New 1/4 Slips From Tonight.

[guccijayda]

Hey guys. I just got back from capitol raceway to get a few runs in. Right when i got there it was about 82 degrees and I ran a 14.3X with 2.24 60' time. Another two 14.3X's with 2.2X 60' times. Best run of the night was 14.23 with 2.26 60' at around 75~ degrees(I had an hour to cool the car off also). Trap speeds averaged 99-100mph.

Before the kooks long tubes, hi flow cats, x pipe, and dynotune, i ran a slower best E.T. of 14.43 but my 60' were faster with a best of 2.17' 60 ft times at approximately 82~ degrees.

I was seriously hoping after all the mods and dyno tune and kooks system i would hit high 13's!! The E.T.s got faster, the trap speeds got faster, but the 60' times got a tad bit slower.

I launched it the same always. I would power brake it to 2k rpms and stomp it. Tires held in fine, no bog, spinning, jus chirp n go. I deflated tires to about 25psi on all runs, and went down from there.

Can anyone chime in on this and give me any input! I'm hoping I have possibility to run faster 60' so i can hit 13's. Thanks!

[MMBLUE]

Hey guys. I just got back from capitol raceway to get a few runs in. Right when i got there it was about 82 degrees and I ran a 14.3X with 2.24 60' time. Another two 14.3X's with 2.2X 60' times. Best run of the night was 14.23 with 2.26 60' at around 75~ degrees(I had an hour to cool the car off also). Trap speeds averaged 99-100mph.

Before the kooks long tubes, hi flow cats, x pipe, and dynotune, i ran a slower best E.T. of 14.43 but my 60' were faster with a best of 2.17' 60 ft times at approximately 82~ degrees.

I was seriously hoping after all the mods and dyno tune and kooks system i would hit high 13's!! The E.T.s got faster, the trap speeds got faster, but the 60' times got a tad bit slower.

I launched it the same always. I would power brake it to 2k rpms and stomp it. Tires held in fine, no bog, spinning, jus chirp n go. I deflated tires to about 25psi on all runs, and went down from there.

Can anyone chime in on this and give me any input! I'm hoping I have possibility to run faster 60' so i can hit 13's. Thanks!

Smaller rear tires. If you have a set of the stockers the gear will help ya out.

[guccijayda]

my rear tires are 295/45/18. I believe they sit a tiny bit shorter in diameter than the stock 245/55/18's. Do you still think the wide tires are hurting my times?

[justbob]

I think with the headers you lost a little low end grunt, but you sure made it up on the tail end! Nice runs for sure. Just wait till the weather chills out a bit, you'll see a 13.

[guccijayda]

thanks bob!

I just checked all my timeslips, which is like 20 lol.
Before the kooks lth, xpipe,cats, custom dyno tune, my best 60' were 2.1X's. My avg trap speeds were 97mph~. my best 1/4 time was 14.43.

After the kooks lth, xpipe,cats,custom dynotune, my best 60' times were 2.2x. My avg trapspeeds were all between 99-100 mph. my Best 1/4 time was 14.256, and several 14.3X's.

All of my runs were done with the summer heat... 75-85 degrees.

I notice when I launch a little above 2k rpms like 2100-2200rpms, the 60' is actually worse, but wen I launch around 1900-2000k rpms it is my best bet.

Can you guys chime in on your favorite way to launch your n/a rauder with stock torque converters? Any info appreciated

[justbob]

You have been doing the EXACT way I always did. I had huge issues spinning out though. I would tach at 2000 and mash on the last yellow. Never failed the tires would go up in smoke though. Any less and it would bog a little. My car hates me at the track... My best N/A (no mods at all) was 15.5 IIRC.

Even now after all my work, I am stuck with high E.T.'s:mad:

[ctrlraven]

It's tough to say since a lot of people's cars seem to really run all over the place. I did 14.25 @ 97-98 mph with a 2.1x 60ft with just a JLT intake, ngk plugs, gms coil connectors, php intake spacer, 2nd set of cats removed and flowmaster mufflers on 255/55-18 (3.50 effective rear gear). I bet once cooler weather comes your times will drop.

[a_d_a_m]

Can you guys chime in on your favorite way to launch your n/a rauder with stock torque converters? Any info appreciated I just mash it and go. Any time I tried pre-loading, my times suffered.

Best run is 14.52 @97mph. That is with a Zack tune, K&N CAI, and 285/50s in the rear.

[musclemerc]

Gucci, you expected too much outta the mods you have. I just did the exhaust debate and the horsepower combination threads so other's will have realistic expectations from their choice in mod's. The LT's loose torque on a N/A MM, plain and simple you gained a few HP's but lost alot of TQ. Keep modding, put a spacer on the intake to gain some of the lost TQ back. Too much exhaust has a reverse effect in some cases.

[babbage]

. The LT's loose torque on a N/A MM, plain and simple.

Sorry I missed that - in the proven combos thread all of the N/A MM's with the highest TQ have Kooks LT's. Could you link this again?

Typically I've seen guys drop .4 to .5 in the quarter after adding long tube headers.

Tips on getting into 13's - is your MAF clean? Are your O2' sensors still good enough for the miles you have on it?

A higher stall TQ converter will gain you in the 1/4. I dropped about .5
I think an intake spacer (slightly longer runner length) will gain you TQ
A ported and polished lower intake will also make a good difference.

Fordnut had this mod on his N/A 4.6 setup and had the highest TQ.

Again I still say that (most of the time) adding LT's should be good for .4 to .5 in the quarter on an N/A setup - all of the mid to high N/A MM's in the 13's (timeslips page) have LT's

[LANDY]

Wait till it hits the 50*'s, you will hit 13.8 easy. Just make sure you stick to the ground.

[Paul T. Casey]

More than just the temps to think about with the weather, how was the humidity? Your slower 60' times also lead me to believe you weren't getting the traction you thought you were. Sometimes you can spin a little and not notice it. Was it a test and tune night, or was there racing going on? Most tracks don't prep as well on T&T nights. Try to run the lanes with the faster cars as they will often prep one lane a little better on T&T nights. Also, as someone else said, find some stock tires. I had my best times with the BFG's. I believe they are a bit stickier.

[LANDY]

Btw my long tubes cut me .3 off my 1/4 mile on the n/a car.
Gucci your times seem right.

[musclemerc]

Alright Babb's. Here's the link: http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=64672

Look at Fordnut's *stock engine* mod list.... That's alot of work to keep the TQ lost with the LT's. Now look at TAF's mod list....Pretty short huh?

As I said with his mods he needs more intake (spacer/P&P upper,lower/60mmTB) to get back the TQ lost from the way too open LT exhaust. Look at Maryland's mod list... Pretty short too huh? The intake made all the diffrence with the TQ lost from the LT's
Now check out Impalaslayer's list LT's and a PSRI he had plenty HP but what happened with the TQ? The short runners.... Maryland kept the stock runner length and kept the TQ.


Sorry I missed that - in the proven combos thread all of the N/A MM's with the highest TQ have Kooks LT's. Could you link this again?

Typically I've seen guys drop .4 to .5 in the quarter after adding long tube headers.

Tips on getting into 13's - is your MAF clean? Are your O2' sensors still good enough for the miles you have on it?

A higher stall TQ converter will gain you in the 1/4. I dropped about .5
I think an intake spacer (slightly longer runner length) will gain you TQ
A ported and polished lower intake will also make a good difference.

Fordnut had this mod on his N/A 4.6 setup and had the highest TQ.

Again I still say that (most of the time) adding LT's should be good for .4 to .5 in the quarter on an N/A setup - all of the mid to high N/A MM's in the 13's (timeslips page) have LT's

[guccijayda]

Btw my long tubes cut me .3 off my 1/4 mile on the n/a car.
Gucci your times seem right.

My long tubes x pipe hi flows cats and a dynotune cut me off .2 seconds at best. Around $2,500 to get a .2 faster E.T. and slower 60'...fml... i need a new hobby :lol:




More than just the temps to think about with the weather, how was the humidity? Your slower 60' times also lead me to believe you weren't getting the traction you thought you were. Sometimes you can spin a little and not notice it. Was it a test and tune night, or was there racing going on? Most tracks don't prep as well on T&T nights. Try to run the lanes with the faster cars as they will often prep one lane a little better on T&T nights. Also, as someone else said, find some stock tires. I had my best times with the BFG's. I believe they are a bit stickier.
I'm not sure of the humidity didnt feel too humid at all. no traction issues whatsoever grabs like a hawk! It was a Test and Tune night. Yea once these 295's wear out ill probably go with 255/50/18's or real close to it to see the difference. I just really cant stand the looks of narrow tires on the back of a muscle car though.



It's tough to say since a lot of people's cars seem to really run all over the place. I did 14.25 @ 97-98 mph with a 2.1x 60ft with just a JLT intake, ngk plugs, gms coil connectors, php intake spacer, 2nd set of cats removed and flowmaster mufflers on 255/55-18 (3.50 effective rear gear). I bet once cooler weather comes your times will drop.

I'm very jealous of your numbers lol! Which track did you goto and what was the temp? Your sig has 2.0X 60' time on it thats awesome. I wonder if I shift gears manually down the track if it will improve my times because it seems like my gears shift a little too late at redline imo and yanks the crap out of me on each shift lol. Doing 14.2 at around 75 degrees I would hope to see 13's once it gets cooler too!!

[guccijayda]

Gucci, you expected too much outta the mods you have. I just did the exhaust debate and the horsepower combination threads so other's will have realistic expectations from their choice in mod's. The LT's loose torque on a N/A MM, plain and simple you gained a few HP's but lost alot of TQ. Keep modding, put a spacer on the intake to gain some of the lost TQ back. Too much exhaust has a reverse effect in some cases.

Yup, but the mods costed a boatload of $$$!! lol, $2500 for kooks system, installation and dynotune, end up barely .2 faster E.T.s. Just kinda frustrates me a little bit especially where I am at now paycheck to paycheck!
My next mods will def be the php spacer, 180 stat, steeda udps, thinking about pp, 60mm tb, etc... Just might be a while before this gets done! Im thinking with the money I spent on the mods I have now, the marauder couldve had a blower running 12's.

[breeze]

your tires are too big. when i switched tires i hook real good but lost time. i went to 265/50. now think how 295/50 or /45s will affect your times.

[guccijayda]

your tires are too big. when i switched tires i hook real good but lost time. i went to 265/50. now think how 295/50 or /45s will affect your times.

true that I remember that lol! Must of been a blower. What tires did you have on it before?

[breeze]

bfgs 235/50s. spun/chirpping out the hole with heating them up. with the nittos its hook and GO! plus for a stock MM 265s are a whide enough tire w/o mods. pretty soon ill need wider tires anyways. :D

[guccijayda]

soon to be eatonized eh, I'm waiting for joe walsh to put his eaton in that i sold him! I love selling on this site because I feel happy to help another member out and I cant wait to see it run.

[breeze]

possibly...maaayyyybe.lol...i wana know how those cams are gonna act with the blower. sucking more air and letting more in. that bad boy is gonna be BREATHE-ING!

[babbage]

Alright Babb's. Here's the link: http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=64672

Look at Fordnut's *stock engine* mod list.... That's alot of work to keep the TQ lost with the LT's. Now look at TAF's mod list....Pretty short huh?


Duh? I'm blind then. Stock TQ = 259 ~261

Show me an MM with LT's that has less than 259~261 TQ - you said you'd loose TQ on an N/A MM with LT's and this isn't true.

:confused:

Perhaps at lower rpms on the dyno graphs?

[musclemerc]

I agree, thats why I made the threads. Realistic numbers with realistic expectations


Yup, but the mods costed a boatload of $$$!! lol, $2500 for kooks system, installation and dynotune, end up barely .2 faster E.T.s. Just kinda frustrates me a little bit especially where I am at now paycheck to paycheck!

My next mods will def be the php spacer, 180 stat, steeda udps, thinking about pp, 60mm tb, etc... Just might be a while before this gets done! Im thinking with the money I spent on the mods I have now, the marauder couldve had a blower running 12's.

This combination will get you to the 3xx+HP/3xx+TQ for N/A that's really good. Keep up the good work Gucci.

[musclemerc]

You are... Stock is 242HP


Duh? I'm blind then. Stock TQ = 259 ~261

Show me an MM with LT's that has less than 259~261 TQ - you said you'd loose TQ on an N/A MM with LT's and this isn't true.

:confused:

Perhaps at lower rpms on the dyno graphs?

[babbage]

. The LT's loose torque on a N/A MM, plain and simple you gained a few HP's but lost alot of TQ.

Read what you said above - you are wrong. He did not loose ANY TQ.

[musclemerc]

^^ Babbs if your comparing to a stock MM then you are correct, he did'nt loose TQ, but you used Fordnut as the base for your comparison, he has alot of mods to get his stock MM engine HP/TQ number's and I just pointed that out. I think even Gucci knew what I was getting at. He even brought up the cost-to-HP/TQ gains as a factor.

Brian (Fordnut) is unlike most member's here. He dumped alot of money and time into each combination and obviously a budget was'nt an issue. He has the highest HP/TQ stock engine MM, highest N/A BBS combo, highest Procharger/BBS combo, and Whipple/BBS combo. Look at the list at how he paired stall's, transmission's, intake combo's, SC combo's, etc.
To use him as a comparison for a regular N/A guy was crazy.

[babbage]

No MM *ever* lost TQ by adding longtubes - N/A, SC or nitrous. That's all I'm saying and I can't understand why you said that he lost TQ by adding LT's -- cause he clearly did not.

I did not use Fordnut as base comparison. I merely said he had some good mods that would help guccijayda - like a higher stall TC and a PP lower.

[ImpalaSlayer]

i had full bolt ons and never ran a 13. i ran like 4 or 5 14.0x in a row. i got pissed off, spent another 3500 bucks and skipped the 13s completely. running n/a at the track was alot of fun though.

[breeze]

You are... Stock is 242HP

my car still had more hp to put out. i hit the rev limit at 5500rpms because of my smaller rear tires but hp was still rising so i have alittle more then 242.

[RR|Suki]

work on the 60' that's where all the time is hiding. You're making enough power and tq looking at your sheet to do a lot better than a 2.2. Even a 2.0 would put in in the 13s, and that's still a bad 60'

[Ralph Sr.]

most of us know long tube headers help, at top rpm's !!!! you lose torque at bottom end- gain in top rpm's, thats why your 60ft times ,drag times little slower .. are you runing 4.10 rear gears,? they will help out of hole, and get you into the rpm's to make the more power, show up.. many years ago bought new 1985 corvette runing high 13/low 14 seconds at the strip.. spent $2,500 for larger headers /pipes all the way back. vette went 2/3 tens slower at the strip, like you. i had to work on other tricks to get back to stock where i was !! listen to all these mm guys,they know best for these cars.

[musclemerc]

^^Atleast someone understood what I was trying to say. I will work on wording it better the next time Babb's.

[babbage]

Perhaps at lower rpms. . .


^^Atleast someone understood what I was trying to say. I will work on wording it better the next time Babb's.

Believe me I got it - see above. :flamer:

[babbage]

most of us know long tube headers help, at top rpm's !!!! you lose torque at bottom end- gain in top rpm's, thats why your 60ft times ,drag times little slower .. are you runing 4.10 rear gears,? they will help out of hole, and get you into the rpm's to make the more power, show up.. many years ago bought new 1985 corvette runing high 13/low 14 seconds at the strip.. spent $2,500 for larger headers /pipes all the way back. vette went 2/3 tens slower at the strip, like you. i had to work on other tricks to get back to stock where i was !! listen to all these mm guys,they know best for these cars.

Sounds like 3" pipes. yeah? Too big of a pipe will kill exhaust velocity - which will kill power.

[musclemerc]

Will you stop flaming me?


Believe me I got it - see above. :flamer:

[FordNut]

Sounds like 3" pipes. yeah? Too big of a pipe will kill exhaust velocity - which will kill power.

3" pipes as well as too big of a header will kill bottom end torque. The Kooks and SW that most of us use are properly sized so NO BOTTOM END TQ IS LOST. That is with 1-5/8" primaries and 2-1/2" collectors which goes along with the cats and the rest of the system back to the mufflers being setup at 2-1/2"

[FordNut]

Im thinking with the money I spent on the mods I have now, the marauder couldve had a blower running 12's.

Yep, if you're looking at making a NA MM go fast, it has to be on principle with a big pocketbook because it won't be cheap and it won't be very fast either.

[FordNut]

work on the 60' that's where all the time is hiding. You're making enough power and tq looking at your sheet to do a lot better than a 2.2. Even a 2.0 would put in in the 13s, and that's still a bad 60'

That's the right answer... It's hard to get a 1.90 NA, takes a good burnout, sticky track, just right on the preload.

First make sure you're getting a good launch with no spin. If it's squeaking the tires on launch, you're not doing enough burnout. Then once you figure out how to get the tires hot enough experiment with preload RPM's. I believe in NA form I used 2200 or so.

[ctrlraven]

I'm very jealous of your numbers lol! Which track did you goto and what was the temp? Your sig has 2.0X 60' time on it thats awesome. I wonder if I shift gears manually down the track if it will improve my times because it seems like my gears shift a little too late at redline imo and yanks the crap out of me on each shift lol. Doing 14.2 at around 75 degrees I would hope to see 13's once it gets cooler too!!
The biggest improvement was the correct tuning of my 3500 stall converter and running 16" drag radials (255/50-16), dropped about half a second. Do not manually shift your car, you'll end up running slower. The weather, larger rear tires (IMHO 295 series is too wide for the power and weight of the car being NA), and first time out with the exhaust. It took me several runs to get the feel for the car especially since it was the first automatic I had ever raced, all my previous cars were manual and some had a 2-step launch control setup.


my car still had more hp to put out. i hit the rev limit at 5500rpms because of my smaller rear tires but hp was still rising so i have alittle more then 242.You wouldn't of gotten anymore hp, maybe 1 to 3 more. The average stock Marauder does 235-245rwhp and 250-260rwtq. Mine bone stock with flowmaster mufflers did 241rwhp and 253rwtq.

[breeze]

You wouldn't of gotten anymore hp, maybe 1 to 3 more. The average stock Marauder does 235-245rwhp and 250-260rwtq. Mine bone stock with flowmaster mufflers did 241rwhp and 253rwtq.

i know that, how many do you think a couple is. back up off me chris, youve been givin me a hard time bout my car ever since i got it chill out! :bandit:

[ctrlraven]

i know that, how many do you think a couple is. back up off me chris, youve been givin me a hard time bout my car ever since i got it chill out! :bandit:
Do you need a hug or something? :lol:

No need to get testy man, I haven't given you a hard time at all. If you feel that I have then I apologize but that was never my intention. :beer:

[FordNut]

Another one?

[breeze]

Then once you figure out how to get the tires hot enough experiment with preload RPM's. I believe in NA form I used 2200 or so.

gee, anything slighty over 2k my cars ready to rock n roll. :burnout: