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View Full Version : Methanol For Trilogy? Questions, questions...



04MEMA
08-11-2006, 07:53 PM
Hey Lidio,
I was reading on your site about the benefits that methanol injection offers. I was thinking even with a standard Trilogy setup methanol could be great for getting consistant performance even on really hot, humid days. It's like a supercharger for your intercooler ;-). Lower intake temps and better octane rating could provide a nice benefit here. What are your thoughts on:

How hard would it be to add this on to our cars?
What kind of ball park investment would it be?
How much methanol does a setup like this use? Like how many 1/4 mile passes could be made on a gallon or whatever the common size container would hold?
And finally, where do you buy the methanol and how much does it cost?


Thanks,
Jeff

Hotrauder
08-12-2006, 06:13 AM
Good questions and in the right forum for all the poop. I know that Lid has been working with Mustangs and he may have a kit ready for us???? Rich long is all over this also. Sounds like a plan/. Dennis:)

O's Fan Rich
08-12-2006, 08:12 AM
How hard would it be to add this on to our cars? EASY, but Depends on kit.
What kind of ball park investment would it be? I paid $400.00
How much methanol does a setup like this use? Like how many 1/4 mile passes could be made on a gallon or whatever the common size container would hold? I'm using about a gallon of 50/50 mix a week (300-400miles)
And finally, where do you buy the methanol and how much does it cost? I buy mine from a racing fuel supplier locally. $3.00 a gallon. Then I mix it with water from my dehumidifier, 50/50.


Thanks,
Jeff
My reply to this is above. This is Lidio's forum and he may have a product HE sells to accomplish this. I'm sure he will get back at you.

KillJoy
08-12-2006, 08:17 AM
:hmmm:

This is now something I MAY be interested as well......

KillJoy

MI2QWK4U
08-12-2006, 03:55 PM
Lidio and I are going to come up with a custom setup for my Marauder. We planned on it earlier in the year, but both have been busy and got sidetracked on other projects. Lidio plans on a 100% mix of Methanol. He reccomends using straight Methanol from a reputable dealer, we use VP brand and it comes in a 5 Gallon jug for around $30 if I remember correctly. Primarily I want the ability to keep the timing and boost levels at race gas settings, but running the meth and 93 octane in the tank. I also want the cooling effect on the intake charge. I really dont plan on trying more boost or a more aggressive tune as I am already pushing a brutal 512+ RWHP (Detuned from 525 rwhp) on a stock engine block.

MI2QWK4U
08-12-2006, 03:56 PM
Here is a post by Lidio earlier in the year, may help answer some questions.



All the kits I’ve done so far are on supercharged Mustangs. Mostly with non-intercooled Vortech supercharges because of its over whelming popularity (Vortech blowers) do to lower cost and OEM like look and simple install.

Most non-intercooled Vortech Mustang 4.6 2-valve and 4-valve end up with about 9psi of boost and a 2V manual trans will make about 340 RWHP and a 4V like a modern Mach-1 will make about 440 RWHP. This is with a tune that I would normally do that seems to hold up very well at these HP levels. Other tuners may be getting more out of these combinations but at this level I’ve had hundreds not have any short block failures. Now when I know these are gona get a Meth kit I immediately bump the boost by going to slightly smaller pullies, larger MAF’s and power-pipes which greatly increase the dia. of the feed pipes going into the blowers. This will usually make the boost go up about 3-4psi.. netting about 11.5 to12.5psi on both the 2V and the 4V. When the Meth is then properly installed and tuned into the mix, both the 2V and the 4V will gain about 60-80 RWHP. Putting the typical current 4V mach-1 at just over 500 RWHP and the 2V right at about 400 RWHP.

This stuff is basically like running race fuel when you need it, along with cooler inlet temps at the same time. As I’ve said on previous posts here and on my web site contrary to other tuners popular beliefs…. The stock 4.6L short blocks can safely make around 550+ RWHP!! I’ve done it with several cars that are running on dedicated race fuel with lots of boost. Some of these I did several years ago and are still being abused many years later with their original weak pistons and rods. The key thing is not to detonate the pistons at all and they’ll live. Now I cant say that I’m ready to push any 4.6s this hard with 93 octane and meth, but we’re getting very close to it on a couple 4V and 3V Mustangs.

This stuff is really starting to get popular in my area. It’s allowing me to really get my way with a lot of what we all want – Big power and boost and not be troubled by having to find and pay for race fuel. It’s working out so well that I’m not letting people do it to small boost applications, I’m making people really get their moneys worth and bump up the boost to a minimum of 12psi most of the time because you can with ease with this stuff.

I never promise people their motors will last forever but if you never detonate them all I can say is that the rings and bearing will eventually wear. I’ve got a lot of guys who have been making a lot more at the rear wheels for longer then most would have imagined and their still going strong. Unfortunately I have a lot of competitors who have brain washed people into believing that stock 4.6L’s cant handle more then 6-7psi of boost and magazines have proceeded to agree with and print this crap and its gone on to make a lot of folks scared to supercharge their 4.6s at all. My self and a lot of close friends and customers have known for about 10 years this is not the case at all.

Our Meth kits are more expensive then most others because they come 100% compatible with pure Methanol. Most other kits cant handle methanol with out being mixed or some thing like that. Our kits have a better and different controller then most others. Our Mustang kits included and brand new stock windshield washer reservoir so that the crusty old one isn’t used, and it includes a low level sensor as well. Plus our kits use all braided hoses too.

The mustang kits go for $575 and because of my shops clean, detailed and organized workmanship it takes us about 6-7 hours to fully install a meth kit. So we get $550.00 labor. This includes relocating the ACT sensor down stream from the blower and meth injection to better take advantage of the change in air temp and also pull timing if the air temp doesn’t drop do to a meth failure.

04MEMA
08-12-2006, 05:41 PM
Dave, Dennis and Rich - thanks for the info.

Rich - Have you before and after 1/4 mile times for your methanol injection? Even without a retune it should be cooling things down, therefore more power and better times/speeds?

An old friend of mine has been running this stuff in his GN's for like 15 years. I'll have to check with him. I ran into him about a year ago and he had come up with some new system for his 8 second race GN. I didn't really study it at the time, but now, hmmm....


Thanks,
Jeff

O's Fan Rich
08-12-2006, 05:53 PM
Dave, Dennis and Rich - thanks for the info.

Rich - Have you before and after 1/4 mile times for your methanol injection? Even without a retune it should be cooling things down, therefore more power and better times/speeds?


Thanks,
Jeff
No, I do not. I am using it as a "buffer" for poor quality gas and a good tune.
We may be able to check it out on Lidio's dyno on Wednsday, if there is time and we want to see if there is a difference there.
I can tell you this, when the meth kicks in, there is a noticable boosty as well as a "smoothness" ( for lack of a better term) to the engine.