How does one flash the EEC?

[CRUZTAKER]

Will someone please spell out in plain and simple language how to flash a tune into our EEC please?

I am having the worst set of circumstances with the shop working on my Marauder.

I asked them CLEARLY before they started work...."You guys are SCT tuners right...?"

"Oh yeah, we sure are" he exclaimed.

Turns out his SCT license or some BS won't read my flip chip, and he is claiming our cars are unique and yada yada bs....Zack can explain better.
Zack was kind enough to call the guy to try and help.

I guess this fellow's software...hardware...whatever ...was purchased in Australia and doesn't have all the...whatever's, and he needed to purchase something to communicate with mine. Well, he has the upgrade now, but hasn't started yet. Maybe next week.

My question to him today was...." Will you please flash the final (base-street) tune into my EEC so that I might pull the chip if I go to the EPA inspection station.

Now he's claiming he can't do that on my car.

WTF!!!!!!!!!:censor:

Dennis, Lidio, even Jerry W. used to flash tunes onto my EEC.
WHY THE F CAN'T THIS GUY FIGURE IT OUT?????:shake:

Maybe someone here can explain it to me....and I'll make an attempt to convey it to him.

[FordNut]

It's pretty simple but it can be intimidating until you figure it all out.

Get an Xcal2. An Xcal3 will work but it's a lot more expensive. Make sure it is unlocked.

Download the tune from the tuner's computer to the xcal.

MAKE SURE THE CHIP IS NOT INSTALLED.

Connect the xcal to the OBD2 port.

Follow the on-screen instructions.

[FordNut]

BTW, if your tuner can't figure this out on his own, I would have serious concerns with their tuning ability.

[RF Overlord]

Bear, if you (or anyone) need to explain how flash memory works to these jamokes, then grab your car keys and RUN away.

Basically, flash memory is a specific kind of PROM (Programmable Read-Only Memory) called an EEPROM (Electrically Erasable PROM) where the data stored is non-volatile, meaning it doesn't need to be kept powered to maintain integrity. The difference is that an EEPROM can be erased and re-programmed multiple times, where the data in a PROM can only be set once and is then permanent. Devices like the X-Cal can place the flash memory in your PCM into the "write" mode and replace the stored data with new data provided by your tuner.

[FordNut]

I would drive it to Chicago. Bob (Zack's tuner) or Tim Barth (my tuner who is now at Mr Norm's) could do you a good safe tune. I don't know about Bob, but I'm pretty sure Tim can build you a tune that will pass smog testing.

[a_d_a_m]

if your tuner can't figure this out on his own, I would have serious concerns with their tuning ability. http://www.rdpmotorsport.com/images/worldsfastest.jpg

There are a lot of their cars floating around town and they're all pretty stout. My buddy's WRX was tuned by them, and he's been satisfied...but on the flip of that...

My dad's car ('03 Mustang GT) has been in the same shop for a week having the suspension completely re-done. We went in to check on the progress this afternoon, and rather frustratingly:

1. Dad's car has been on the lift since Saturday, untouched. Apparently, they cannot find a supplier that has the necessary suspension parts to complete the job. Eibach claims they have a month backorder on the necessary parts, so they're going with a different manufacturer, so they can finish with the other parts.
2. Dad was fairly specific (and I seem to remember a gentlemen's agreement between the shop and Dad) about wanting to come in and talk about tire selection when the job was close to being done. While performance is important; low road noise, driveability, and rain performance are also equally important, as is the appearance of the tire. In casual conversation about issue #1, it was mentioned that the tires were already ordered...
3. Communication about issues 1 & 2 has been nonexistent, which to me would be unacceptable had I agreed upon a price for the extensive modifications that are being done to the car.


I'm not trying to threadjack, Barry, I'm just letting you know that we are also a little perturbed at the moment. I'd ask that what we've posted here, stay here, instead of making its way into any discussions we may be having with them...i.e. avoiding a "the owner of that Mustang is pissed off too" sort of thing. I mentioned to them that I knew the owner of WTF IS IT, and that's all they are going to know.

[FordNut]

A Marauder with a supercharger is VERY easy to put a rod through the block.

[justbob]

Bob Kurgans tunes do infact pass emissions. A few of us run his tunes around here.
http://www.kurganmotorsports.com/

[CRUZTAKER]

3. Communication about issues 1 & 2 has been nonexistent.......

I'm not trying to threadjack, Barry, I'm just letting you know that we are also a little perturbed at the moment. I'd ask that what we've posted here, stay here, instead of making its way into any discussions we may be having with them...i.e. avoiding a "the owner of that Mustang is pissed off too" sort of thing. I mentioned to them that I knew the owner of WTF IS IT, and that's all they are going to know.

You hit the nail on the head.
I had a big conversation with them about the lack of communication.
There is a definate problem with them in that regard.

If the damn car would run on the crap tune I'd drive it to Chicago....but it is really bad right now...and I don't believe it would be an enjoying 5 hour ride.:(

[CRUZTAKER]

It's pretty simple but it can be intimidating until you figure it all out.

Get an Xcal2. An Xcal3 will work but it's a lot more expensive. Make sure it is unlocked.

Download the tune from the tuner's computer to the xcal.

MAKE SURE THE CHIP IS NOT INSTALLED.

Connect the xcal to the OBD2 port.

Follow the on-screen instructions.

Thank you, and all other responses as well.

I'll be interested in what excuse is puked when I share this simple instruction. Hell...even I understand it.

[FordNut]

If the damn car would run on the crap tune I'd drive it to Chicago....but it is really bad right now...and I don't believe it would be an enjoying 5 hour ride.:(

Must be really bad. Most of the time if it will run at all you can drive ok cruising on the highway since it is in closed loop.

Didn't realize it was that far away.

[FordNut]

I'm in a similar situation, no good tuners local to me. I have to go to Atlanta, about 2-1/2 hours away.

[babbage]

Thank you, and all other responses as well.

I'll be interested in what excuse is puked when I share this simple instruction. Hell...even I understand it.

You still don't get it because still no one (idiots :P) has yet explained it. Allow me:

All SCT Dealers are different, and they get to choose what they want to buy and be able to tune. Think of it like a drug dealer (lol) Not all dealers are going to have all drugs.

SCT Dealers have a choice of what DATABASES they own. Most don't have the Marauder database. This is your first hurdle. Just because they are SCT does not mean they can tune a Marauder. (got to own that file)

No Database to start with = No tunie.

Also you have a flip chip which is old school and getting rare-err every day.
The dealer would need the EEPROM board chip burner to remove your chip and re-burn it. I doubt SCT even sells this or offers it to dealers anymore. Have them send the tune to Dennis R and have Dennis burn the chip and mail it to you.

Most dealers just have the XCAL2 or XCAL3 ability. This is where they dyno your junk, make changes to the tune then just take your XCAL2 or XCAL3 (which you do not have) a plain 'ol USB cable hook it to their PC with the SCT dealer software and then upload that program into YOUR XCAL2 or XCAL3 HANDHELD DEVICE.

You the customer then takes that handheld device - jam into the OBDII connector and upload it into your car. This only allows you to upload ONE tune at a time.

But you are different - you have no XCAL2 or XCAL3 - You have a chip, or flip chip, or 3 bank flip chip skip deal so there is a different process to get it done which requires different software and hardware.

Again the dealer needs a special device which he can take your chip, insert it into the machine and then upload or burn that chip with the new tune (instructions) Here is an example picture of an EEC "burner"
http://www.commodore.ca/gallery/hardware/pet_eprom_programmer.jpg


Do you see the light?

[FordNut]

You still don't get it because still no one (idiots :P) has yet explained it. Allow me:

All SCT Dealers are different, and they get to choose what they want to buy and be able to tune. Think of it like a drug dealer (lol) Not all dealers are going to have all drugs.

SCT Dealers have a choice of what DATABASES they own. Most don't have the Marauder database. This is your first hurdle. Just because they are SCT does not mean they can tune a Marauder. (got to own that file)

No Database to start with = No tunie.

Also you have a flip chip which is old school and getting rare-err every day.
The dealer would need the EEPROM board chip burner to remove your chip and re-burn it. I doubt SCT even sells this or offers it to dealers anymore. Have them send the tune to Dennis R and have Dennis burn the chip and mail it to you.

Most dealers just have the XCAL2 or XCAL3 ability. This is where they dyno your junk, make changes to the tune then just take your XCAL2 or XCAL3 (which you do not have) a plain 'ol USB cable hook it to their PC with the SCT dealer software and then upload that program into YOUR XCAL2 or XCAL3 HANDHELD DEVICE.

You the customer then takes that handheld device - jam into the OBDII connector and upload it into your car. This only allows you to upload ONE tune at a time.

But you are different - you have no XCAL2 or XCAL3 - You have a chip, or flip chip, or 3 bank flip chip skip deal so there is a different process to get it done which requires different software and hardware.

Again the dealer needs a special device which he can take your chip, insert it into the machine and then upload or burn that chip with the new tune (instructions) Here is an example picture of an EEC "burner"
http://www.commodore.ca/gallery/hardware/pet_eprom_programmer.jpg


Do you see the light?

I thought this idiot explained it pretty well.

You got a SCT chip burner? It's called the chipper, and it is indeed still available. I doubt that a new SCT tuner would have one, but that wasn't the question was it?

[a_d_a_m]

You still don't get it because still no one (idiots :P) has yet explained it. Allow me.

Do you see the light? That was actually quite informative. Thank you!

[babbage]

I thought this idiot explained it pretty well.

You got a SCT chip burner? It's called the chipper, and it is indeed still available. I doubt that a new SCT tuner would have one, but that wasn't the question was it?


Haha Brian - The question was why can't my SCT dealer hook me up?

[FordNut]

Haha Brian (ignoramus)- The question was why can't my SCT dealer hook me up?

HAHA Moron...learn to read.



How does one flash the EEC?

Will someone please spell out in plain and simple language how to flash a tune into our EEC please?


Your answer doesn't come close to "in plain and simple language how to flash a tune into our EEC please?"

[babbage]

HAHA Moron...learn to read.



Your answer doesn't come close to "in plain and simple language how to flash a tune into our EEC please?"


You are right -- ignoramus. You can't see the forest for the trees. Typical.

[FordNut]

You are right -- ignoramus. You can't see the forest for the trees. Typical.

Actually I do know what I'm talking about, I do have the ability to do my own tuning with both the xCal2 and the chip. Your explanation is not helpful for Barry, it may explain some of the general details of tuning but it is generic enough that it won't help him tell the tuner how to get a tune into his car. Your immediate name-calling as soon as you post isn't helpful to ANYBODY.

[babbage]

I was just teasing with the name calling. you however took it personally. The OP wanted to know why the dealer couldn't do it. You merely explained how the dealer could do it -- not why.

[CRUZTAKER]

Ok, ok, ok...

Please, I do not want to start a fight.

I actually needed a bit of further explaination in regards to the dealer's abilities depending on the license and equipment they have.
I actually knew this to some extent already...however...this dealer assured me PRIOR to taking my car, "sure! I can tune it!".
Well....he can't....and now I sit for a month while he figures out what he needs, and puts me through a guilt trip because HE now has to spend a ton of money to GET the stuff he needs.

Back on topic....there was a specific topic question presented, and Fordnut nailed it.
How does one flash the EEC?

If this dealer uses XCAL2 or XCAL3, shouldn't he be able to FLASH my EEC regarless of whether or not he can work with my flip chip?
This is assuming he can read/write for BMD0.

[vtwoodsman]

A good rule when requesting service at a car service center/shop: "GET IT IN WRITING"! That is...have a signed work order "specifying" the problem or requested service and keep a copy. Every state has consumer laws specifically for this situation. Typically this happens when you go to a brand name car dealer service center...they have you sign a work order with the specifics.

[FordNut]

Ok, ok, ok...

Please, I do not want to start a fight.

I actually needed a bit of further explaination in regards to the dealer's abilities depending on the license and equipment they have.
I actually knew this to some extent already...however...this dealer assured me PRIOR to taking my car, "sure! I can tune it!".
Well....he can't....and now I sit for a month while he figures out what he needs, and puts me through a guilt trip because HE now has to spend a ton of money to GET the stuff he needs.

Back on topic....there was a specific topic question presented, and Fordnut nailed it.
How does one flash the EEC?

If this dealer uses XCAL2 or XCAL3, shouldn't he be able to FLASH my EEC regarless of whether or not he can work with my flip chip?
This is assuming he can read/write for BMD0.

Yes, if he has the BMD0 code in his license/database he should have no problems loading a tune to a xCal and then flashing your PCM. Just make sure he pulls the chip first, or it will blow the PCM and the chip. Both of them will go "poof" and let the smoke out.

BTW, technical terminology there, if you "let the smoke out" of an electronic device it will no longer work.

You shouldn't feel guilty, you asked the right question and the tuner gave you a bad answer. If he needs to buy the license for your PCM code from SCT that shouldn't cost too much. The hardware (xCal or chipper) will probably cost $300 or more. If he gets an xCal you need to keep it, since it will be VIN-locked to your car and he can't re-use it on another car anyway. And you can have another tuner load an improved/revised file using it. If he gets a chipper he will probably want to keep it, but if you're going to have to pay for it you ought to keep it just in case you run into a similar issue in the future.

Make sure he gives you a copy of your tune file in .mtf format, either on a flash drive or a cd. You will need that in order to have modifications made to your tune (shift points, pressures, etc).

[CRUZTAKER]

Update...

I just got a call from the tuner and he has successfully aquired the appropriate software and such to read my files on the disks I got from the tuner in Chicago, and the files on my flip chip.

Initially he could not read my files...and later learned they were not in my code.
He had to purchase ANOTHER license.


I have a BMD0 car but my files changed over time to CRD0.

I guess it's time to get the p-touch out and change that EEC label.lol...:P

[a_d_a_m]

Edited....don't mind me!

[cvpiftw]

Wish you luck.

[CRUZTAKER]

Well....she made 450 rwhp on a safe preliminary pull with 93 octane.
I believe he is using a Mustang Dyno...his accent is a bit thick and sometimes I cannot quite understand him.

What I do know is, the car is making good power, idling like a kitten, and no longer blowing shat tons of smoke on wot like it did after CRT IN NORWALK got their hands on it.

Apparently, the fuel curves in my existing files were not EVEN CLOSE to a safe limit and this was causing my run lean and massive smoke puke on wot everyone told me about in Indy.

As the next few days pass, he will tweak my tune, run it with NOS, and drain the fuel tank and start all over with race fuel.
No more simulations and guessing how to tune on 100+ octane.

Judging from the success of this fellows incredible mopar builds known nationwide, we may end up in a position I have not been in since Jerry W. did house calls in the mid 2000's.

I am getting excited....:P

[1stMerc]

Glad to hear things are looking better for the car Barry. Keep us posted.

[babbage]

Good deal. Sounds like you are getting a fantastic tune. Congrats.

[FordNut]

Glad to hear they're getting it straightened out. It's nice to like your car again, I know there have been times when never-ending problems have made me wish I had left mine stock.

[CRUZTAKER]

Glad to hear they're getting it straightened out. It's nice to like your car again, I know there have been times when never-ending problems have made me wish I had left mine stock.

Well....I was hating the car again for several hours today.

It seems it would run really well, but after sitting for a bit it would run like shat again.
It was almost as if it was forgetting its tune.
It did this all day yesterday and into this morning.

I was personally ready to throw in the towel...this guy spent 16 hours ironing out this tune and it kept acting peculier.
Turns out that the last time I shredded a belt, the belt shreds broke more than just an oil line. It damged the pcv valve hose and the car was occationally sucking unmetered air.

With that corrected, it seems we're done.
I go pick it up tomorrow...can't wait to see the bill...:bigcry:
I expect it to be higher than what Zack charged me for the motor...

[CRUZTAKER]

$1900 ..... JEEZ EFFING BUNYIPS!:eek:

Half of that was fixing CRT's bonehead mistakes...

[a_d_a_m]

That's at least $300 less than my dad's Mustang will end up being...which coincidentally, we are also picking up tomorrow. Maybe I'll see ya there.

[FordNut]

$1900 ..... JEEZ EFFING BUNYIPS!:eek:

Half of that was fixing CRT's bonehead mistakes...

OUCH! no vaseline?

[justbob]

Just how in the hell do they justify charging you that? Thats absurd.

[a_d_a_m]

I saw a certain Australian driving down SR-44 in a certain Marauder...what gives?

[CRUZTAKER]

We were on a test drive of sorts...

The car runs fine I guess.
Of course the pully swap definately tames her up a bit.

He claims he spent 16 hours on the dyno.
He only put a street tune in the flip chip...the other slots still have the old tunes. If you flip to one the car dies immediately.
The reasoning behind this was to see hoe the fisrt tune worked over time before moving on to the unique situation tunes.
Seriously...

If I understood the mechanics of automobiles and engines I would explain further.
What I do know is my mafia is lying on the passenger floor board, and the breather vent whatever thingy on the one coil cover is not connected to anything any longer....:confused:

I got home fine...but it stalled 3 times successively once on the side streets after the hot 45 minute ride home.

I see a raod trip to Chicago in my future...

[Brian H]

That's some serious rapage goin' on there!!!

[FordNut]

We were on a test drive of sorts...

The car runs fine I guess.
Of course the pully swap definately tames her up a bit.

He claims he spent 16 hours on the dyno.
He only put a street tune in the flip chip...the other slots still have the old tunes. If you flip to one the car dies immediately.
The reasoning behind this was to see hoe the fisrt tune worked over time before moving on to the unique situation tunes.
Seriously...

If I understood the mechanics of automobiles and engines I would explain further.
What I do know is my mafia is lying on the passenger floor board, and the breather vent whatever thingy on the one coil cover is not connected to anything any longer....:confused:

I got home fine...but it stalled 3 times successively once on the side streets after the hot 45 minute ride home.

I see a raod trip to Chicago in my future...

Wow. So not only was it outrageously expensive but incomplete and questionable quality.

I know hindsight is 20/20 but you could have rented a truck and trailer, put the gas in the truck to haul the car to Chicago and back, AND paid for a tune with high quality workmanship for what they charged you.

[babbage]

Wow is right. For that price a good SCT dealer would include an Xcal3 device AND 3 tunes. Did you request to keep the flip chip setup?