New JBA shorty's

[musclemerc]

Is there is anyone else interested in doing a set of shorty headers? I just found a set of brand new JBA chrome shorty's for $210.00 shipped.. PM me for the info. Paypal perferred

[musclemerc]

PM's sent!

[Dennis Reinhart]

Are you sure these will fit

[musclemerc]

Yep! I'm running the same headers.

[Glenn]

We have got to stop this movement toward Shortys - it just is not right. I thought everyone wanted to be a LTer? :rolleyes:

Glenn Ford :confused:

[dohc324ci]

Dont listen to Glenn or you'll be Glennatiezed! Shorty's rule...lol

Glenn you just cant help yourself huh.....

[Dennis Reinhart]

I would like to see if the ports match the head, I sold the Motorsport shorties years ago with a twin Magnaflow X pipe this was all we had back then, till Kooks came along, and the Motorcraft shorties do not match the heads as well as 03 Mach 1 stock manifolds do, so I went with them and the Magnaflow high flow X pipe. But today as Glenn said Kooks or SS works is the proven way to go.

[dohc324ci]

True^^except in Cali where you have to retain all 4 cats or an automatic fail on the visual. I am looking to keep the 4 cat setup just better flow from the shorty swap.

[musclemerc]

The shorty's are SOLD to Brian H! He just got his ticket to ride on the shorty bus!

[Brian H]

uh, yea, thanx?

[musclemerc]

Glad to pass a good deal along to you Brian.

[Glenn]

Dennis is correct on the mismatched ports, just so everyone is aware of it. It has been posted many times in the past. Kooks or SSW is probably the best option, but expensive for NA MMs. Shorties are just an alternative at a lower cost and are quite and much easier to install. I only promote them because they have worked for me and I feel I have more torque off the line. But, as I have said before - each to his own.

Do what you feel is best. I have no :flamer:against the LTs (LongTubers) - they are nice people like you and me, but mis-directed at times.

Glenn Ford :D

[bigmerc'03]

so the cobra shortys dont fit?

[dohc324ci]

We need more sticky's apparently for this topic....lol

Congrats on the new shorty's!

[Glenn]

Slight mismatch on the ports. Pictures were posted about 4-5 years ago by DR.

Glenn Ford :burnout:

[dohc324ci]

^^Ok Ive read that in the past but plenty guys run the shorty's with good results so what impact if any as a result of the mismatch ports?

[FordNut]

Just one I can think of. Why would anybody get their heads ported and port matched to the gaskets (a normal part of the porting process) then bolt up something that doesn't align with the ports properly and obstructs flow?

[dohc324ci]

If they obstruct flow so much why are there still reported gains???

The FRPP Shorties are one of three alternatives to stock manifolds: LT or Cobra manifolds. I opted for these based on the members here reporting some decent gains and for the price seems reasonable.

[FordNut]

Most people who go to the expense of porting would never consider running shorties or stock manifolds anyway.

[dohc324ci]

Most who don't live in California....lol

Guys on my Mustang club are doing LTs through shops that provide that "service" but the state is popping them left and right....around here...and getting harder every 2 years....when they fine the shop 10K and closing some with multi violations.

Time to look at Cobra manifolds....

Thanks B

[FordNut]

I dunno, I'd guess that the Cobra shorties still flow better than the manifolds even with the port mismatch.

I wonder if anybody has considered getting a set of flanges from SW or Kooks that properly match the ports and modifying the shorties to fit them?

[LANDY]

^^ that would be a good, but maybe expensive idea.

[babbage]

What I'd like to know is if there are a set of EQUAL LENGTH shorties that will properly fit our 4v heads. I'd consider shorties as an option then.
http://www.bbkperformance.com/product_images/1615_chrome_headers_ford_musta ng_4_6_bbk_performance_parts-398x.jpg

The above are for a 4.6 2v - but you get the idea

[musclemerc]

What I'd like to know is if there are a set of EQUAL LENGTH shorties that will properly fit our 4v heads. I'd consider shorties as an option then.
http://www.bbkperformance.com/product_images/1615_chrome_headers_ford_musta ng_4_6_bbk_performance_parts-398x.jpg

The above are for a 4.6 2v - but you get the idea

You will not get the equal length headers to fit in the engine bay. The JBA's are definately bigger in design than the FRPP's and they are a tight fit and require more modification than the FRPP's. As far as the flange's fitting, has anyone else here actually looked at the flange on the JBA's other than myself, Zack, and SmokdMercRauder? Probably not! :cool:

[swordfish]

The JBA's are definately bigger in design than the FRPP's and they are a tight fit and require more modification than the FRPP's. As far as the flange's fitting, has anyone else here actually looked at the flange on the JBA's other than myself, Zack, and SmokdMercRauder? Probably not! :cool:

I just got a set of coated JBA's from an 03 cobra. Are these the same? I didn't want to spend that much for kooks. I got these for 50 bucks from someone that totaled their cobra. What type of modification are we talking about? I'm going EGR delete so we removed that sat and welded up. Is there anything else that has to be done?

[musclemerc]

Yes they are the same headers i'm referring to. You got a deal! I will PM you the info requested

[dohc324ci]

On JBA's website they list the following PN:1625S-7JT for 99-04 4V Cobra?? Does anyone know if these headers have the same port mismatch as the FRPP Shorties???

I figured since the FRPP ones state only for 99-01 4V you would have a different PN designed for the 03-04 heads..for JBAs?? Confusing...to say the least. What's different about the JBA's that their headers will work on 99-01s 4Vs as well??

[Zack]

You need to run Felpro Gaskets from NAPA (about $12) with the JBA's

The stock gaskets do not appear as though they will work with JBA's

[Dennis Reinhart]

The only question I have is do they port match the head, I sent Bruce a note to ask him, the older Motorsports did not and required a shim under the drivers side mount, and Pauls's did dyno before and after and found the Mach 1 manifold did match the head since that is the motor in our car any way, and I sold this kit for years till Kooks came out.

[musclemerc]

I wanted to get the info from the horses mouth, so I put in a call to JBA today and spoke with someone in their engineering dept. and here's what I got from my talk with Alex. JBA PN:1625S-7JT has the flange for a 2003~2004 terminator "C" style head. The flanges are laser cut and they are port matched for "C" style heads. The reason they list one model # from 99~04 is because the larger port should'nt be an issue for the later "B" style heads just use a "B" style gasket with the install. JBA used to make several diffrent style headers for 32v engines back in the day and according to Alex using their older headers won't be an issue with the "C" style heads either. He looked at the flange lay out on the PC and verified their is only a slight diffrence in the oval across the board in the heads.

I guess in the case with the FRPP's they maybe got some complaints about the ports matching and revised their site to reflect they won't work on a "C" head. Which has definatelly changes in the last few months because they used to display their shorty's for a 2003~2004 Cobra and now it stops at 2001.

I hope this helps with all the questions. Happy Maraudering to all! :burnout:

[dohc324ci]

So it appears the JBA shorties PN:1625S-7JT are the way to go as opposed to the FRPP Cobra Shorties M-9430-E-465 ("B" head) because they are port matched to our "C" heads. I am going to call 1-800Ford788 Ford Performance Group's technical support to get confirmation.

Funny I had a thread going on JBA's a while back but folks seemed to think they were Identical to the FRPP cheaper etc.....but perhaps they are indeed different. The JBA's also come CARB EO# stamped on them. Down side is they are double the cost of the FRPP.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=58536

[musclemerc]

The JBA's are nothing like the FRPP's Brian, the JBA headers have seperate tubes for each front cylinder. The FRPP's share the front two tubes. The FRPP's are closer to the stock flange and the JBA's are much larger in size. Here's a few pics Brian, the first is the set I got for Skyhigh the second is the set I got for myself

[Dennis Reinhart]

I wanted to get the info from the horses mouth, so I put in a call to JBA today and spoke with someone in their engineering dept. and here's what I got from my talk with Alex. JBA PN:1625S-7JT has the flange for a 2003~2004 terminator "C" style head. The flanges are laser cut and they are port matched for "C" style heads. The reason they list one model # from 99~04 is because the larger port should'nt be an issue for the later "B" style heads just use a "B" style gasket with the install. JBA used to make several diffrent style headers for 32v engines back in the day and according to Alex using their older headers won't be an issue with the "C" style heads either. He looked at the flange lay out on the PC and verified their is only a slight diffrence in the oval across the board in the heads.

I guess in the case with the FRPP's they maybe got some complaints about the ports matching and revised their site to reflect they won't work on a "C" head. Which has definatelly changes in the last few months because they used to display their shorty's for a 2003~2004 Cobra and now it stops at 2001.

I hope this helps with all the questions. Happy Maraudering to all! :burnout:


Well again I am not trying to do any thing but help share information, and express my opinion, and I respect every ones opinion especially you Merc. I have met and respect Bruce the owner of JBA, so I sent him a email, I got this a few minutes ago. Now if you can not afford Kooks or SS works, it is any ones choice to go with shorties. Bruce does just as I do, no BS he will not sell you some thing you do not need and will help in any way he can.


Bruce Can you tell me if you feel there are gains to be made with the list below as comapared to LTH for the Marauder.

On JBA's website they list the following PN:1625S-7JT for 99-04 4V Cobra?? Does anyone know if these headers have the same port mismatch as the FRPP Shorties???

I figured since the FRPP ones state only for 99-01 4V you would have a different PN designed for the 03-04 heads..for JBAs?? Confusing...to say the least. What's different about the JBA's that their headers will work on 99-01s 4Vs as well??

Just gettin' round to emails. I don't think you'll find gains in any shorty header compared to a long tube header. So, unless you have to do it for smog legality or because there is no room, go with the long tubes.

Hope this info helps. Please let me know if I can be of further assistance. -bt


-----Original Message-----
From: DReinhart1@aol.com [mailto:DReinhart1@aol.com]
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 11:49 AM
To: Bruce Tucker
Subject: Bruce

[musclemerc]

I thought we were discussing port matched headers... We all know LT's show more gains especially on a NA vehicle. Did you get an answer diffrent from mine reguarding the exhaust ports matching for a "C" style head?

[Dennis Reinhart]

Yes I thought we were sharing information. And as I said respect your opinion.

[Glenn]

FRPP shorty headers dyno test - 15 HP gain on a Cobra 4V engine. Note the picture of the header in the lower left corner. Click image several times to enlarge.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/gallery/data/500/thumbs/FRPP_Shorty_Dyno_p1.jpg (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/16446/ppuser/995) ===== Note: Information contained here for an informed decision!

Glenn Ford:burnout:

[dohc324ci]

Lets not turn this thread into a Shorty vs LT debate guys.

I like foolin around and having fun and all but lets stick to the topic so that we can flush out the facts so the folks considering can have the info to make an informed decision.

[Dennis Reinhart]

FRPP shorty headers dyno test - 15 HP gain on a Cobra 4V engine. Note the picture of the header in the lower left corner. Click image several times to enlarge.

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/gallery/data/500/thumbs/FRPP_Shorty_Dyno_p1.jpg (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/16446/ppuser/995)

Glenn Ford:burnout:


Thanks Glennn I am ready fo a Seabreeze and dinner at Popadoes, what do you think:beer:

[Glenn]

I hope I get invited - :beer:

Glenn :burnout:

[Dennis Reinhart]

I aggree:bows: have a good evening.

[musclemerc]

OK, I think at this point we can say that any shorty header will produce more flow over the stock manifolds, flange matching or not. But in my opinion the JBA's should be the first choice because they are the only one that has a matched flange for our "C" heads. They also require more work to fit than the FRPP's due to the design, so everyone should be aware of that before making a decision on a shorty header. In the end their all worth the effort because the main restriction on a MM is in the midpipe section. I hope this for sale thread helps the guy's thinking about doing this mod. ;)

[Dennis Reinhart]

I agree and I will even call Bruce and try and get them a better price, and they can do this on there own.;)

[prchrman]

Do any of the shorties bolt up the stock manifold. Looks like it would. Also what head does a 93 M8 have? I know it is a 4V but is it a C or whatever?

[musclemerc]

Do any of the shorties bolt up the stock manifold. Looks like it would. Also what head does a 93 M8 have? I know it is a 4V but is it a C or whatever?

I don't understand your question.... A stock manifold is either (A) the stock exhaust manifold (stock header) or (B) An intake mainfold (which I like to see you put any header on) ????? Not being a smart a$$ but preacherman you got me lost!

[prchrman]

I don't understand your question.... A stock manifold is either (A) the stock exhaust manifold (stock header) or (B) An intake mainfold (which I like to see you put any header on) ????? Not being a smart a$$ but preacherman you got me lost!

bolt up to the stock exhaust system, sorry my bad.

[musclemerc]

None will bolt up the stock exhaust system... All the piping to the mufflers will need to be swapped by using any 1999~2004 mustang H, X, or Prochamber. Even then they have to be stretched 4" or so to make it past the transmission tailshaft so you can tie into the stock system. There'a alot of fab work so this may not be a job for you!

[FordNut]

Do any of the shorties bolt up the stock manifold. Looks like it would. Also what head does a 93 M8 have? I know it is a 4V but is it a C or whatever?

I think all the Mk8's have B heads, as well as the '96-'98 Cobras.

[dohc324ci]

OK, I think at this point we can say that any shorty header will produce more flow over the stock manifolds, flange matching or not. But in my opinion the JBA's should be the first choice because they are the only one that has a matched flange for our "C" heads. They also require more work to fit than the FRPP's due to the design, so everyone should be aware of that before making a decision on a shorty header. In the end their all worth the effort because the main restriction on a MM is in the midpipe section. I hope this for sale thread helps the guy's thinking about doing this mod. ;)


Hey musclemerc,

I agree. Lets clarify further, I just got off the phone with FRPP tech support (800 Ford788) and the FRPP Shorty Headers Ceramic Coated PN:M-9430-E465 IS compatible with our "C" heads! 99-04 are "C" heads. Pre-99 4.6 DOHC are "B" heads. So Dennis I dont know which PN: motorcraft shorty headers you were referring to but it may have indeed been for the "B" heads...??

So it appears we do have two options for shorty's JBA and FRPP based on my findings. Now with that said we still have to hunt down some Mustang H pipes and custom fabricate to work with the Marauder.

Cheers!


Reference:

DOHC Head information: http://www.sullivanperformance.com/YVS450/tech/tech1.htm

Ford Racing Performance Parts Tech line: 800-FORD788

FRPP website: http://www.fordracingparts.com/home/home.asp

JBA website: http://www.jbaheaders.com/

[musclemerc]

Atta Boy Brian! I think we got it all covered. Maybe we can get the for sale stuff deleted from this thread and put together a sticky with the information we discovered. Lord know's I went into my shorty install blind and this will help other members considering this mod. BTW I just left the salvage yard getting parts for the EGR adaptor. People should also know that if an intake spacer is in their future the length of the EGR adaptor will need to be longer to make for an easy hook up. :cool:

[dohc324ci]

Sorry for highjacking your thread musclemerc....

But I think this is all pertinent info.

Because the 99-02 "C" tumble port heads were revised in 03-04 to "C" twin port heads there may be slight variance in the shorty headers bolt patterns. However, all DOHC 4.6 & 5.4s all have the same exhaust port design. With that said, I am going to slap these bad boys and and will report back my findings. Just give me some time, I need to find the rest of the components necessary to complete my new exhaust setup.

Waiting for my buddy to finish my EGR relocation mod...hehehe