Nitrous systems for our motor?

[tetsu]

I assume there must be quite a number of Nitrous kits for our motor since it is so similar to the 01 Cobra motor.

It'd be kind of sweet to hide a small adjustable shot under the intake manifold.

Anyone planning nitrous?

Johnny

[LincMercLover]

I don't know. Not a "cheater fuel" fan. If someone does put it on their car, I HIGHLY recommend not using a fogger system. I have video of a LS1 T/A blowing up under a fogger system while on the dyno. NOT a good thing...

[Dennis Reinhart]

I am not a big fan of N20, but if you are going to consider it use a wet system, it makes tuning easier you can contrall your A/F with Jet changes

[SSMOKEM]

Dennis is right. Wet system all the way.

Not a "cheater fuel" fan
Hey LincMercLover, it's cheating about as much as adding better flowing heads, a blower/turbo or nitromethane.

We have a saying here in Florida: "If you ain't sprayin, you ain't racin....."

[LincMercLover]

Oh god, here we go again...

Dennis agrees with me about the usage of NITROUS (NOS in some places...), so why not rip into him too? Well, in any account, if it's not running on pump gas ALONE, it's not a street machine IMHO. Hell, why not convert over to alcohol? Nitro to me is still for the little pocket rockets who are on the brink of sending four pistons through their carbon fiber hoods...

[Dennis Reinhart]

Originally posted by LincMercLover
Oh god, here we go again...

Dennis agrees with me about the usage of NITROUS (NOS in some places...), so why not rip into him too? Well, in any account, if it's not running on pump gas ALONE, it's not a street machine IMHO. Hell, why not convert over to alcohol? Nitro to me is still for the little pocket rockets who are on the brink of sending four pistons through their carbon fiber hoods...


I did not say I agree with you I said I am not a big fan of N20, what I did say is if you are going to use it, make sure its a wet system, so there is no need to try and have them rip me LOL

[LincMercLover]

Oppss, hit the button too quick...

ANYWAY


it's cheating about as much as adding better flowing heads, a blower/turbo or nitromethane.

No, heads or a blower are not cheating. Their you're easing restriction in a stock motor to allow it to perform to its maximum potential, not "spraying" more HP into the motor.

[LincMercLover]

LOL, I'm not... He's just trying to find another thread to rip on me on. I had said:


Not a "cheater fuel" fan.

"cheater fuel" meaning N2O

You said:


I am not a big fan of N20

So, essentially, we said the same thing...

[SSMOKEM]

Hey Dennis,

I wouldn't rip into you :) After all, you're the guru and providing valuable services to the automotive community.

Hey LincMercLover,

You said "No, heads or a blower are not cheating. Their you're easing restriction in a stock motor to allow it to perform to its maximum potential, not "spraying" more HP into the motor"

So in other words, when a blower is pushing WAY over atmospheric pressure, it's just easing a restriction?? Also why is that that most of the people I race with blowers (generally Cobras or Mustangs) seem to use 100 to 114 octane fuel. I wouldn't really call that pump gas, would you?

Besides, all N2O does is provide more oxygen. N2O does not provide ANY horsepower at all, just like a blower, turbo or heads. N2O is totally inert by itself. It can't burn or provide any power.

It does, however, just like a turbo/blower/heads allow you to burn more fuel which creates the power. So I fail to see where the difference is.

The bottom line to all this is that the more oxygen you can stuff into the motor, the more fuel you can burn, thus producing more power. The guys that gets to the end first, wins. This is, after all the reason most people buy hot rods and sporty cars.......:)

[89lxbill]

Whay does eveybody say nitrous is cheating? They sell NOS kits, they sell heads, they sell cams, they sell blowers, they sell turbos. So why is it cheating? Is it because I paid $300 and someone with a blower paid $5000? Sorry bout that. Run what ya brung and hope you brung enough is what I say.

[mensrea]

OK, it is my understanding that if you run NOS properly, you can get years of life out of your vehicle. I guess the question is who can install a NOS kit for the Marauder safely...

Here's a great article on NOS...

Article on NOS (http://www.edmunds.com/ownership/techcenter/articles/43840/article.html)

[LincMercLover]

N2O does not provide ANY horsepower at all, just like a blower, turbo or heads.


WOW, head's don't add HP? Hmm... didn't know that... Guess those dyno's are all wrong.

Yes, it is all in how much air/fuel you can push into those walls that determin what you run. Hints why Hyland is also making a stroker motor. In all honesty, I'd stroke mine before slapping on a turbo, that is if I had the money... As for octane ratings, I'm sure Dennis' Marauder S also runs on 93, as does the Cobra R. It all depends on how much boost you're giving it. I can however get 100 around here, but have yet to see 114 anywhere but the track.

Nitro is boosting the combustability of the fuel/air mixture, not pushing MORE of it in there. Whereas a turbo, heads, cam allow a shove of more air/fuel into the motor.

At any account, WE ALL HAVE OUR OWN OPINION and are free to express it on these forums that have been created for us. We've all spent a substantial ammount on our cars and what a person sees fit to do to it is up to that person. Maybe, some want their MM to remain forever bone stock. Maybe some want a decent street machine, and I have no doubt some want a s!@# and get, 10 second four door. It all a matter of preference.

[LincMercLover]

Better say nitrous mensrea! SS will get mad...

[Dennis Reinhart]

So in other words, when a blower is pushing WAY over atmospheric pressure, it's just easing a restriction?? Also why is that that most of the people I race with blowers (generally Cobras or Mustangs) seem to use 100 to 114 octane fuel. I wouldn't really call that pump gas, would you?

The reason why a lot of guys run 114 or Higher octane is because of stock pistons compression ratio of almost 10 to 1. The only way to run a reasonable amount of timing is with high octane fuel, and I agree this is not what I want, nor do I use.

I have built lots of modular motors and the way to do it is lower the compression and turn the boost up, the 1998 Mark 8 I just finished had gone through two very expensive motors by another company, and he lost both motors, due to miss'configuration and people who just don't know how to tune cars, his last motor made close to 500 RWHP at 7000 RPM. But he lost a piston, he left me the car I pulled the motor and used CP fully coated pistonsand rings, Manly rods. The pistons were 8.5 to 1 along with ARP fasteners and ported and polished heads I used the stock intake.

I removed the BLOWER CAMS installed stock 1998 Cobra Cams and this cars first pass on the dyno made 508 RWHP on 93 OCTANE, and it made 508 at 5800 RPM, I have not finished my tuning on this car and I probably will end up with 550 RWHP, this is over 650 at the crank, so again I have a system that works and works well, if you plan on doing a supercharger you are going to be limited to 8 lbs or less on the Maraider stock engine. The motor in the Marauder Knock sensors are very sensitive, so you just cant dial in a lot of timing but we are working on it. If you want to make a 11 second car you will have to go into the motor I sure would be glad to help.

http://web.iwebcenters.com/reinhartautomotive/images/larrysideview.jpg

http://web.iwebcenters.com/reinhartautomotive/images/larryengine.jpg

http://web.iwebcenters.com/reinhartautomotive/images/larryharkins.jpg

[Flash]

LincMercLover,


"Nitro to me is still for the little pocket rockets who are on the brink of sending four pistons through their carbon fiber hoods..."

Do you mean Mustangs? The first time I saw NOS was when Mickey Thompson used it on his Funny Car in the late 60's with Danny Ongias driving, later it did blow up and kill Danny. I installed NOS on my Mustang in '83, back then it was the "Pocket Rocket". Didn't have a carbon fiber hood though: OOPS!

Just like a lot of other things concerning the Imports, for example, a few years ago Honda introduced the "Wishbone Suspension", I remember in High School my model A Ford had the "Wishbone Suspension". Remember "Imitation is the Sincerest form of Flattery"

[LincMercLover]

TOO MANY PEOPLE CALLING IT NOS!!! I DON'T UNDERSTAND! Sorry... just had to go there. ANYWAY...

If we REALLY want to go back into history, NOS was used in WWII as a aircraft fuel booster used for emergency manuevers.

I smell a lock coming on... :D

[MAD-3R]

I do see LincMercLovers point. I think that a misunderstanding occured between street vs strip. You generaly don't run Nitrous systems on a street car. On a Drag car, hell yeah, I would run the Cold stuff, but not on a daily driver.

[tetsu]

I hate to say this but nitrous is a pretty logical thing for a street/strip car cuz you only get the bomb when you push the button. :)

I think that some people have an unrealistic concept of nitrous from watching The Fast and The Furious.

Look at it this way, if you put in a 150 shot that is about equivalent to a blower. Only you dont have it running all the time.

Trick would be to have someone knowledgable about the mod motor and nitrous to design the gameplan so as to not damage the motor.

Long-term I'd like to get mine up around 400 rwhp, but I'm in no hurry. I plan to daily drive my car for quite a while. I'll start feeling more need when they release a more powerful Marauder. I would not be happy to get greased by a supercharged S55 Marauder. :)


Johnny

[bozobill]

Flash,

Danny Ongais isn't dead. He was most definitely alive as late as 1996. I think his hands were badly burned in an Indy car crash several years ago but I don't remenber hearing he had died from an engine explosion in the 60's. Anyone?

[Flash]

bozobill,

My mistake, thanks for straighting me out. I should have done some follow thru on my memory.

Sorry, Danny, that NOS explosion was spectacular none the less.

[SSMOKEM]

Hey guys,

Nitrous is the juice of the gods :)

I've been running a dual stage 200 shot on my BONE STOCK bottom end since Nov of 99. This is on a stock cast crank, stock cast pistons, stock rings. That's been 3 years now, and my car just keeps getting faster. And all this time I have NEVER ran any kind of high octane fuel, just 93 Amoco.

I think it would take quite a lot for a Marauder with a blower to hit 119mph in the 1/4 like I have. You definitely would have to go to forged components on the motor, which means a total rebuild and run race fuel. NO WAY a stock bottom Marauder can run 119mph on a blower alone.

However, I believe it would be possible on the juice.

As far as street vs. strip, why stop at the strip? My bottle is always ready for action, and I get quite a bit of it :D

Hey Dennis,

You are doing some awsome work with your projects, and I have to give you credit.

However, people must understand that a stock bottom with a blower severely limits your ability to make major power. I have seen the same scenarios with Impalas. 6PSI and 8psi with an intercooloer is about all you can run. Some run juice on top of that to cool the intake charge and make huge gains as a result.

The quickest N2O Impala in our club with 100% stock body ran a 10.2 @ 135, while the quickest blower ran an 11.5 @ 118. Both of them had forged LT1 strokers.

[VaderSS]

I think most people's ideas of N2O come from the people that simply put a "kit" in with no safeguards or forethought. I've done quite a bit of research on this topic and have come to the conclusion that a well thought out system will have little or no impact on the reliabilility and life of an engine. If you are "pushing a button" though, you are pretty much begging for trouble.

A properly thought out system will use window switches to only allow spray above certain RPM at WOT while pulling spray before the shift and having a fuel pressure interlock to pull spray if fuel pressure drops. It will also be interfaced with the ignition system to alter the timing curve while on the boost. If you still feel that after all that thought has been placed into a well executed system, that it is "cheating," so be it. I still plan on spraying the beast once it is no longer my sole 4 wheel transportation.

At the moment, my car is a daily driver and still being paid for, and as such I am not doing things to the car which could result in decreased reliability. My concern is not the engine, but the transmission, which is the weak link in Impalas. SSMOKEM has addressed that concern by switching to the near bulletproof TH400. My plan is a 6 sped with 4.10s...

[LincMercLover]

I don't know if Kenny Brown's numbers of 11.87 in the 1/4 are accurate or not, BUT IF THEY ARE, then he is extremely close to your 11.67 with "just a blower" SS... It could still be possible for Dennis' to pull your time out of a MM without "the juice."

[SSMOKEM]

I just saw the Kenny Brown video of a Motortrend test, and the STOCK BOTTOM Marauder with the supercharger ran a 13.8 at 102. My car runs 13.0s @ 107 normally aspirated.

If he has one running 11.8s, then I'm sure it's a totally built motor, since it would take another 200hp to achieve that.

My ETs are on the stock bottom iron block, even still have the iron heads and stock valves, and a lumpy cam with boltons. As I said earlier, the fast Impalas with N2O and built motors are running down to the very low 10s.

I would be VERY interested in seeing a stock bottom Marauder run in the 11s or a built one in the 10s with a totally stock body.

[cyclone03]

Flash,
Danny O is dead??
If he is it was after 1981.My dad had a beer with him(me too but I was only 19)at Onterio Motor Speedway after an Indy car race.

[cyclone03]

Man I type slow.

[Flash]

I've been corrected, Danny O. is alive!

[tetsu]

VaderSS, any recommendations on info sources on setting up nitrous systems as you discussed?

I was told that as long as enough extra fuel was being added to prevent leaning out and that you didnt sit on the button too long you could add modest shots to most engines safely.

Johnny

[mensrea]

A couple of points... a) the Marauder is not the 11 second car on the Kenny Brown page, that is an 03 cobra, with Nitrous.. b) the Motorweek video is of a CROWN VICTORIA, with 350 horse and 400 lbs at the crank.. The Maruader has closer to 500 squared. I still think 13.8 is pretty good on a 2V motor. No one has tested Kenny's Marauder yet, I hope to do that on Sunday

There will always be someone faster, I am going with a friend to Kenny's tomorrow and he is bringing his 8 second AC Cobra drag/street car (nitrous by the way)... wouldn't want to race him with any of these cars. Granted he doesnt have air or a back seat, but still damn quick.

Kenny Brown 11.87 second 03 cobra (http://www.kennybrown.com/Dragracing.htm)

Motorweek Crown Vic (http://www.kennybrown.com/lowresp2vid.htm)

[Dennis Reinhart]

WELL MY 4000LB Mark 8 runs 11.7 seconds at 118 MPH on 93 octane 450 RWHP on stock heads my car still gets 19MPG and I drive it every day so it can be done if you have the time and money

[SSMOKEM]

Hey Dennis,

You are DA MAN :)

I REALLY want to see some Marauders run 11s soon, and I hope they're all in central Florida.

It creates quite a stir at Orlando Speedworld whenever our big boats show up. It would be cool to have a few Marauders and a few Impalas showing the Mustangs and Camaros how it's done :D (maybe some Lincolns?)

If anyone in Central Florida wants to add an N2O setup, I'd be more than willing to help.

[JAL]

Hey LincMercLover,

Get a grip dude. Enough with the N20 or NOS debate. It's freakin' N20. Just happens that a company called NOS is what most people generally call N20. Why do I even bother reasoning with you?

N20 is not cheating. Go re-read the earlier info.

Take a look at George's (SSMOKEM) web site, I'd like to see you run his car.

[tetsu]

Hehehe. I got smoked today by a BMW running nitrous. I had him by a car length off of the line my r/t .488 his .6 somethin I was pulling away from him big time at the 1/8th mile and them WHOOOOOOOSSSHHH..... he cranked past me and ended with a 14.1 at 110 mph.

Johnny

[Geo]

I like the idea of NOS in turbo or twin-turbo applications strategically applied to elliminate turbo-lag from a particular RPM especially when starting from 0 MPH.

GEO

[LincMercLover]

JAL,

Just stating my point that me and SS had earlier about calling it NOS. Not your fight, so I'd step back.

As we all can see, the majority of people on this thread are SS owners, so... that says a lot.

Secondly, we do not know what the KB-MM-S is running at the track yet, so, untill then I think the subject of weather or not it can be done without NOS should be left standing.

My father had a 1968 Plymouth Road Runner that had all the eminities that broke 11's once. NO TURBO/CHARGER. Just a BP/Balanced motor, racer brown 3/4 cam, and so much other little stuff I don't even know, you'd have to ask him (and be prepared for a couple hours worth of stories). He didn't have all the hydrallic cams and lifters or the money to shell for NOS. Granted, the car was probably no where near the weight of ours, but my point is it can be done without NOS, I've seen it.

[Geo]

I may regret this but, what the hell.

I always thought that NOS was slang for "N" "O" "the suffix 2". I havan't had a chance to scan all the above threads for this, perhaps this was mentioned already.

Other than that, I don't really believe in the stuff.

I would prefer one of those 429 Fuel Injected big blocks kit that drop in where DOHC mod motors reside. I'm still wondering who it is that does this as my buddy who told me can't remember which magazine he saw it in. I'm tired of hearing brand new big block vehicles behind me just to see that it is a brand new GM tow truck.

I do respect the environment however the Panthers are the last passenger cars a big block will fit in, why not go out in a bang in 2010.

Otherwise I am sure a Holley Dominator Fuel Injection system and a little creativity would suffice.

At the very least I would drop in a OBDII spec Cobra R motor and call it even.

GEO

[tetsu]

NOS is the Holley brand and it stands for Nitrous Oxide Systems.

Johnny

[LincMercLover]

That's what I'm saying Geo. Give me cubes!

Oh, and how come I'm seeing N20 (N 20)...? Shouldn't it be N2O (N 2 O)? :D

[bnvus]

Can someone pass the Potato Chips...

[LincMercLover]

bnvus,

What are forums for, right? :rolleyes: LMAO!

[cyclone03]

Geo Said,
"I do respect the environment however the Panthers are the last passenger cars a big block will fit in, why not go out in a bang in 2010."

Hello V10!
I think thats the biggest Ford has now,It'll have to do.On second thought better put a SuperCharger on top too.

And LML STOP SAYING "NOS"!!!!:D :

[VaderSS]

Nitrous for Newbies, by SSmokem
http://www.impalassforum.com/tech/nitrous/newbies/newbies.htm



VaderSS, any recommendations on info sources on setting up nitrous systems as you discussed?


SSmokem knows far more about nitrous than I. If you are interested, in learning more about it, drop him a line.



I was told that as long as enough extra fuel was being added to prevent leaning out and that you didnt sit on the button too long you could add modest shots to most engines safely.

Following that advice you would probably be ok 9 times out of 10, but that 10th time...

My recommendation is to always go with a "wet" system, that is one that puts fuel in with the N2O, as opposed to the "dry" systems, that rely on the fuel injectors to supply the extra fuel. If the fuel infectors on a dry system are not able to supply the extra fuel, for whatever reason, ((BOOM))

The reason for a low window switch is that when you add HP, you are increasing cylinder pressure. The lower the RPM, the higher the cylinder pressure will be to give the same HP. Most N2O systems have stages(often only one) that put a certain amount of N20 in. The N2O and Fuel added will always result in roughly the same HP increase across the board, so if you add the power at too low of an RPM, the cylinder pressure is too high((BOOM)).

The reason for the upper window is to pull the extra power while the transmission is making the shift. Depending on the amount of additional power, the transmission may not shift at all, or will shorten it's life in making the shift under boost. Also, some PCM driven limiters(including the Impala's) function by pulling fuel, not spark, so you want a system that will pull spark, not fuel. And you want the N2O delivery to be pulled before hitting the rev limiter. You also want to pull timing on boost, because the effective compression ratio is higher on boost, which can lead to detonation, which is very bad.

The reason for the fuel pressure switch is that if the fuel pressure drops for ANY reason, to the point where their is not enough to supply fuel, then a lean condition will result((BOOM)).

Basically, what you are wanting to do, is take the danger out, and leave the power.

[tetsu]

Wayne, thanks much for the info and for SSmokem's page. Both documents are very informative.

I can see that Nitrous will be a much more complex and interesting undertaking that I had originally thought.

Johnny

[Logan]

Hmmm, Fortunately, this thread steered itself back on track...I was about to get very upset for another NOS/Nitrous Bull**** thread.

Thanks for steering it back straight and saving the thread from oblivion...

Carry on...

[SSMOKEM]

Very nice explanation, Wayne :)

A well setup N2O system will probably set you back 1500+, so it's not just a cheap quickie. Of course, it can be done cheaply, but that's when your hear about it on some car board, and the guy is looking for a new motor.

Hey Logan,

I believe nowadays it's called NAWWWWZZZZZ :D

[LincMercLover]

Still, a lot of ifs, ands, or buts up there...

Cyclone: NOS (or as SS put it, NAAWWZZ), ooppss! Sorry, just a nasty habbit I guess! ;)

Logan: See... you doubted us, but we were good! :D

[VaderSS]

The way I feel about it, N20 is just another form of forced induction. A blower or turbo adds O2 by force feeding the air into the motor. Nitrous functions by adding O2 in the form of N2O.

Theoretically, you could use liquid oxygen and accomplish the same thing, but using pure oxygen would result in very high combustion temps and catastrophic detonation. N2O buffers the oxygen, by forcing a reaction to take place before the oxygen is released.

Blower and turbo setups require much thought and engineering to function correctly, and if improperly designed or lacking in the proper safeguards, they can cause an engine to blow up just as quickly as nitrous.

Most people lack the skills to install a blower kit, much less to engineer a simple blower or turbo setup, so we don't often see applications where someone has simply bolted one to there engine and took off, no programming, no thought, no safeguards. The high initial cost of a blower or turbo also tends to preclude thoughtless applications.

But you can literally do just that with nitrous. Just get a bottle of N2O, plumb it into the intake tract, and hope the stock programming can compensate. It's no suprise when such a setup fails, taking the motor with it. But if you put the same kind of thought and engineering into a nitrous setup, that you would put into the blower, is it cheating? I think they are the same, one is just cheaper than the other.

[LincMercLover]

But, N2O will essentially cost you more in the long run. With a blower/turbo it's there all the time, no major maintence. N2O will last you as full as the bottle is. If you're a happy-go-lucky button pusher, you'll be forking out a lot more dough to keep your thumb statisfied. I have arthritus in my hand, so I don't like to push buttons... :D

And I am well aware of the computer situation. A blower/turbo is not just a bolt on by any means, neither is N2O. To do it properly with N2O (and I believe someone mentioned this up there also...) the timing of the motor must be pulled to prevent detonation, as will fuel compensation and N2O shut-off safe-gaurds need to be in place in the computer. In essences, I simply say if your power isn't there at all times, it isn't the true power for your "complete car." MHO...

[SSMOKEM]

hey Linc,

Something a lot of people don't consider is the useful life of a turbo/blower. I know quite a few people with them, and they always seem to be changing or fixing or breaking stuff, so the ongoing costs of N2O aren't really any more that that of a blower/turbo.

Nitrous components last quite a long time and are easily and cheaply rebuilt.

My guess is that if you average true costs over the long haul, a certain amount of HP gain will cost pretty much the same, no matter how you go about it. Let's also not forget that any HP increase generally requires other mods to the drivetrain, suspension, fuel system, ignition, etc.

[dj4monie]

Originally posted by LincMercLover
Oh god, here we go again...

Dennis agrees with me about the usage of NITROUS (NOS in some places...), so why not rip into him too? Well, in any account, if it's not running on pump gas ALONE, it's not a street machine IMHO. Hell, why not convert over to alcohol? Nitro to me is still for the little pocket rockets who are on the brink of sending four pistons through their carbon fiber hoods...

Hmmm....

Is that maybe why my R/T is only .7 tenths slower than your Mercury?
and that's bone stock...

http://mediaservice.photoisland.com/auction/Dec/20021211381112594613805.jpg

You better find something because among other things I have already added this - http://mediaservice.photoisland.com/auction/Dec/20021218345941495659667.jpg

I'm adding some other things so I don't have any times yet.

As for converting to Alky, it's not cheap to upgrade your entire fuel system since Alky degrades rubber among other things in gasoline fuel systems. Why make all those changes unless you're going to run really high compression, lot of nitrous or alot of boost? Not needed.... Plus you have to buy it by the 55 gallon drum if you're smart.

Oh and in case you haven't noticed Carbon-fiber is a lightweight, strong replacement fiber that can used in things like hoods to reduce weight. Someting I would say is already an issue with the Maurder.

I suggest you not pulling up to some of the Dodge Neons I know out there. I know more than few pulling down 190-200hp without a nitrous bottle or turbocharger in site and running on good ol'e PUMP GAS...

One more thing, I might not convinced or convert you, but nitrous is just as safe as any other form of forced induction and considering the weight the Maruder is hauling around that's going to be the first change we make on my stepfather's Maruder if he decides to trade-in the SHO..

10 years of nitrous use, only thing damaged was a stock clutch...

[Dennis Reinhart]

Now thatts not what I said, I am not a big fan of N20 bit I did say if you are going to use it use a wet system

[LincMercLover]

Is that maybe why my R/T is only .7 tenths slower than your Mercury?

Yah, and the fact your car weighs over 1500 lbs. lighter than our MMs MAY have something to do with it...

In ANY case, all I'm saying is I'm not doing N2O, nor would I advise any of my friends to put N2O on their cars. That is what this forum is about, advising and sharing info with others about your opinions and views on things to do to OUR cars. Take it for what you want, I personally am tired of seeing this thread pop up under "new posts." No sense in kicking a dead horse...

[mensrea]

Hey DJ... wanna come to chicago and race a marauder

[bozobill]

Smoke him, Danno!

[dj4monie]

Originally posted by mensrea
Hey DJ... wanna come to chicago and race a marauder

Maybe if I come to Neon 2003 which happens to be in ILL every year. But ILL is a far drive from Los Angeles and I have some pretty large plans for 2003 including a trip to Europe most likely, e-mail me around March and ask me then.

But I should let you know, most of the faster Neons are located in the midwest... Just make your way out to GLD next spring. I know a few .orgers that go out there because it's the closest track to where they live.

http://www.zero-to-sixty.com/NeonRacerData/results.htm

About 99% are legit because at one time or another I have seen the time slip.

[dj4monie]

Originally posted by bozobill
Smoke him, Danno!

There's a guy I know in your town with a turbocharged R/T... Watch your step...

[dj4monie]

Originally posted by LincMercLover
Yah, and the fact your car weighs over 1500 lbs. lighter than our MMs MAY have something to do with it...

In ANY case, all I'm saying is I'm not doing N2O, nor would I advise any of my friends to put N2O on their cars. That is what this forum is about, advising and sharing info with others about your opinions and views on things to do to OUR cars. Take it for what you want, I personally am tired of seeing this thread pop up under "new posts." No sense in kicking a dead horse...

Its not a dead horse, if you don't wanna use then don't...

I say people should consider it. I can outrun a Vortec powered MM with a nitrous only MM for half the money and no engine damage. Anybody that knows a thing or three about nitrous know this EASILY possible and no engine damage, long or short term is the result.

Ive had nitrous on three different cars including the current one and have used nitrous since '90 on my '79 Mustang Corba that ran mid 12's with a '85 Mustang GT engine, stock from the Holley 600, down to the oil pan. Only other things I added where MAC shorties, Dynomax cat-back exhaust, Dual hump crossmember, Saleen subframe connectors and Lakewood traction bars.

Ive never blown up any car I have installed nitrous onto, nor any of my friends have damaged their engines unless it was an error they made in tuning, which could have resulted in engine damage even N/A. Ive seen far more melted hunks of metal from turbocharging, high RPM and high compression than I have ever seen with the bottle.

Sure Ive seen nitrous back-fires and such, but if you notice that usually happens with carb'ed powered cars and rarely happens on modern EFI engines. Unless the wrong fuel jet was installed.. Seen that too.

Oh well chalk up somebody else doomed to go slow.. Or spending a tone of money to go fast...

[mensrea]

Well since I haven't been to the track yet I can't say for sure what my et will be... but with almost 400 horse at the rear wheel I should be fairly competitive with most of the slips on the link above (and I want to point out that the ones less than 14 are on slicks, I will be running all seasons)..... And who knows, as SSMokem always says... MORE SPEED on the way. I think we still have some ponies left in this thing AAnd, whoknows maybe I will put nitrous on my car, anyone ever done a blown/nitrous 4.6L?

[SSMOKEM]

Hey dj4monie,

I looked at that Neon Top ET list and checked out pictures of Grant Baker's car. It looks stripped to the bone, the whole interior down to bare metal!!

You can call that a street car if you want, but I definitely class it as race only. The Marauders and Impalas race with the full stock interior and all the amenities working, such as air, power steering, power brakes, power windows, power seats, cruise control, power/heated mirrors, remote trunk/door locks, comfortable leather seats front and back, room for at least 5 adults in comfort.

There really is no comparison.

I'm curious what the quickest Neon is with absolutely 100% stock interior and all the above mentioned power accessories. I doubt there are many quick ones.


Hey Mensrea,

My buddy Mike put a 6psi powerdyne on his Impala and ran a 12.33. He then added a 100 shot and ran an 11.45. He also has a Comp cam and ported aftermarket heads with bolt-ons, and of course, a 100% stock body, interior and bottom end.

He also has two 12" subwoofers and couple of big amps in the trunk :D What really ticks me off, though, is that he beat me by 2 tenths, and all of it before the 330' mark, but he DOES have 2 power adders........

Blowers LOVE the juice even more than NA cars :)

[mensrea]

Mmmm I wonder what my 69 big block vette would do with Nitrous??????????

And it is not the going fast that costs money... it's the going fast, handling and stopping well, and the ability to drive the car every day.

Kenny is known for his suspension and handling packages, and he really makes the marauder handle, and stop as well. You can drive the blown marauder all day and never know it wasn't stock, until you crack the throttle. Did I mention that I got 22 mpg on the way back from Indy?

To me, that level of refinement is worth every penny... wonder what 16K would do to a big block. But then again, no air, and only two seats.

I've said it before, and I’ll say it again, doesn't matter what you drive if you love it and made a conscious decision...AND there will always be someone faster. Did I tell you about the 11 second diesel Excursion I saw once.

[dj4monie]

Originally posted by SSMOKEM
Hey dj4monie,

I looked at that Neon Top ET list and checked out pictures of Grant Baker's car. It looks stripped to the bone, the whole interior down to bare metal!!

You can call that a street car if you want, but I definitely class it as race only. The Marauders and Impalas race with the full stock interior and all the amenities working, such as air, power steering, power brakes, power windows, power seats, cruise control, power/heated mirrors, remote trunk/door locks, comfortable leather seats front and back, room for at least 5 adults in comfort.

There really is no comparison.

I'm curious what the quickest Neon is with absolutely 100% stock interior and all the above mentioned power accessories. I doubt there are many quick ones.


Hey Mensrea,

My buddy Mike put a 6psi powerdyne on his Impala and ran a 12.33. He then added a 100 shot and ran an 11.45. He also has a Comp cam and ported aftermarket heads with bolt-ons, and of course, a 100% stock body, interior and bottom end.

He also has two 12" subwoofers and couple of big amps in the trunk :D What really ticks me off, though, is that he beat me by 2 tenths, and all of it before the 330' mark, but he DOES have 2 power adders........

Blowers LOVE the juice even more than NA cars :)

Well I hate to disapoint you, but Grant's Neon is FAR from stripped, in fact it has Power Steering and Air Cond still installed and in use. For sup 11 second ETs he has installed a 6 point roll bar. Since you really can't sit in the rear seats anymore, is there really a need for a rear seat?

Besides Power 4 rules state the car can be rear half stripped, while NHRA's new Sport FWD cars state only the rear seats can be removed and no full cell can be used like in Grant's car.

Otherwise, the car isn't stripped. It is trailered to some events in case something breaks. But does remain daily driven. I'll mention it again, the power steering and AC work.

Fastest full interior Neon when It was a street car is Len Ayala's Neon that was featured in Hot Rod Magazines Ten Best in 2000. Again, because of this car's 10 second status, the rear seat had been removed. Back when it went 10.55, the AC had been removed but the power steering remained. The engine was also stock save for stronger rods and pistons. No port work, no camshafts, etc. Just a Hahn Racecraft turbo kit with 16G turbo (hardly LARGE), Accel DFI and good tuning by Bill Hahn Jr., who's non-turbo DSM does low 11's with the same engine that's in the Neon.

Currently... Beau's R/T and Shawn's R/T have full interiors. There a few more out there that haven't listed yet.

Don't try to bunch us into the "H" crowd. We don't think we need to strip the car's down to nothing to make them go quickly. A few have, Nick Reily's R/T went 13.2@101 with little else but the engine and up to that point the head had never been off it. Before Steve went 11.95 in his ACR all-motor, he did low 12's with it when he still drove it on the street, but with the focus on running some of the NHRA Sport Compact events next season has as made the changes needed to be competitive.

The ACR model not only makes a great road racer/autocross car, but an excellent base for a race car period. It is devoid of power options and has all the go-fast goodies from the factory installed already including Koni struts on '97-'99 models and Dynamic 12 point adjustable struts on '01-'02 ACR's.

Just follow the progress of my R/T. My R/T weighs 2660lbs without me in it. Only options I DONT have are side air bags and leather surfaces. That's heavy by Neon standards as first gen cars come around 2400lbs with ACR non-AC cars coming in around 2300lbs. Again proving that Grant's car is far from stripped at 2560lbs., which is only 100lbs less than my car and he's removed the rear seats and paneling! Look closely and you'll see the 6x9's back there still.

I'll post a link later... (to my site that is..)

[MAD-3R]

There was a reason the SCCA ran Neon's. They are a well done car. I had a 2000 Neon just before my Marauder, and even though it was small for me, I fit. If was quick, though not fast, and handled very well for a little four banger. My Neon stock had 132 hp, where the stock Honda's in the same engine range had 90 to 110. And neons do have Mopar behind them.

Remember 1969? Chysler came to Datona to win, won, then took the the ball and went home. They proved their point. "We can do it beter then you, so there!" :p :p :p

I have nothing ageinst Sport Compacts, unless they put an exhaust tip on it that I can fit my fist into. That is about the only thing that annoys me.

[prchrman]

Ok this is a old thread but wondering if anyone took the plunge and N2Oed their MM...and how is it performing...and don't start arguing if it is right or wrong...pulllleeease...willie

[Constable]

I'm almost sure that no one here has jumped into the spray yet. I was seriously debating on running the Edelbrock kit since I ordered my car in early April. I think it's going to have to wait til the winter.