internals. I've had experts say this (some on this board)...and I've had engine experts say this (not on this board).

That being said....I'll be at 450rwhp once again... (about 2 weeks) and am looking forward to 450 not being the break point anymore.

No matter what S/C you run (as this isn't a S/C war thread)...do what you want...but remember that 450+ is putting you into dangerous territory.

[MM03MOK]

All this seems to be is a post to start a war on whose engine blew and what kind was it and whose was it from to make one think that the engine from that particular person was the problem or cause=-===notta gonna go there=-I don't think we should tally ourselves in such a post number thingy.......its unfair to the provider and the buyer of said S/C'er--cause there are too many factors that caused the engine to go "phoop"---

So I ask you all-- WTF does this post represent and provide --NAGDT!!..
my 2 c's^^^ my personal feelings too ^^^

[FiveO]

I don't agree with that statement at all.

Lets air it out. What engines blew and what caused it...IE: Mods.

Might give some people looking at various s/c's a look into what works and what doesn't.

And I'll stand by my statement. Doesn't matter what S/C you have....450+rwhp is pushing the envelope.

[BUCKWHEAT]

Ok. Ok. I admit it. I blew up my S/C engine. Driver error, not mods. Simply rev'd the stock pistons beyond their known max RPM. Piston goes (#8 worst), then the rods go, then the block goes. Did it on the road course as I blew past a Corvette. How embarrassing. The Peanut Gallery quoted four feet of flames coming out the exhaust pipes as the raw gas got there.

Dropped the rev limiter to 5800 on the replacement stock engine. So far, so good.

[FiveO]

No harm BUCKWHEAT! We've all been there.

You push a Supercharged Marauder (any S/C) and you're bound to blow it...the stock internals were not made for this type of HP over long periods. Add a few mods in there...Kooks, good tune, intake..etc...and its bound to happen.


Lets get it out there and show what the weak points of the engine are. Looks like rods/pistons...for me it was the stock rods...both of them!!! :D

[Breadfan]

This thread DOES have value, let's discuss who has lost an engine.

Let's do both NA and forced induction. List the mods on the engine at the time of failure. For blowers, list the pulley setup (stock, modded) and the PSI.

I for one would like to see the info. It's out there, it's facts. Post the facts, no speculation no opinion, what's the harm in that? Shouldn't be any.

[Dan]

Dan - I apologize for getting up on my chair, but it's partly your fault for using the "d" word (data), when what you meant was the "s" word (story).

Nice try. :)

You're forgiven, just the same. :up;

Best,

Dan

[Bradley G]

I got about 4k after the Trilogy install, Ist oil change disaster.
I'm blameing a faulty drain plug!:eek:

[FiveO]

I just wanna get RoylPta's post edited to add my Trilogy in there.....nothing like being in the same post as Trilogy 1 and Lidio :D

[Dan]

Marauderman and Mary,

The last thing this thread is is an attempt to reignite a war abour chargers. Remember, I was here during those dark days. I saw the headaches they caused. Also keep in mind that I personally have started more than one charger discussion AND successfully moderated them myself to ensure that there would be no flare ups. Just check my post history to verify that. You'll see it's true.

With that history, please take my word that I am simply asking because I just thought it might be interesting to know. Nothing more than that. :)

All the same, thanks for contributing to the thread.

To the rest, please, let's continue to keep this on the up and up. So far we have been and for that, you are all to be commended. :up:

Best,

Dan

[Bradley G]

That is good company!:D
I just wanna get RoylPta's post edited to add my Trilogy in there.....nothing like being in the same post as Trilogy 1 and Lidio :D

[FiveO]

Amen Bradley!!!

Please include me in the list!!! :D

[MM03MOK]

Not a problem, Dan. The thread is still open and being productive for those that want to contribute. Carry on....

[FordNut]

I blew my motor in March. Home-built ProCharger D1SC setup, not a FIT kit. Pushing 474 RWHP. I know it's pushing the envelope, did it anyway. Actually ran it like that several months and several passes on the drag strip. Blew it due to stupidity. Redline was set to 6700. I was doing a burnout and didn't want to bounce off the rev limiter so I was feathering the throttle around 5800-6100. That put it in & out of the WOT fuel table, went lean, detonated, two wrist pins fell out onto the track.

[LVMarauder]

i think your smelly

[stevengerard]

I have the ticking noise now but knock on wood, 476 rwhp and 20k miles no problem. 26 passes in one morning at Milan at MMIII and no problems.

[RoyLPita]

Amen Bradley!!!

Please include me in the list!!! :D

Consider it done.

BTW, Being MM.net's official OASIS reporter, I have seen about 10 engines being replaced under warranty. Now these may be stock or with some small mods.

[Smokie]

This thread could turn out to be one of the most helpful ever if it's handled the way it's should be: A member that had a bad experience come's out and says " this is what went wrong and this is what I believe caused the problem "

It should be about helping other members to avoid a bad experience by sharing what went wrong. If any jerk tries to turn it into anything other than that...the post should be deleted and he/she should go on vacation for a while.

[juno]

:2thumbs: for Smokie. If you don't like the thread then:tmi:



This thread could turn out to be one of the most helpful ever if it's handled the way it's should be: A member that had a bad experience come's out and says " this is what went wrong and this is what I believe caused the problem "

It should be about helping other members to avoid a bad experience by sharing what went wrong. If any jerk tries to turn it into anything other than that...the post should be deleted and he/she should go on vacation for a while.

[gpfarrell]

This thread could turn out to be one of the most helpful ever if it's handled the way it's should be: A member that had a bad experience come's out and says " this is what went wrong and this is what I believe caused the problem "

It should be about helping other members to avoid a bad experience by sharing what went wrong. If any jerk tries to turn it into anything other than that...the post should be deleted and he/she should go on vacation for a while.

Thank you Smokie, and Thank you Dan.

As much fun as it is to hear about 11 second cars, I don't have any intention of turning my Mercury into one. I really appreciate the people that have, because we can all learn from others' mistakes, and that would be a big reason to have a community.

I'd learn more from hearing about how to keep a high 12 / low 13 car together for 120,000 miles. Read any of Dan's threads... he's always an open-minded peace maker, and I see nothing in this post to suggest anything different.

Suggesting otherwise is, IMHO, just stirring the pot without adding any new flavor.

[Dan]

I like it when folks "get my back." :) :up:

What Smokie says is good. Anything that we can learn to help us, even if it is learned from negative experiences, is good.

I haven't gone the charger route yet. I plan to. In the meantime, I'll try to keep soaking up what others have learned like a sponge.

So, does anyone else have a "blown" blown engine story to tell?

Best,

Dan

[Dan]

Not a problem, Dan. The thread is still open and being productive for those that want to contribute. Carry on....
LOL. Thanks for reminding us of your admin powers and for clearing us to carry on, Mary. :) :P

Just some lighthearted ribbing. Not trying to get under your skin.

Have a great Memorial Day weekend.

Best,

Dan

[MM03MOK]

LOL. Thanks for reminding us of your admin powers and for clearing us to carry on, Mary. :) :P

Just some lighthearted ribbing. Not trying to get under your skin.

Have a great Memorial Day weekend.

Best,

Dan One kind Subject has given me a new title "Her Omnipotence." :eek: :woohoo:

You have a great weekend yourself. :D

[Breadfan]

Yup, yup, I agree with whats been stated.

This thread will be very useful as a place for people to see what went wrong, and most importantly WHY. This sort of info is invaluable for anyone considering forced induction or other engine mods.

One of my biggest recommendations to folks is to buy smart, understand exactly what you are buying, and how it fits into what you want. That leads you to the right choice.

The biggest part of that is understanding the dangers and making sure you are OK with them and prepared to deal with the worst. Just being ready to accept all possible outcomes to a degree that makes you happy about your purchase.

It also gives people and understanding that when they deviate from the original specs of any kit they introduce more probability for failure and need to understand that. Some may be uniformed and think a $70 pulley is all it takes but aren't prepared for the potential consequence of running a non-forged motor with 13psi of boost - not just the results but the probabilities.

[sailsmen]

I think a lot can be learned on engines that have not blown up.

How many miles were on it when you S/C, how many miles since s/c, how many 1/4 runs before and after s/c?

[N40GL]

I know another Vortech that has been blown up, but the owner shall speak for himself.

Hey Jason, I didn't blow my motor up - I just air conditioned it!

Seriously, I sheared the top off the #8 piston whilst I was beating a couple of 'vettes, and the connecting rod flailed around in the motor and put two nice-tennis-ball-sized holes on either side of the rotating assembly. As I'm fond of saying, my car suddenly tried to do an impression of James Bond's Aston Martin (if you remember the scene from Goldfinger, where the AM blew smoke out the back as Oddjob is chasing him in the Mercedes). 9# of boost, 93 octane, %@$&$% powdered-metal motor and internals.

Now, a year later, and after an experience with a disreputable engine builder who is better left unmentioned, I'm back. 460HP on Bradley's dyno, with a Cobra motor, Vortech T-Trim, 14# and a 90MM MAF. What a project! Kids, don't try this at home.

BTW: I want to make a lamp out of the old rotating assembly. Anyone have any ideas how to mount the darn thing on a block so it doesn't fall over?

[Breadfan]

Now, a year later, and after an experience with a disreputable engine builder who is better left unmentioned, I'm back.

He wouldn't happen to be from Canada and be on TV sometimes would he?

You know, by the time we decide what we want we may need a new thread! :lol: j/k

[N40GL]

He wouldn't happen to be from Canada and be on TV sometimes would he?

Nope - he's in Illinois, and there are a few of us unhappy with his work

[MikesMerc]

I haven't blown an engine in the maruader, but I did do a preventative tear down. I learned a lot from that. I also learned a lot from my previous cars build ups. And by watching others and seeing what works and what doesn't. Here are my conclusions.

1. There is no hard and fast set limit for safe power levels. I've seen 400rwhp cars blow up, and seen 500rwhp set ups live. Rule of thumb says 450rwhp, but that can vary quite a bit depending on other factors (tune, octane of gas, driving style, etc).

2. 480rwhp is not inevitable pending disaster. My motor made that kind of power for about 15,000 miles and it still looked fresh when I tore it down. All ring landings were intact. No scorching. No discoloration. Looked great.

3. The three most important things to getting a supercharged motor to live is tune, tune, and tune. See number 2 above. Avoid detonation at all costs. If you want to run more than 400 to 420 rwhp, do it on race gas. It may be expensive, but it is THE best insurance. The octane of race gas covers ALOT of sins.

4. No matter the best layed plans, ***** happens. I've seen mild SC motors blow up. I've seen forged motors blow up. Its a fact of life.

5. If you have a SAFE tune and watch your gas quality, you can have a SC motor that lives for many many miles.

6. Most failures come from something besides the inherent power found by SCing. Usually detonation from bad gas or an overly aggressive tune.

The end.

[Rider90]

Well said Mike, thank you.

[SergntMac]

I know this thread means well, but it's on the verge of being offensive.

No one should be posting any 411 on something that did not happen to them personally...First hand.

It's no one's business what has happened to any Marauder until the owner himself owns up to it, i.e. wants it known publically. This thread is borderline "outing", and I don't favor that in any environment, on any topic. For many reasons, personal privacy should be valued, and respected.

OTOH, such a story from a true owner and direct from "this happened to me", is prolly the best story we could hear. If so, why chance/dilute this quality by dicing up the important details with third, fourth, and fifth-handed versions of what broke and why?

No one should be talking about vendors, or, engine builders involved either.

Some day, someone will read all this and eventually come to say that Trilogy kits "blew up" X number of Marauders, Vortech blew up X, and ProCharger kits blew up X, and they will cite the 411 posted in this thread as their source.

In reality, this isn't truthful 411. For reasons I've just stated, this also leads to misinformation and eventually, becomes borderline slander against innocent parties.

Keep in mind that the MM.Net doesn't just share information among Marauder owners, it carves Marauder (by VIN) and owner (by screen-name) in historical stone.

IMHO, I'd like some of my Marauder owner history to remain private. Not that any of it is a secret from y'all, rather I'd like to have some control over when it gets discussed, with whom, and why. I'm funny this way, only I know what has been modified on my #1x, and my #3, let me tell those stories, eh?

If you want to participate in this "confession" as a first hand "it happened to me" experience, go for it. A lot of us will learn from your mistakes.

If you need to "confess" about someone else's "sin", remember what "confession" is about, and then then tell your story. IMHO, outing others to the public is not cool, and we don't learn any real truth about the circumstances, do we?

Just my .02C, carry on gents...

[Marauderman]

My thoughts as well-Mac--.very well put I think---....Tom

[Dan]

Mac,

I'd rather have first hand experiences. Those stories are the best.

It was my intention to not gather so much data that this became a "stat" thread. Rather, I just want to hear from folks whose engines - with power adders - have blown.

I don't really see all that much wrong with it. None of us really thought that a blown enging was going to have as much reliability as a bone stock one, right? That being the case, let's see what we can learn from the unfortunate ones.

Best,

Dan

[juno]

Pretty much! :D
Can we put the few owners who have responded in a new thread and leave this one open for the *****in' and moaning about it.:D



You know, by the time we decide what we want we may need a new thread! :lol: j/k

[Dan]

I'll start a new thread.

[Dan]

I have made a new thread on this topic called "Blown Engine Confessional."

The URL is http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?p=383264#post38 3264

Will those who have posted first hand experiences please take the time to copy your post to the new thread? There are a number of us who would like to have this info in one convenient location.

Will a moderator please close this thread. It has gone so far off topic that it got killed along the way. There's no point in keeping it open since most of the discussion was about how the discussion should happen. :)

Best,

Dan