View Full Version : Fried Another Engine?
This can't be happening to me.
Yesterday afternoon I was driving home on the freeway. Car was driving normally, when all of a sudden the temp gauge starts climbing rapidly. I'm on a section of freeway with no shoulder to pull off onto, in rush hour, and no exit for at least a mile or more.
I slow down as much as I can in rush hour traffic, put it in neutral and try to coast on downhills, turn the heater on as high as it will go to try to pull some heat out of the engine, but the thing is pegged at the top.
By the time I coast off of the next exit, the engine is rattling and clanging, and in my heart I know that it's fried. I park off to the side of the road, turn off the engine, raise the hood, wait about 30 minutes or more, until the temp guage is back toward normal. Crank the engine, drive a few miles until it starts heating up again, pull over, etc. Repeated this process for a couple of hours until I got home.
Had the car towed to the dealer this morning. Remember, my engine threw a spark plug last year and had to have a new engine installed. The new one has a 36,000 mile factory warranty, and I only have about 20K on it, so hopefully
this will be a warranty case.
The dealer hasn't called me yet with his diagnosis, but I'm betting this engine is fried.
MM2004
02-22-2007, 04:26 PM
I wish you were kidding. Keep us posted on what the Dealer says, Ok?
Best,
Mike.
Mad4Macs
02-22-2007, 04:37 PM
Hey Ross? Must be a Texas thing. Check out my new 'Stang in the College Station thread.
And yep... I'm settling in with a 6 pack (or two) right now
:lol:
Best of luck getting her fixed
DEFYANT
02-22-2007, 08:19 PM
They probably put your old t-stat in when they did the swap and now it's stuck.
superford3
02-22-2007, 09:04 PM
a super hot motor will make ping and clatter noise when its overheating so its not 100% that its fried
Drock96Marquis
02-23-2007, 02:29 AM
Did the Fail-Safe-Cooling activate?
MarauderMark
02-23-2007, 03:19 AM
Welcome to the 2 motor club.Thought i was the only one:D
Haggis
02-23-2007, 04:09 AM
Sorry to hear this news Ross.
Keep us posted when you find out what went wrong.
Sounds like you adopted a Gremlin from MarauderMark. You havn't been to the Mid-Atlantic lately, have you?
Actually, this will be motor number 3. Dealer called this morning and said that it needs to be replaced. I am in the process of arguing with them about the fact that my aftermarket parts did not cause the failure and should not void the warranty. You'd think the dealer wouldn't mind, it's Ford's money, not the dealer's. But they are saying no warranty right now.
Either way, I need the new engine, so I'm getting it on order.
Oh, well, I'll have a 100,000 mile car with a new engine...again.
Next car will NOT be a Ford.
Anyone here who sees me buying a Ford again has permission to shoot me on sight.
2003 MIB
02-23-2007, 08:31 AM
Actually, this will be motor number 3. Dealer called this morning and said that it needs to be replaced. I am in the process of arguing with them about the fact that my aftermarket parts did not cause the failure and should not void the warranty. You'd think the dealer wouldn't mind, it's Ford's money, not the dealer's. But they are saying no warranty right now.
Either way, I need the new engine, so I'm getting it on order.
Oh, well, I'll have a 100,000 mile car with a new engine...again.
Next car will NOT be a Ford.
Anyone here who sees me buying a Ford again has permission to shoot me on sight.
Sad news, Ross...I've been there (engine failure at 17K) and it stinks. What were the dealer's autopsy results?
2003 MIB
02-23-2007, 08:32 AM
Anyone here who sees me buying a Ford again has permission to shoot me on sight.
No way Buddy!!! You can get a ticket for that in Houston.:D
Blackened300a
02-23-2007, 02:47 PM
I am in the process of arguing with them about the fact that my aftermarket parts did not cause the failure and should not void the warranty.
What exactly is the performance part in Question?
Like Drock96Marquis inquired, why did the failsafe cooling NOT activate on your car?
I know I highlighted that in the service manual that these engines are suppose to deactivate 4 of the 8 cylinders in the event of an overheat condition to protect the car. And if you still don't shut it off during the "limp mode" then the ECM/PCM is supposed to shut down the entire car.
This better not be just some hype from Ford.
Are there any Ford technicians that care to comment on this subject?
Are we protected or not?
:mad2:
N40GL
02-23-2007, 03:53 PM
Welcome to the 2 motor club.Thought i was the only one:D
Nope - me too, thanks to the #8 rod. This new motor (v.2.0) is a Cobra long block.
Blackened300a
02-23-2007, 03:57 PM
I had a air pocket after changing my T-stat and the needle jumped up pretty high but not to the point of pinging and no safety mode kicked in.
This is actually the first Im hearing about any type of a engine safety for this car.
My 00 Impala and my 03 Avalanche had the limp home feature
ParkRanger
02-23-2007, 03:58 PM
Wow, that sucks. :mad2:
I'm interested to find out what happened. How long had you been driving when she topped out?
Please keep us informed. :confused:
PR :burnout:
Rider90
02-23-2007, 04:00 PM
I had a air pocket after changing my T-stat and the needle jumped up pretty high but not to the point of pinging and no safety mode kicked in.
This is actually the first Im hearing about any type of a engine safety for this car.
My 00 Impala and my 03 Avalanche had the limp home feature
The then-plastic coolant crossover on my 1999 Crown Vic burst and all of my coolant blew out from it. My CV limped home on a few cylinders, but made it thanks to Ford's designing of such a feature. Our MM's have the feature, along with a system that will shut off all post-fuse box electrical draw (Interior lamps, headlamps, etc..) after 30 minutes if I recall correctly.
rumble
02-24-2007, 11:41 AM
I know I highlighted that in the service manual that these engines are suppose to deactivate 4 of the 8 cylinders in the event of an overheat condition to protect the car. And if you still don't shut it off during the "limp mode" then the ECM/PCM is supposed to shut down the entire car.
This better not be just some hype from Ford.
Are there any Ford technicians that care to comment on this subject?
Are we protected or not?
:mad2:
Oh Oh. Are we talking oil pres gauge stuff?
That's a work of fiction too. My manual says to
be sure the oil pressure stays between 60 and 65 PSI.
Pure BS as we all know.
superford3
02-24-2007, 12:24 PM
not to start a e fight but the fail safe is that little temp gauge in the dash,if its overheating you shut it down regardless of where you are
Glenn
02-25-2007, 09:44 AM
Ross:
I am not an engine expert. But, how can the dealer honestly determine if your engine is ruined without pulling it out of the car and dropping the oil pan and pulling the bearings, inspecting the crank, etc. to check. You can pull the driver's side valve cover to look, but I am not sure that will determine very much. Yes, it may knock after it was cooled down, but still that does not necessary mean the engine is ruined??
Glenn
ChiTownMaraud3r
02-25-2007, 07:58 PM
Ross:
I am not an engine expert. But, how can the dealer honestly determine if your engine is ruined without pulling it out of the car and dropping the oil pan and pulling the bearings, inspecting the crank, etc. to check. You can pull the driver's side valve cover to look, but I am not sure that will determine very much. Yes, it may knock after it was cooled down, but still that does not necessary mean the engine is ruined??
Glenn
Exactly what I was thinking. Sounds like the dealer might just be looking for some work, which with a void warranty I can imagine the bill being through the roof having it done with them.
Exactly what I was thinking. Sounds like the dealer might just be looking for some work, which with a void warranty I can imagine the bill being through the roof having it done with them.
Well, it wasn't just pinging, it was smoking like crazy out the tailpipes.
If there is some Ford reference to the "fail safe" system, can someone let me know where it is? I'd like to talk to the shop about it.
Marauderjack
02-26-2007, 03:10 PM
Ross,
You'd be surprised what the engines today can endure!!:bows: I know you will certainly feel better with a new engine and so would I......:D
We had a 1994 Dodge Intrepid.....I was not a fan of the car but she thought it was "Purdy"!!??:confused: Water pumps were famous for failing in those cars and she was on the way home one day......it started rattling....temp gauge all the way up and smoking like crazy!!:eek: She stopped and began calling everyone on the cell phone.....said the car was moaning like Woooooooo........Woooooooooo.. ....(not whistler tips)!!:shake:
A neighbor called me and followed her home.....about a mile or so and it was clattering really bad and moaning too......Bad news!!:argue:
It was so bad that anti-freeze was coming out of the exhaust.....I just new the engine was toast!!:rolleyes:
Flatbed to the dealer the next day....new water pump....belt....vroom!!??:conf used:
That silly car went another 2 years and 30K miles WITHOUT A HICKUP...then her son got it and drove it pretty rough for another 2 years!!!??:shake:
Absolutely blew me away....so don't write yours off just yet....compression test....and other diagnostics may just surprise ya!!??:beer:
Good Luck!!
Marauderjack:burnout:
Commodore Crap
02-26-2007, 04:21 PM
when mine overheated over the summer,(i had the air bubble incident) the car got really hot and then i noticed an extreme lack of power and then it shut off. my motor isnt fried.
Well, it wasn't just pinging, it was smoking like crazy out the tailpipes.
If there is some Ford reference to the "fail safe" system, can someone let me know where it is? I'd like to talk to the shop about it.
Okay, found it.
For those of you who have the 2003 Crown Vic / Grand Marquis Workshop Manual (the Big Red Book), go to page 413-01A-4 and you will see 8 bullets under the heading Fail-Safe Cooling Warning Indicator.
I'm assuming the 2004's are the same.
It sounds sophisticated if it functions correctly.
Drock96Marquis
02-26-2007, 06:26 PM
Click:
http://www.supermotors.net/getfile/447104/thumbnail/fsc2.jpg (http://www.supermotors.net/vehicles/registry/media/447104)
Thanks for the info on the Fail Safe Overheat Mode. Is there any reference to this in the MM as opposed to the CV/GM? When I mentioned it to the dealer they acted like they had never heard of it. I'd love to be able to show them something in a Ford/MM manual about it.
This would be very important to me right now for this reason:
The dealer is saying (at least for now) that it looks like the fan motor failed causing the overheating. The fan motor is not a part of the engine, and is out of warranty even though the engine is still in warranty. Therefore, a warranted component (engine) did not fail. A non-warranted component (fan motor) did fail.
If I can show that a warranted part of the engine failed, I might have more leverage.
Thanks for any help.
jaywish
03-02-2007, 03:43 PM
From 2004
http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=10491&highlight=fail+safe
Jay
I went back and looked at my window sticker and it doesn't mention the Fail Safe system. My owners manual is in the car at the shop, so I can't check it to see if it says anything about it.
So, the bottom line, does the 03 MM have this system or not?
sailsmen
03-05-2007, 12:37 PM
No.
The only system I am aware of that does is the Caddilac NorthStar.
Loco1234
03-05-2007, 12:57 PM
Well I can tell you from exprience the 04MM doesn't have it...
...and it would really seem only the CV's and GM's have it...
that none of the MM have this feature...
it's a pitty too...
the feature works great...
I have it on my 2000 navigator... and had to use it once... it worked great... just don't try to floor it and expect all the normal power....
Just my luck. This engine is still in warranty, but the dealer is saying that the fan motor (not a part of the engine and therefore not still in warranty) caused the overheating. If there is a Fail Safe system on the engine, that would be a warranted part and I'd have a stronger argument.
2003 MIB
03-05-2007, 01:23 PM
Just my luck. This engine is still in warranty, but the dealer is saying that the fan motor (not a part of the engine and therefore not still in warranty) caused the overheating. If there is a Fail Safe system on the engine, that would be a warranted part and I'd have a stronger argument.
I'm sorry, Ross. That is bad news.
GreekGod
03-05-2007, 03:24 PM
Page 303-14-2 of the 2003 Workshop Manual (electronic engine controls) mentions the CHT (Cylinder Head Temperature sensor).
The CHT sensor is mounted on the wall of the cylinder head and is not connected to any coolant passages. It sends a signal to the powertrain control module (PCM) indicating the cylinder head temperature.
If the temp. exceeds 250 degrees F, the PCM disables four fuel injectors at a time. The PCM will alternate which fuel injectors are disabled every 32 engine cycles. The four cylinders that are not being injected act as air pumps, to aid in cooling the engine.
Above 330 degrees F, the PCM disables all of the fuel injectors until the engine temp. drops to approx. 310 degrees.
If the engine reaches critical temperature, the coolant temp. gauge pointer will read fully hot at approx. 250 degrees.
sailsmen
03-05-2007, 04:25 PM
If thats the case then why are engines being fried.
Motorhead350
03-06-2007, 12:27 AM
I'm on engine number two on my Marauder and engine number 3 on my truck. Tranny number 5 too. Hope this makes you feel better.
superford3
03-06-2007, 08:53 AM
this is why you have a temp gauge ,when its over heating you pull over and shut it down period
Page 303-14-2 of the 2003 Workshop Manual (electronic engine controls) mentions the CHT (Cylinder Head Temperature sensor).
The CHT sensor is mounted on the wall of the cylinder head and is not connected to any coolant passages. It sends a signal to the powertrain control module (PCM) indicating the cylinder head temperature.
If the temp. exceeds 250 degrees F, the PCM disables four fuel injectors at a time. The PCM will alternate which fuel injectors are disabled every 32 engine cycles. The four cylinders that are not being injected act as air pumps, to aid in cooling the engine.
Above 330 degrees F, the PCM disables all of the fuel injectors until the engine temp. drops to approx. 310 degrees.
If the engine reaches critical temperature, the coolant temp. gauge pointer will read fully hot at approx. 250 degrees.
This is a great feature, too bad Marauders dont have it.
There is no such sensor on our cars
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