Dropped Valve Seat Repair w/Pics [Archive] - MercuryMarauder.net Forums

Zack

11-02-2010, 06:03 PM

I took Gary's Marauder in Saturday. (chapel1)
His MM has had a miss that got something terrible in the past few weeks. No engine codes or obvious things wrong.

I pulled the plugs out and knew which hole was bad as soon as I got to #8...it was soaked. I tried a new coil and plug first to rule that out, then did a compression test....FAIL...ZERO

Fast forward to Monday when I started further diagnosis. I popped the cam cover off to find a follower laying in the head. Clue # 1.
Then I popped the other 3 followers off for that cylinder and pressurized the cyliinder with air. A quick trip to the tailpipe and you could hear the air coming out plain as day. Final Clue....valve seat

So quite literally a few hours later im to the point as seen in the pics below.
Head goes into the shop tomorrow. Thankfully the cylinder wall looks good. Im confident the car will run good as new when its back together.
BTW, to save time I pulled the head and exhaust manifold off as a unit.
Gary, dont freak at the pics, I know where everything goes, LOL.

http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/100_2392.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/100_2393.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/100_2394.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/100_2395.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/100_2398.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/100_2397.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/100_2401.jpg

ImpalaSlayer

11-02-2010, 06:06 PM

god that cylinder head looks gross on the #8

DOOM

11-02-2010, 06:07 PM

I see the car is in more than capable hands.

Change the brake fluid while you're at it! :puke: :lol:

Motorhead350

11-02-2010, 06:07 PM

I thought the engine had to come out of the car to remove the head. :confused:

CBT

11-02-2010, 06:07 PM

I pulled the plugs out and knew which hole was bad as soon as I got to #8...it was soaked. I tried a new coil and plug first to rule that out, then did a compression test....FAIL...ZERO

For us non-Marauder engine pro's, soaked with what?

Zack

11-02-2010, 06:08 PM

I thought the engine had to come out of the car to remove the head. :confused:

Well obviously it doesnt, who told you that?

Zack

11-02-2010, 06:08 PM

For us non-Marauder engine pro's, soaked with what?

Gasoline my beer drinking buddy :beer:

ImpalaSlayer

11-02-2010, 06:08 PM

I thought the engine had to come out of the car to remove the head. :confused:

key word i sadi was i THOUGHT but i also said i thought i herd it was possible

Motorhead350

11-02-2010, 06:10 PM

Well obviously it doesnt, who told you that?

Some folks on here. I think in the head removal thread. Not worth searching for, now that I see the truth. This is exactly what I wanted you to do to my car. I just need to find $$$.

Motorhead350

11-02-2010, 06:11 PM

key word i sadi was i THOUGHT but i also said i thought i herd it was possible

Oh ok. No worries. Now we know. :)

CBT

11-02-2010, 06:12 PM

Gasoline my beer drinking buddy :beer:
See? I was thinking oil. Sometimes I fail.

RacerX

11-02-2010, 06:24 PM

Nice quick diagnosis and teardown Zack! Is that beer in the cylinders???:beer:
Now do you have to put an oversize seat on and cut it down? Or is area under the seat ok because there was no hammering with the lash adjuster missing?

To do the head removal, notice the wiper cowl and radiator missing, you can almost stand in there!

DEFYANT

11-02-2010, 06:48 PM

Great info. Thanks for sharing. WTF was Ford thinking with such shallow spark plug threads!?

chapel1

11-02-2010, 07:36 PM

Zack ,
Thanks for posting up.I'm glad I got to you as soon as I did!!I s that normal for the pistons to be so carboned?

RacerX

11-02-2010, 07:43 PM

Is that normal for the pistons to be so carboned?
Yup. That's not bad. You change the oil on time too I see. Under the timing cover looks very clean.

chapel1

11-02-2010, 07:58 PM

RacerX

11-02-2010, 08:10 PM

Nothing you did. Mfg. defect. Mass production booboo. It doesn't look bad at all. It looks like as soon as it happened, the lash adjuster popped off, which is great. That way every time the cam lobe swings around, it's not moving the valve which would have just hammered all that over and over. Zack will have her running great in no time!

ntd

11-03-2010, 03:57 AM

Every 3,000 miles and less than 60,000 miles? And I drop a valve seat? I'm still trying to figure if I did something wrong? First, I thought dirty EATC valve?,dirty throttle body, bad coils, bad plugs? Then I called ZACK!

Nice the see members helping each other out .Seeing as it's already at Zack's for the headwork is the supercharger next:poke:.

Mike

11-03-2010, 04:11 AM

Sorry to hear of your misfourtune Gary, but as it was said earlier....you ARE in good hands with Zack doing the work (ask me, I know :bows:) :beer:

BODYMAN

11-03-2010, 06:30 AM

Fantastic work & fast When did you get his car Zack? & No, heads can come with out motor removal thats how my buddy did the job on my KB 03 when smoke at startup got unbearable! OF course when he was done all he said was man I wish I had pulled the whole motor (from a time factor.) he said he could have had done faster? But there again he didnt know MM's like Zack does... that valve is really fubbard

Chevyguy

11-03-2010, 07:06 AM

Zack ,
Thanks for posting up.I'm glad I got to you as soon as I did!!I s that normal for the pistons to be so carboned?

Here is my 2004 2V engine with 80K miles

http://i348.photobucket.com/albums/q329/folingo/1996%20Town%20Car%20Signature/Engine%20Swap/SL372303.jpg

Cleaned up pretty Nice, have to be gentle with the pistons.

http://i348.photobucket.com/albums/q329/folingo/1996%20Town%20Car%20Signature/Engine%20Swap/SL372371.jpg

Zack

11-03-2010, 07:13 AM

Fantastic work & fast When did you get his car Zack? & No heads can come with out motor removal thats how my buddy did the job on my KB 03 when smoke at startup got unbearable! OFF course when he was done all he said was man I wish I had pulled the whole motor (from a time factor.) he said he could have had done faster? But there again he didnt know MM's like Zack does... that valve is really fubbard

I got the head off in under 4 hrs

Zack

11-03-2010, 07:14 AM

Here is my 2004 2V engine with 80K miles

Cleaned up pretty Nice, have to be gentle with the pistons.

I dont plan on cleaning these pistons up like you did yours.
Since this is only 50% of the engine, I cant take a risk of having one side 'out of sync' with the other.

BODYMAN

11-03-2010, 07:29 AM

I got the head off in under 4 hrs

Man talk about knowing a car. with all that hardware you were cruising along on that!!:beer:

Chevyguy

11-03-2010, 07:31 AM

I dont plan on cleaning these pistons up like you did yours.
Since this is only 50% of the engine, I cant take a risk of having one side 'out of sync' with the other.

Yeah I was going to mention that. Plus I was real careful to clean out the bores real good with lots of oil, and we cleaned the short block out real good before buttoning it up. With the engine in the car no touchey pistons

Oh yeah and of course you can't turn the crank with the chains off the cam gears lest you want to introduce the valve to the pistons, and I only cleaned the pistons when they were up at TDC.

Zack

11-03-2010, 08:04 AM

Yeah I was going to mention that. Plus I was real careful to clean out the bores real good with lots of oil, and we cleaned the short block out real good before buttoning it up. With the engine in the car no touchey pistons

The product that works the best is called Metal Prep from motorcraft.
Wipe on, let sit, gently scrape the gunk right off.

Mote

11-03-2010, 08:55 AM

Zack ,
Is that normal for the pistons to be so carboned?

A good Seafoam blast is *supposed* to clean that up. I wonder if anyone has ever proved that it does by removing a head?

Zack

11-03-2010, 09:03 AM

A good Seafoam blast is *supposed* to clean that up. I wonder if anyone has ever proved that it does by removing a head?

Bore-o-scope or removing the plug and shining a flashlight would be a lot easier.

CBT

11-03-2010, 09:17 AM

Gary you need to take it out and blow the cobwebs outta that motor :beer:

babbage

11-03-2010, 10:17 AM

Nice work Zack, how many miles are on this? 60k? The chain guides don't look worn at all how was the other side (not pictured)

Zack

11-03-2010, 10:47 AM

Nice work Zack, how many miles are on this? 60k? The chain guides don't look worn at all how was the other side (not pictured)

56k.

Ive never seen a worn out chain guide and ive taken apart engines with 150k on them

hotford

11-03-2010, 02:58 PM

56k.

Ive never seen a worn out chain guide and ive taken apart engines with 150k on them

Our fleet vehilces which are mostly Crown Vic have shown guides worn out to the point that the chain guide is riding in the aluminum and worn away the plastic,all you need to do is remove the valve cover and it's visible and the debris is plugging oil galleries to the point that the lifters start to collapse.

Mileage about 180-200 klms.Note take into consideration that there is also alot of idle time which is not on the Odometer.

Zack

11-04-2010, 12:39 PM

Machine shop just called.
They said the head is in excellent condition considering what happened.
It might be done tomorrow! :eek:
New seat, new valve, lap all 4 in and done!

Too bad the other parts wont be here to put it together!

burt ragio

11-04-2010, 02:00 PM

Zack, nice work. Durring reassembly could you explain torque rate & sequence on head bolts. Process of timming chain install & linning up TDC ?

Zack

11-04-2010, 02:07 PM

Zack, nice work. Durring reassembly could you explain torque rate & sequence on head bolts. Process of timming chain install & linning up TDC ?

I can link you to a write-up on a mustang site...way easier than me writing a novel about it.

DOOM

11-04-2010, 02:09 PM

So where's the blower??? :confused: :dunno:

Marauderjack

11-04-2010, 02:54 PM

56k.

Ive never seen a worn out chain guide and ive taken apart engines with 150k on them

Hope you are right.....almost 220K on mine and still SCREAMIN'!! :D :burnout:

Joe Walsh

11-04-2010, 03:00 PM

Blackened300a

11-04-2010, 03:05 PM

That's interesting....the valve seat just dropped out of the head!

:hmmm:
I wonder if they install valve seats like you install a cylinder liner, or like I've installed the starter gear ring on a flywheel:
Heat the heck out of the head/starter gear ring and freeze the valve seat/flywheel.
Press the two together and when they come to a common temperature, they are NOT coming apart.

I've never freezed anything, just got the ring cherry red and lined it up on the flywheel. Let it air cool and it was good to go. I've done the same with the ABS ring on axles.

-Matt-

11-04-2010, 03:51 PM

Man talk about knowing a car. with all that hardware you were cruising along on that!!:beer:

Zack is a machine... i watched him do my kooks in about 2 hours and we did the supercharger in my car in about 14ish hours... including all of the new brackets, cam covers, air to water plumbing, etc. Effin Machine. Feed him blue moon and nutter butters and he never stops

Joe Walsh

11-04-2010, 03:58 PM

Zack is a machine... i watched him do my kooks in about 2 hours and we did the supercharger in my car in about 14ish hours... including all of the new brackets, cam covers, air to water plumbing, etc. Effin Machine. Feed him blue moon and nutter butters and he never stops

Just limit the Bluemoons until he's done with the job...heh heh heh.....:P

-Matt-

11-04-2010, 03:59 PM

Just limit the Bluemoons until he's done with the job...heh heh heh.....:P

Is that why my Direct Vent Injection is routed wrong?

chapel1

11-04-2010, 04:30 PM

So where's the blower??? :confused: :dunno:

STOCK/STOCK/ STOCK /with a minor tweak of the ZACKMEISTER:banana2:

chapel1

11-04-2010, 04:32 PM

STOCK/STOCK/ STOCK /with a minor tweak of the ZACKMEISTER:banana2:
And I Guess a case of Bluemoon and some Nuterbutters? Is Bluemoon in the soda aisle?:beer:

Zack

11-04-2010, 05:34 PM

No NutterButters!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They were awesome ONCE. LOL

BODYMAN

11-04-2010, 07:03 PM

Very nice work! to say the least he is a machine from what I have seen.definite asset to this forum!

-Matt-

11-04-2010, 07:41 PM

definite ass to this forum!

Yes he definitely is!

Zack

11-07-2010, 03:42 PM

Moving right along.
Picked up the head Friday night....only a 2 day repair! It got a 2 mm oversized valve seat and a new valve. The head got cleaned up and the valves lapped in.
Despite the broken stud in the exhaust manifold (which took hours to extract) this job has been a no-brainer.
Just waiting on the Evenflow Kit and this car will be done and done.

http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/Marauder%20Repairs/100_2412.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/Marauder%20Repairs/100_2415.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/Marauder%20Repairs/100_2416.jpg
http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/Marauder%20Repairs/100_2417.jpg

chapel1

11-07-2010, 04:02 PM

Man you guys don't know how troubled,anxious and excited I've been not having my Marauder "in the House".
But,on the good side, I feel like when I get my Marauder back, not only will it be FIXED, but I'm going to get a "Improved" version of my car back!!!:banana2:

babbage

11-07-2010, 06:07 PM

Moving right along.

http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn306/Marauder-Z/Marauder%20Repairs/100_2417.jpg

How much extra was it to have the front cover cleaned? :poke:

Motorhead350

11-07-2010, 06:19 PM

I'm learning more everyday.

Zack

11-07-2010, 06:27 PM

How much extra was it to have the front cover cleaned? :poke:

Its easier to put it all back together and wash the engine as a whole.

babbage

11-07-2010, 06:38 PM

Its easier to put it all back together and wash the engine as a whole.

The edges of the cover are a lot easier to clean when its off, I've found. You almost need a toothbrush to get in there..

Anyway just busting your chops a bit. What are waiting on to finish?

Zack

11-07-2010, 06:41 PM

The edges of the cover are a lot easier to clean when its off, I've found. You almost need a toothbrush to get in there..

Anyway just busting your chops a bit. What are waiting on to finish?

Evenflow kit.

This is gonna be a real nail-biter because there is the possibility of the rings being trashed do to the cylinder being washed down with fuel for many many months now.

justbob

11-07-2010, 09:09 PM

Man, nutterbutter sounds really good now. Oh, good work too!

chapel1

11-11-2010, 06:25 PM

Very nice work! to say the least he is a machine from what I have asset to this forum!

ZACK? ZACK??? Where's ZACK??

Spectragod

11-11-2010, 07:08 PM

ZACK? ZACK??? Where's ZACK??

Uhhh, yeah, wtf happened?

RacerX

11-11-2010, 07:32 PM

Uhhh, yeah, wtf happened?
:D Zack happened!

-Matt-

11-11-2010, 09:42 PM

This effin sucks....

burt ragio

11-12-2010, 05:25 AM

I can link you to a write-up on a mustang site...way easier than me writing a novel about it.

The link would be greatly appreciated.

4play

11-12-2010, 10:52 AM

Zack is closed, does that mean he's suspended?

Blackened300a

11-12-2010, 10:54 AM

Zack is closed, does that mean he's suspended?

Yes, for reasons unknown at this time.

RacerX

11-12-2010, 11:30 AM

Yes, for reasons unknown at this time.
6203 Ball bearings perhaps...

CBT

11-12-2010, 11:33 AM

6203 Ball bearings perhaps...

I was thinking the limited-slip line lock option debate.

RacerX

11-12-2010, 11:36 AM

Oh snap! Now I gotta go get more "Days Of Our Marauders" fix! Missed that episode!

ImpalaSlayer

11-12-2010, 12:39 PM

I was thinking the limited-slip line lock option debate.

winner! indeed *****y

-Matt-

11-12-2010, 12:47 PM

Thats ******** because he didnt even say anything that bad.... unlike others in that thread... some one sided **** around here

Egon Spengler

11-12-2010, 12:56 PM

Thats ******** because he didnt even say anything that bad.... unlike others in that thread... some one sided **** around here
:baby: :baby: :baby: :baby: :baby:

massacre

11-12-2010, 01:16 PM

Lot of nutswinging goes on around here.

Egon Spengler

11-12-2010, 01:21 PM

Lot of nutswinging goes on around here.
fo sho.........

TAKEDOWN

11-12-2010, 06:03 PM

In before the LOCK!

ImpalaSlayer

11-12-2010, 06:07 PM

Lot of nutswinging goes on around here.

dont say that too loud, CBT will come running

massacre

11-12-2010, 06:13 PM

dont say that too loud, CBT will come running

That's because he likes nuts.
And swinging.
Just not necessarily in that order....lol.

*forest gump voice*

and that's all I have to say about that

*/forest gump voice*

J-MAN

11-12-2010, 07:12 PM

Nuts!.....

CBT

11-13-2010, 06:50 PM

Go **** yourself. And that's in my voice.

That's because he likes nuts.
And swinging.
Just not necessarily in that order....lol.

*forest gump voice*

and that's all I have to say about that

*/forest gump voice*

chapel1

11-13-2010, 07:42 PM

babbage

11-13-2010, 08:24 PM

Well ! I picked up my car tonight and Zack did a very nice job! Zack is a excellent mechanic who loves to fix things. Zack even fixed a burnt out oil pressure gauge light bulb. All in all I trust Zack , he will do the right thing when he works on your car. He approaches the task as if it were his car. And that to me say's a lot about the man.

Cool. Glad the rings weren't shot. Did he clean the engine? Zack knows his stuff for sure but can be dickish at times. Oh well, got a finished pic to post?

TAKEDOWN

11-14-2010, 01:54 AM

Awesome Gary, I'm glad you got your MARAUDER back and I'm sure it's better than ever!

Mike

11-14-2010, 09:49 AM

Well ! I picked up my car tonight and Zack did a very nice job! Zack is a excellent mechanic who loves to fix things. Zack even fixed a burnt out oil pressure gauge light bulb. All in all I trust Zack , he will do the right thing when he works on your car. He approaches the task as if it were his car. And that to me say's a lot about the man.

I agree 100% :beer: Glad you got the car back in your stable :D

justbob

11-14-2010, 09:52 AM

Good save. Glad it worked out for ya, still sucks that it happened in the first place though! WTH?

massacre

11-14-2010, 10:09 AM

Go **** yourself. And that's in my voice.

Wow.
Just.
Wow.
:bigcry::bigcry::bigcry:
I thought with all of your "that's what she said" comments that you would find the humor in my comment, since you seem to throw some kind of sexual comment into most of your posts.....

Apparently I was wrong.:burnout:

OP:

Glad you got everything worked out.

Joe Walsh

11-14-2010, 10:19 AM

but can be dickish at times.

LOL at that term.

I guess it is better....maybe worse.....than being "Vagina-ish"

Glad to hear that your enegine is repaired and running well....:2thumbs:

Motorhead350

11-15-2010, 11:23 AM

MERCMAN

11-15-2010, 11:26 AM

Zacks banning is all down to politics and money of this forum.

He can be helpful and appreciated to 300 active members. Soon as two people on high hoses have a problems with him he's gone. Even if 298 disagree with it and it's told it's for the good of the community.

What a crock.

Zack's banning has NOTHING to do with people on high hoses :rofl:

Motorhead350

11-15-2010, 11:30 AM

Zack's banning has NOTHING to do with people on high hoses :rofl:

What's it called then?

crouse

11-15-2010, 11:31 AM

Zack, if you ever get to Minnesota, I'd love to have you listen to my engine. I've got a rattle I've never been able to track down the source. It's been doing this for years. It's not detonation. Thanks, Curt

fastblackmerc

11-15-2010, 12:10 PM

Zacks banning is all down to politics and money of this forum.

He can be helpful and appreciated to 300 active members. Soon as two people on high hoses have a problem with him he's gone. Even if 298 disagree with it and it's told it's for the good of the community.

What a crock.

I'd start a poll, but it'll be shut down. They don't wanna be put in their place or acknowledge that anything wrong was done.

You have to remember.......

The owners / moderators of the site can run it as they wish.......

This isn't a democracy here.

You can start your own site an run it as you wish.