How often do you change?

[Da Dark Jedi]

As the title states, How often do you change Power Steering Fluid in your Marauder or other vehicles you own? If you do are you using Power Steering fluid or Trans oil? Do you flush before every change?

[RacerX]

Oh, thought this was about boxers, underwear and panties... :mad:

Ahhhh well... Trans fluid, 4R70W, 80k I believe, 50k or less if I beat the @#$% out of it, B&M synthetic. Power steering... Hmmmm... Never had to in any car yet, not sure. Flush, no, new filter and clean magnet, yes

[dbc1965]

mercon V trans fuild for power steering

[Motorhead350]

180K.... never.

[CBT]

Power what what?

[SC Cheesehead]

65K and no change on the PS fluid yet.

Is there a maintenance interval spec called out for this?

[MOTOWN]

i have yet to touch the ps @95k

[Vortex]

I dont believe I have ever changed power steering fluid in any car Ive owned over the past 35 years or so.

[SC Cheesehead]

Found these:

"Power steering fluid usually does NOT need to be replaced."
action.publicbroadcasting.net/cartalk/posts/list/1901410.page

"Power steering fluid doesn’t have to be changed as often as other vehicle’s fluids. Changing it as often as you change the engine coolant, every 80,000 miles or three to five years is often the average. The vehicle manufacturers don’t generally specify when to actually change the fluid."
http://www.brighthub.com/diy/automotive/articles/75366.aspx#ixzz1LODQPSZn

"Power steering fluid of the "long-life" variety should be changed every five years or 100,000 miles. For conventional fluid, the interval is every three years or 50,000 miles. Most likely, the fluid will appear normal at this point—either amber (on most vehicles) or pink/red in color. This is good, as no serious problems are indicated."
http://www.automedia.com/Power_Steering_Fluid_Maintenan ce/ccr20030601ps/1

Take your pick... :dunno:

[Chevyguy]

My car will get a full fluid changeover before it hits 70K, planned to just after purchase but winter came up too fast and tied up getting the winter beater running.

PS fluid is REALLY EASY to change if you have a turkey baster or some other suction device. Empty reservoir, disconnect return line, place line in catch can and secure it. Pull PCM fuse, crank engine to discharge the rest of the fluid. Refill and burp air out.

Somewhere about 70-100 K miles or 8 years the fluid does get funky.

Frankly ALL fluids are past their expiration date on any 03-04 Car with the last Marauder turning 7 years old this year.

http://www.lincolnsonline.com/tech/00044.html

[RF Overlord]

P/S in Phoebe made noise when we bought her. I did the turkey-baster dance a few times and it quieted right down. I do one every time I change the oil just to keep it fresh.

50,000 miles seems about right to replace the fluid, if you're meticulous (or A/R or OCD) about maintenance.

Manual calls for Mercon ATF.

[CBT]

P/S in Phoebe made noise when we bought her. I did the turkey-baster dance a few times and it quieted right down. I do one every time I change the oil just to keep it fresh.

50,000 miles seems about right to replace the fluid, if you're meticulous (or A/R or OCD) about maintenance.

Manual calls for Mercon ATF.

For power steering?

[RF Overlord]

That's correct. Ford has used ATF for *most* of their P/S systems for the last couple hundred years or so.

[LeoVampire]

Every 3 years I change it out when I do the tranny fluid and I use tranny fluid in it.

Usually by the 3rd year you can notice a color change in the power steering fluid.

I also change out the antifreeze every 3 years and the rear end fluid every 3 years and flush out the brake fluid as well every 3 years.

This keeps any sediment from building up due to rubber hose break down and moister from causing any internal problems due to heat up and cool down in fluid.

But that is just me and what I consider normal maintenance work to make parts last and avoid an unwanted early break down. Most people over look a lot of these fluids some get away with it others do not.

I do not drive enough or put on enough miles to do it more often than that and I am a fairly good boy with my cars not big on beating on them often.

[Chevyguy]

P/S in Phoebe made noise when we bought her. I did the turkey-baster dance a few times and it quieted right down. I do one every time I change the oil just to keep it fresh.

50,000 miles seems about right to replace the fluid, if you're meticulous (or A/R or OCD) about maintenance.

Manual calls for Mercon ATF.

Forgot to note the obvious that the link was depicting an older model.

Ford recommends Type F from whenever up to 1995, (like anything was changed from 91-95 in the 4.6 pump system) then Mercon V from there. You can use Mercon/Dextron II if you can find it (it is cheaper) but I usually have extra Mercon V from filling the trans so why buy another fluid!!

[Dereck]

Hi Guys

30,000 miles for my power steering fluid and 15,000 miles for my transmission fluid.

Regards

Dereck

[ctrlraven]

P/S in Phoebe made noise when we bought her. I did the turkey-baster dance a few times and it quieted right down. I do one every time I change the oil just to keep it fresh.

Manual calls for Mercon ATF.
That's what I do every time I drain the trans fluid since they both use Mercon V fluid.

[Bradley G]

Only if the pump or a line needed replaced, otherwise I only topped off.

[Da Dark Jedi]

I asked this question because my wife's car developed a low pitch hum at the end of winter. The car has 80K and is a 1997, so now I'm using Auto-Rx to clean it out. I also notice the cap say use ATF in it. I needed to know the differeance between the two, so I ask on another forum (RF knows) and got the answer from a gent named MolaKule. below is his response.

"A bit of history here.

First, power steering fluids (PSF) and ATF's are both hydraulic fluids because they are used in specialized hydraulic systems.

The early PSF fluids were simply mineral-based oils with a low-level phosphorous-based, or a low level of ZDDP addtives with a calcium detergent additive and anti-rust, and metal deacctivators. Specialized fricton modifiers were not needed in PS systems as they had are no friction clutches, just valves, racks, gears, seals, and hoses. Anti-oxidants of course are needed to stabilze the oil against high temperature fluid degradation.

Notice that both PS and AT sstems are essentially closed systems that do not see any combuston gases, so the addtive package and viscosity (thickness) are very different as compared to IC motor oils.

Modern ATF's have wet clutches, which required specialized friction additives to allow smooth shifting during clutch engagement/disengagement. Early ATF's were also mineral oils with low-levels of anti-wear additves mainly for the benefit of the sun/planetary gearing. In addition, low levels of detergents and dispersants are needed only to keep the internals clean. Anti-rust, and metal deactivators (especially the copper deactivators) are needed to keep the heat exchanger (cooler) metals from corroding. Anti-oxidants are needed here as well to stabilze the oil against high temperature fluid degradation.

Later, it was found that ATF's could funtion well as PSF's and it also reduced dealer inventory. Any Dexron/Merc or Type-F ATF seemed to function well as a PSF.

All was well until Honda and GM started requiring PSF formulations because of specific PS designs.

The mineral oil based Honda PSF's required high AW additive levels because of their design or design flaws inherent in the PS design.

The new GM PS fluid is essentially a very low detergent PSF, mineral-oil based fluid with a low level Boron/phos AW additive package.

The Dexron VI fluid was the first low viscosity ATF fluid (6.0 cSt), but this is only the beginning. Vehicle manufacturers are now using or developing transmissons that use fluid viscosities down to 4.0 cSt or lower.

But PSF fluids are still being specified at 7.5 cSt viscosities."


So I also went to Lubegard site and go and got this.

"LUBEGARD® POWER STEERING FLUID is a hydraulic fluid that is intermittently pressurized by a high shear, high friction pump and used in a high shear turbine motor to aid in turning a car’s steering wheel. Since the fluid is subjected to hard, long term use without regular changing intervals, it is critically important to provide extra anti-wear, anti-friction and anti-corrosion components as well as oxidation stability and a high flash point for fire protection. Power steering fluid is not interchangeable with automatic transmission fluid (ATF) because ATF does not have the anti-wear protection or shear stability needed to protect the power steering pump".

So I was wonder how many actually change their P/S fluids? Some only when things go wrong, others as regular maintenance.

"

[JOEMERC]

I use a turkey baster to get out what i can from brake booster and power steering couple times a year to keep it fresh then top off with new fluid.works for me.....

[a_d_a_m]

I've never changed mine...but I will when it's time for my next oil change!

[n9ouw]

184,645 miles P S fluid never changed , 300A 07/02 , BUTT the trans is taking a number 2 ... OD went out today ,silnoide kicks in and goes into no go . turn it off O D and it runs but makes noise ... I guess it is time for a major R&R ...

[tbone]

You can't hardly get any fluid out of the MM PS resovoir with a turkey baster. I've tried it.

Take the ONE bolt out of the resovoir that holds it on, turn it upside down and quite a bit of fluid comes out. Fill it up, drive for a while and do it again if you like. Done.

[CBT]

You can't hardly get any fluid out of the MM PS resovoir with a turkey baster. I've tried it.

Take the ONE bolt out of the resovoir that holds it on, turn it upside down and quite a bit of fluid comes out. Fill it up, drive for a while and do it again if you like. Done.

Some men just have bigger basters than others.

[RF Overlord]

Jedi, I just read your post over there...didn't realise that was you!

As you know, Mola is VERY highly respected on BITOG and I would trust his advice without question. I do, however, have a small concern with the info you quoted from the Lubegard site, to wit: "Power steering fluid is not interchangeable with automatic transmission fluid (ATF) because ATF does not have the anti-wear protection or shear stability needed to protect the power steering pump." It is technically correct that the fluids are not "interchangeable" in that one should not be used in place of the other (unless specifically allowed by the P/S pump manufacturer), but I find this advice unsettling as it may lead the uninformed to believe that ATF is inferior to P/S fluid and may cause them to use the wrong fluid in the mistaken believe that they are "improving" things.

In general, using P/S fluid in place of ATF is not a problem, although the reverse is not true, especially in the case of Honda/Acura, who has a proprietary formulation that is not compatible with any other fluid.

I think this whole discussion can be summed up as "use what the manual says". (It's not like either ATF or P/S fluid is expensive)

[SC Cheesehead]

Jedi, I just read your post over there...didn't realise that was you!

As you know, Mola is VERY highly respected on BITOG and I would trust his advice without question. I do, however, have a small concern with the info you quoted from the Lubegard site, to wit: "Power steering fluid is not interchangeable with automatic transmission fluid (ATF) because ATF does not have the anti-wear protection or shear stability needed to protect the power steering pump." It is technically correct that the fluids are not "interchangeable" in that one should not be used in place of the other (unless specifically allowed by the P/S pump manufacturer), but I find this advice unsettling as it may lead the uninformed to believe that ATF is inferior to P/S fluid and may cause them to use the wrong fluid in the mistaken believe that they are "improving" things.

In general, using P/S fluid in place of ATF is not a problem, although the reverse is not true, especially in the case of Honda/Acura, who has a proprietary formulation that is not compatible with any other fluid.

I think this whole discussion can be summed up as "use what the manual says". (It's not like either ATF or P/S fluid is expensive)

So bob, how often do change PS fluid?

[RF Overlord]

Rex, I only "changed" the P/S fluid the one time, shortly after buying Phoebe with 87k. Since then, I just drain and refill the reservoir every 2nd motor-oil change or so, to keep it fresh. Since we bought The Blackbird new, I've done the drain & fill thing once a year for the last few years as it has far fewer miles and we don't drive it as much now.

BTW, I like the Van Halen quote in your sig, although it's more appropriate for Dom than for you... :D

[SC Cheesehead]

Rex, I only "changed" the P/S fluid the one time, shortly after buying Phoebe with 87k. Since then, I just drain and refill the reservoir every 2nd motor-oil change or so, to keep it fresh. Since we bought The Blackbird new, I've done the drain & fill thing once a year for the last few years as it has far fewer miles and we don't drive it as much now.

BTW, I like the Van Halen quote in your sig, although it's more appropriate for Dom than for you... :D

Hmmmmm, haven't done mine yet, coming up on 65K, maybe oughta plan for that.

You haven't ridden with me since the Eaton swap, have you? ;) -----> :D

[RF Overlord]

No, I haven't...should I bring my neck brace and rubber underwear?

[SC Cheesehead]

No, I haven't...should I bring my neck brace and rubber underwear?

Well could just say, it...
http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQytcmOCSv1X wDdn2tXTs4k6XsABJ467pzyKgqPvuc-5b6Zf5W9

[tbone]

Some men just have bigger basters than others.

THAT'S WHAT SHE SAID!:beer:

[babbage]

I asked this question because my wife's car developed a low pitch hum at the end of winter. The car has 80K and is a 1997, so now I'm using Auto-Rx to clean it out. I also notice the cap say use ATF in it. I needed to know the differeance between the two, so I ask on another forum (RF knows) and got the answer from a gent named MolaKule. below is his response.

"A bit of history here.

First, power steering fluids (PSF) and ATF's are both hydraulic fluids because they are used in specialized hydraulic systems.

The early PSF fluids were simply mineral-based oils with a low-level phosphorous-based, or a low level of ZDDP addtives with a calcium detergent additive and anti-rust, and metal deacctivators. Specialized fricton modifiers were not needed in PS systems as they had are no friction clutches, just valves, racks, gears, seals, and hoses. Anti-oxidants of course are needed to stabilze the oil against high temperature fluid degradation.

Notice that both PS and AT sstems are essentially closed systems that do not see any combuston gases, so the addtive package and viscosity (thickness) are very different as compared to IC motor oils.

Modern ATF's have wet clutches, which required specialized friction additives to allow smooth shifting during clutch engagement/disengagement. Early ATF's were also mineral oils with low-levels of anti-wear additves mainly for the benefit of the sun/planetary gearing. In addition, low levels of detergents and dispersants are needed only to keep the internals clean. Anti-rust, and metal deactivators (especially the copper deactivators) are needed to keep the heat exchanger (cooler) metals from corroding. Anti-oxidants are needed here as well to stabilze the oil against high temperature fluid degradation.

Later, it was found that ATF's could funtion well as PSF's and it also reduced dealer inventory. Any Dexron/Merc or Type-F ATF seemed to function well as a PSF.

All was well until Honda and GM started requiring PSF formulations because of specific PS designs.

The mineral oil based Honda PSF's required high AW additive levels because of their design or design flaws inherent in the PS design.

The new GM PS fluid is essentially a very low detergent PSF, mineral-oil based fluid with a low level Boron/phos AW additive package.

The Dexron VI fluid was the first low viscosity ATF fluid (6.0 cSt), but this is only the beginning. Vehicle manufacturers are now using or developing transmissons that use fluid viscosities down to 4.0 cSt or lower.

But PSF fluids are still being specified at 7.5 cSt viscosities."


So I also went to Lubegard site and go and got this.

"LUBEGARD® POWER STEERING FLUID is a hydraulic fluid that is intermittently pressurized by a high shear, high friction pump and used in a high shear turbine motor to aid in turning a car’s steering wheel. Since the fluid is subjected to hard, long term use without regular changing intervals, it is critically important to provide extra anti-wear, anti-friction and anti-corrosion components as well as oxidation stability and a high flash point for fire protection. Power steering fluid is not interchangeable with automatic transmission fluid (ATF) because ATF does not have the anti-wear protection or shear stability needed to protect the power steering pump".

So I was wonder how many actually change their P/S fluids? Some only when things go wrong, others as regular maintenance.

"

I was getting a squeal from the PS pump at low speed turns. I got a cheap hand pump at AutoZone for $2 - emptied out reserve. Filled it up with Lucas - worked fantastic - no more squeal - plus the steering felt a lot better.

http://www.lucasoil.com/images/products/2536DB751E7ED0BD72BB1135968507 63.gif



Lucas Oil Power Steering Fluid w/Conditioners
Lucas Power Steering Fluid with Conditioners is formulated with the finest base oils and a special Lucas additive package that outperforms all others, providing smooth, quiet operation while conditioning seals to prevent leaks.

Key Benefits
● Improves steering response and feel
● Extends life of pumps, rack and pinion gears, seals, cylinders and valves
● Compatible with all power steering systems and fluids, petroleum or synthetic
● Stops fading and foaming in high performance situations