S/C Alternatives... dont laugh

[LVMarauder]

Who thinks NOS is a viable option in adding some ummph under the hood. Theres a website that sells a NOS kit for the marauder, or so they say. They advertise anywhere from 80-120 hp increase and said nothing about tq. I know its been takin over by our ricer "friends" but no one has to know =) some of us with thinner wallets might choose this route. We know the engine can take the power no doubt. so let me know what you all think. Ill post the site later

[merc406]

No ones laughing, nitrous is awesome when done the right way.

[sailsmen]

Mustangs and Fast Fords has a good article on NOS in the current issue.

I am not a big fan of it. I would say 1/2 the cars in the magazine have it.

Having read up on it I am more open minded to it.

All you are doing is adding more oxygen.

[BillyGman]

will require more fuel. Otherwise there will be a lean condition, which will cause dangerous detonating within the combusion chambers. Ofcourse increased power is the positive aspect of NO2. The negatives are the inconvenience of having to refill the bottle from time to time. And this cannot be done at your neighborhood gasoline station where you get your gas. And also the durability issue of the bottom end of the motor(as with S/Cing). Nobody can say that you'll blow your engine w/NO2 or w/S/Cing, nor can they say that you won't. With a stock engine that wasn't engineered for NO2 or S/Cing, it will most likely depend on how hard you drive. So I would never try to tell you to use NO2 or not to use it. My personal preference is to stay away from it w/a stock engine. But I'll simply suggest to you that while making your decision to go w/NO2, keep in mind that there is good reason why engine builders and high performance parts catalogs offer engine kits specifically for the use of NO2 (as well as S/Cing). And in those engine kits, what is included are special pistons that have been designed w/the top piston ring landings to be further away from the tops of the pistons, than they are in stock pistons. This gives the piston more strength and durability than stock pistons since there's more "meat" (or metal mass) in the top of the piston. They are also forged pistons UNLIKE the stock pistons in the Marauder. So the pistons in those engine kits will be safer for NO2 use. And the pistons in these engine kits that are designed for NO2 use aren't the only things that are different than in a stock motor. They also include forged crankshafts and connecting rods as well which BTW our stock Marauders do NOT. Just some food for thought.;) And weather or not you blow your engine isn't the only consideration. But another is that even if you're convinced that you'll never blow your stock engine w/one of the milder NO2 kits, the question that you have to ask yourself is...How long do you want your engine to last? Do you really think that you can run NO2, and stay out of the throttle enough to allow your engine to still be very healthy after 50K or even 70K miles? I know that I couldn't. But that's my 4 cents.......

[Ross]

Some people saw a very fast (mid 12 second) MM up at Ennis. This car is owned by Bayway LM in Houston and has been modded and is raced by the guys at Strictly Performance in Houston. It is not SC, but it does run NOS. It is among the fastest MM's out there running consistently in the 12's.

[MAD-3R]

It's also Bored out to 5.0 L

[Ross]

Mad, I didn't know that car was bored. I rode in it (didn't get to drive it!) when I was getting my chip put in. It could very well be bored, though. They have done some good work on that car.

[BillyGman]

then that means that the pistons had to be replaced. So I'm sure that if the owner of the car bothered to go w/bigger pistons than he also went w/a Pistons that are intended for NO2 use. Assuming that he had planned to run the NO2 while the engine rebuilding took place. Therefore he most likely has a stronger and more durable bottom end in his engine than the Marauder stock configuration. If someone is going to spend the money to rebulid the engine of a new car, then they're going to make the engine better and more durable than the the manufacture did as well as making it w/more HP.

[Ross]

Yes, Billy, when I was thinking about possibly going SC, the engine strength issue was a concern for me. Then I started thinking about a stroker kit instead. If I ever do one or the other, I think it will be a stroker kit with stronger internals. Then, if I want to go SC later, the engine will already be beefed up and ready.

[BillyGman]

a good plan if you can come up w/the $$ for both. I doubt that stroking the motor alone would give you the power gains that a S/Cer would, but to do both would be ideal.

[MAD-3R's Wife]

Originally posted by MAD-3R
It's also Bored out to 5.0 L

HUMMM, I thought you said that BayWay had stroked it to 5.0 L. Unlike yours which is bored to 5.0 L.

:rolleyes:

[MAD-3R]

I'm stroked, he's bored

[SergntMac]

The Bay-Way MM in Ennis is sponsored by a local dealer, and the only things "stock" about it, is the sheet metal and interior. Yep, it's a bad ride, but a professionally built bad ride with an objective, and the money to pursue that objective.

No doubt that punching out the bottom end and beefing up internals will pay off, lowering compression for better supercharging is very tempting to me. Not that costly either, given the cost of supercharging alone. A stroked 5.0 from VT is reasonable and do-able, either as a parts kit, or in their shop. But, you have to have a reason to do it, and if you do, the fun is just starting.

[Ross]

Yep, like they say, some of us love this car for what it is, and some love it for what it can be!

[MAD-3R]

Originally posted by SergntMac
But, you have to have a reason to do it, and if you do, the fun is just starting.

Or something went south in a bad way as in my case. I really think adding a 50 shot of nitrous to our base engine is resonable safe. But if you decide to go for anything bigger, be perpared for something to go BOOM.

[MitchB]

Nitrous really is for drag racing. Supercharging (or any form of forced induction) can be moderated, meaning you do not have to be a WOT to have a power increase. Anyway. be prepard for broken parts. Even with the best of tuning, you still have week rods in this engine and you may encounter cooling problems/valve seat problems that these motors are vulnerable to when the power is turned up.

Mitch

[tait_gt2002]

I diasagree with most of this... Nitrous is great as long as you don't mind filling the bottles. If you want the speed more often than a few times a week, then I guess don't get nitrous. Or get dual bottles. There really should be no problem spraying a 125 or 150 shot on the Marauder motors. A 125 should be PERFECTLY safe and the engine/trans would handle about as many shots as you cared to give it. Also, a wet shot of nitrous does a great job as far as adding torque and not just HP. Expect a much larger torque increase with a wet kit as opposed to a dry kit. Torque is what's REALLY needed to get a Marauder moving from a stop.

BTW - I only have an '02 GT at this point but I'm considering picking up an '04 Marauder in the spring.

-Tait

[BillyGman]

Tait:)

[tait_gt2002]

Originally posted by BillyGman
Tait:)

Thanks man. I had a little too much fun at parties tonight (student at KSU) so if my post made no sense, disregard it. ;) I am glad to be on the Marauder board though, I have LOVED these cars ever since they first started talking about them. I don't care if they're the fastest thing on four wheels or not, they're just plain cool.

[BillyGman]

there's nothing that looks quite like a Marauder. The ideal Marauder IMO would've been one w/a big block engine or atleast w/a 350 or 360 C.I. engine. More torque, and better sound.......but because this is such a cool looking car it's worth it to me to spend some time and $$ making the car move faster. I get people from 18 yrs old to 65 yrs old, and of both genders complimenting me on this car. It seems that everyone likes it. And don't get me wrong, for a big car this ride moves pretty good even in the stock configuration, and the 32 valve engine under the hood does sound cool for a small V8 when you wind it up. I'm glad that I bought this car.

[tait_gt2002]

Originally posted by BillyGman
there's nothing that looks quite like a Marauder. The ideal Marauder IMO would've been one w/a big block engine or atleast w/a 350 or 360 C.I. engine. More torque, and better sound.......but because this is such a cool looking car it's worth it to me to spend some time and $$ making the car move faster. I get people from 18 yrs old to 65 yrs old, and of both genders complimenting me on this car. It seems that everyone likes it.


See, it's funny- I've only really been around this site as a lurker for about a week, but I haven't seen anyone doing anything other than stroker or bored 4.6's. I don't understand why a 5.4 from a Navigator wouldn't be a popular choice. More low-end torque, and there is a new intake out for it to make good top-end HP. Seems to me that the 5.4 Navi swap would be quite common. It's something I've contemplated to sit next to a the ZO6 I plan. :p Other than an ECU swap, I can't see where the 5.4 DOHC would cause any problems. The midpipe where it meets the manifolds would need to be widened, but other than that, the ECU swap and a *possible* hood swap, I don't see anything standing in the way.

I'm not real familiar with the possible underhood fitment problems a 5.4 would create, but in the Mustangs it's not too much of an issue except with the DOHC versions, the cam covers cannot be removed with the motor attached to it's mounts. I can't remember the last time I peered under the hood of a Marauder, but I assume there is more room to accomodate the wider 5.4.

[BillyGman]

about the 5.4 motor, but one of the vendors on this board (Sean hyland Motorsports) does a 5.2L conversion of these cars(probably pretty pricey though). But as far as your comment about having to alter the hood, I wouldn't want to change any part of the bodystyle of these cars. They're just 2 cool.........I wouldn't even want a hood scoop to be added to my car, because I like the stealth look that these cars have rather than the flashy IN-YOUR-FACE look that some other cars have.

[tait_gt2002]

Originally posted by BillyGman
about the 5.4 motor, but one of the vendors on this board (Sean hyland Motorsports) does a 5.2L conversion of these cars(probably pretty pricey though). But as far as your comment about having to alter the hood, I wouldn't want to change any part of the bodystyle of these cars. They're just 2 cool.........I wouldn't even want a hood scoop to be added to my car, because I like the stealth look that these cars have rather than the flashy IN-YOUR-FACE look that some other cars have.


Oh I totally agree, I'm not sure whether the 5.4 would require extra hood clearance or other clearance in the engine bay at all. I was just saying that I *guess* it might, as it does in the Mustangs. If that's what it required (taller hood), I would seriously consider not doing the 5.4 swap. SHM's 318 bored/stroker motor is supposed to have pretty awesome power, but I would want the real deal with 330 cubic inches straight from the Ford engine lineup. I'm sure there's some way to do it without a lot of effort or extra cost.

[BillyGman]

49 more cubes under the hood would be nice....... if only I could afford it.:rolleyes: But if you ever find out more about that possibility, then be sure to start up a thread about that since I guess we've already kinda hijacked this thread.:D

[1 BAD 03 MM]

Thanks tait,

We always need someone to open the door and push things a little bit farther. I agree 1000%. Torque is where it's at, especially trying to break inertia with 4100-4300lbs. Tpugh task. I love my 4.6 DOHC, but man........5.4 DOHC, this car would smoke. I just read an article about doing this in a Mustang also. If it will fit with minimum effort with a "truck" manifold on it, then this group should be able to come up with a mainfold (Maybe someone already has you say.) that would actually work better, AND fit under a Marauder hood.:beatnik:

[tait_gt2002]

Originally posted by BillyGman
49 more cubes under the hood would be nice....... if only I could afford it.:rolleyes: But if you ever find out more about that possibility, then be sure to start up a thread about that since I guess we've already kinda hijacked this thread.:D


LOL definitely... Really though, I believe that slightly used Navi motors can be had for around $2500. That's just kind of pulling a number out of the air... Based on everything I know about mod motors, everything *should* pretty much bolt up without too many problems. Should also only require a Navi ECU and a chip. I'm sure someone can enlighten me as to the fitment issues under the hood of the Marauders, that's the only thing I have questions about.


BTW - I'm not real sure what the platform name is for the Marauders/Crown Vics. For example in the '94+ Mustangs, it's the SN-95, and technically it's unchanged since '79 with the introduction of the Fox platform. Just didn't know if there was a shorter way to imply the name for the platform of the Marauder. :p

[1 BAD 03 MM]

It's called the "Panther" platform

[1 BAD 03 MM]

Same as "Crown Vics", and "Grand Marquis". It was upgraded this year though. It's an all new front suspension design. One of the things that I think gets overlooked on this car alot, It handles like a dream particularly when your are haulin a $$. It almost hurts to have to drive it 60-75,79,81 back and forth to work, the store, etc.

[1 BAD 03 MM]

Same as "Crown Vics", and "Grand Marquis". It was upgraded this year though. It's an all new front suspension design. One of the things that I think gets overlooked on this car alot, It handles like a dream particularly when your are haulin a $$. It almost hurts to have to drive it 60-75,79,81 back and forth to work, the store, etc.

[tait_gt2002]

Originally posted by 1 BAD 03 MM
Thanks tait,

We always need someone to open the door and push things a little bit farther. I agree 1000%. Torque is where it's at, especially trying to break inertia with 4100-4300lbs. Tpugh task. I love my 4.6 DOHC, but man........5.4 DOHC, this car would smoke. I just read an article about doing this in a Mustang also. If it will fit with minimum effort with a "truck" manifold on it, then this group should be able to come up with a mainfold (Maybe someone already has you say.) that would actually work better, AND fit under a Marauder hood.:beatnik:


I had a huge post typed up with lots of juicy tech info, but lost it because I hit the wrong button. :rolleyes:


There is indeed a nice new cast aluminum intake available for the 5.4 DOHC. Can't remember at this late hour who markets it. Only a few pieces availabe at this point. I honestly couldn't quote the Marauder factory flywheel hp/torque ratings.... 305?/???. I know the Navigator is 300/??? torque. lol Irregardless of the ratings (which I've heard but can't remember), I'm SURE the 5.4 even in DOHC trim would offer up a substantial increase in low-end torque. It's a swap I've considered for the GT, but now I'm contemplating parking a ZO6 on the bottle and a Marauder together.