Black Box question

[de minimus]

I recently had an unfortunate incident when a manual transmission challenged driver rolled back and collided with my front bumper. No damage to the MM aside from a slight crack in the licence plate holder. $600 damage to the Mercedes C230 that rolled into me. Predictably, and I make no comment about the relative honesty of people today, the driver of the Mercedes alleged that I hit her, and the insurance company agreed with her. Does anyone know whether the balck box would record sufficiently particular data that would show I was stopped at impact? Your collective knowledge is appreciated.
Tim

[MENINBLK]

Doesn't the insurance company have enough history to know
that a vehicle that is at rest sustains the least amount of damage ??

And for a measley $600, why is she bothering with the insurance company at all ???
Doesn't she know how much this is REALLY going to cost her now ???
Some people have absolutely no sense at all.


If she is determined to follow this route, then you need to talk to your insurance agent
and let them counter this woman with a fraudulent suit, and that you have the proof to discredit her.
You will see how fast her story changes....

If our Marauder has a Black Box, it only has 30 seconds of data at most.
Chances of the data still being there after the accident are slim to none.
Your accident didn't involve forces that were great enough to employ the airbags, did it ?

[BAD MERC]

Obviously her car was a manual tranny - use that as an argument. How is your driving history VS. hers? What was the condition and angle of the road? Were there witnesses? Is she young? Tell them you were honking and she was oblivious to your horn and apparently dancing in her seat while she coasted backward into you. LIE man!!! If you have to of course. It works for our government.

[MitchB]

Black box recorders were installed in a small percentage of randomly selected vehicles. This was not publicized. In the event of a catastrophic collision, the recorder could be recovered and the data from the last 30 seconds or so extracted. Insurance companies know where to look for these data recorders. In your case, if you had a recorder and unless you shut your car off immediately following this incident, the data would have been lost.

Mitch

[Blue03]

Bummer... sorry to hear about the mishap! I think you are bucking the old "hit from behind" insurance adage where the one hitting from behind always pays. Even in a He says, She says, it looks like you're gonna get thumped unless your own insurance company will go to bat for you. Good luck!

[JMan]

It is unlikely your Restraint Module recorded anything in such a minor collision. Was there a police report made? Leave the prosecution to your insurance company - that's what you pay them for and it's actually their t*t in the wringer! Oh, our recorders only hold about one second of info at the time of Airbag deployment or near-deployment. That incident doesn't sound anything like a near-deployment.

Best Luck,

J

[SergntMac]

Davis Car ChipEX...Google it.

I must be lucky...All three of my Marauders have a freeze-frame section in the PCM, which records the last 20 seconds of vehicle behavior prior to a sudden stop, or, "hard brake event". It also records the first 20 seconds of a WOT event, as well as date and time of the event.

This data seems permanent, I can clear DTC and other things, but not this "accident log" data. Not even disconnecting the battery for long periods affects it in any way. Eventually, it gets overwritten in time, I think it stores up to 300 hours of vehicle data.

It can be read (downloaded) with a Davis Car ChipEX, and twice now I have assisted local PDs investigating officers involved in collisions, so, it's available from CV/PI computers as well.

I don't think this is air bag/restraint system data, but it's there nonetheless. I would offer to loan you my Davis Car ChipEX, but your description of the collision says there would be nothing to read, other than any data from your last HBE or WOT prior to the collision. If you are like me, you may not want that data revealed to your insurance company.

[GreekGod]

quote:

"I think it stores up to 300 hours of vehicle data"

If I understand correctly:

1) Sudden stop, hard braking and wide open throttle events are stored in some '03-04 Marauders. ("Black box recorders were installed in a small percentage of randomly selected vehicles")

2) Said data can and will be used against you in a court of law.
a) if your MM "CPU" has this feature
b) if your driving caused or contributed to an accident

3) Said data could also prove innocence.

4) Having stored accident data revealed in a court of law
could possibly reveal driving behavior days or weeks prior to
an accident.

[alarmguy]

For a good description of Crash Data Recorders go here:

http://www.harristechnical.com/cdr.htm

On this page is also a link to a list of all vehicles with them. It doesn't list the Marauder, but includes the GM and CV so I assume the MM has one also. I don't think yours would have any data as there wasn't an airbag deployment.

[SergntMac]

Well...Like I said before, I don't think this is crash data, as described by the link to Harris Technical. However, it is present, and accessible through the OBD II port. http://www.davisnet.com/home_flash.asp

quote:

If I understand correctly:

1) Sudden stop, hard braking and wide open throttle events are stored in some '03-04 Marauders. ("Black box recorders were installed in a small percentage of randomly selected vehicles")

2) Said data can and will be used against you in a court of law.
a) if your MM "CPU" has this feature
b) if your driving caused or contributed to an accident

3) Said data could also prove innocence.

4) Having stored accident data revealed in a court of law
could possibly reveal driving behavior days or weeks prior to
an accident.

1) Not some, all. In fact, of the 25 some automobiles I have used the Davis product on, including some imports, I have not found one yet that doesn't have this data available for downloading.

2) What can be used in a court of law changes with every case before the court.

2 a) Reasonable expectations of privacy are dynamic in today's society, the best answer I have, is "could be." However, remember that when you sign you car into a repair station and hand the key to an employee, the car is now in his custody, and he could grant permission for collecting the 411 from your PCM without your permission. As I type this, it's not a seizure, but a legal harvest.

2 b) This topic has yet to bleed through the courts, however, the greater danger for us as a motoring consumer, is the possibility that our insurance company could require random harvesting at their whim, or, cancel your insurance.

3) What proves guilt declares innocence, it depends on what happened. One of the cops I mention in my previous post, was accused of engaging in an unauthorized chase when he got t-boned at an intersection. This was proven untrue by the PCM data. However, it could have hung him out to dry, had he been involved in a chase. Good or bad, it's data, and what saves you hangs the other party.

4) At least the last 300 hours, according to Davis, but I'm not here to sell a product. IMHO, it's there and I can read it. Dyno pulls from 2004 reporting WOT to 139 miles per hour, are still in my "accident log."

Hmmm...May I should download what's in there from our trip to Barry's last weekend. It was reported to me that Zack really entertained Steve (KillJoy) in a drive through the countryside...Nah, I don't wanna know.

[KillJoy]

Dyno pulls from 2004 reporting WOT to 139 miles per hour, are still in my "accident log."

Hmmmmph....is that all it goes? :D


It was reported to me that Zack really entertained Steve (KillJoy) in a drive through the countryside...Nah, I don't wanna know.

I STILL got that grin on my face! :D

KillJoy

[SergntMac]

Hmmmmph....is that all it goes? :D



I STILL got that grin on my face! :D

KillJoy Nope, that was a dyno pull to 6200 RPM in third.

YOU (you little bastage) went 158 MPH!

I never should have looked...

[GreekGod]

Mac said:

"4) At least the last 300 hours, according to Davis, but I'm not here to sell a product. IMHO, it's there and I can read it. Dyno pulls from 2004 reporting WOT to 139 miles per hour, are still in my "accident log.""


I think it is 1984 and Big Brother is watching. Remember when 1984 seemed so far in the future? We still had a DuMont b&w 19" TV until about 1972/73. I never imagined we would have TV's and cameras everywhere you went.

I probably better go turn myself in for bad thoughts. I might get off easier that way. I envision my probation officer getting alerts by satellite from my MM if I violate traffic regulations in the State of Michigan.

The aluminum foil helmet I wear at bedtime has shielded my thoughts from Homeland Security (so far, I think). I better go wrap the PCM in the MM, too.

[KillJoy]

Nope, that was a dyno pull to 6200 RPM in third.

YOU (you little bastage) went 158 MPH!

I never should have looked...

:bows: :awe: :woohoo: :up:

I highly doubt it went that fast with ME behind the wheel!

KillJoy

[pantheroc]

How is that 300 hours obtained? With KEY ON? Maybe I'll disconnect my fuel pump and other items and leave KEY ON for days at a time to clear it out?