Cam swap

[MMBLUE]

Well, finally got the 01 Cobra cams in this weekend a special shout out to "MUSCLEMERC" for the install. After all, heck he's just a shade tree mechanic and all :bows::bows:. This is a must do mod for any MM. It wakes up the 4300LB beast.

[bigmerc281]

nice!! any vids?

[J.bo]

Did you go with adjustable gears? What degree did you set up the cams? How long did it take?

[MMBLUE]

Did you go with adjustable gears? What degree did you set up the cams? How long did it take?

? on the adjustable gears. But went dot to dot. And is quite a big job it took about 5 hours or so. Prolly would've been quicker if it weren't for me shinning up the cam covers and running all the bolts across the wire wheel. We weren't rushed for time. Always fun to enjoy the car and friends while shade tree mechanicing.:beer:

[Black&Gifted]

Congrats! Do you have to get a re-tune or adjust your tune to make use of the new power?

[MMBLUE]

Congrats! Do you have to get a re-tune or adjust your tune to make use of the new power?

I should get a re-tune or at least find a way to check my A/F at WOT. I don't want her to run lean. For now, WOT is used sparingly. I've got a Z V.2 tune maybe i'll give Z :banned: a jingle and see what he thinks.

[Rkammer]

What's the expected power gain with stock headers and with Kooks? :)

[SC Cheesehead]

What's the expected power gain with stock headers and with Kooks? :)


Over 9,000....

[Rkammer]

Not enough to justify the cost IMO. :lol:

[gdsqdcr]

Not enough to justify the cost IMO. :lol:

What are the hard HP numbers? I am curious ... not that I can afford it!

[Rkammer]

What are the hard HP numbers? I am curious ... not that I can afford it!

That's what I wanted to know but got a SA answer. :rolleyes:

[ctrlraven]

Why the 2001 cams? I thought the 96-98 cams were the ones to get?

[SC Cheesehead]

That's what I wanted to know but got a SA answer. :rolleyes:


Sorry, just couldn't resist. ;) I dunno, maybe 15 hp? :dunno:

Cam swap is going to give some additional HP and TQ, but IMO, there are other things you'll want to do first if you're planning NA mods.

What are your long term goals for the car? If you're looking for big HP, may want to sock away the bucks you'd spend on cams for a SC.

[Rkammer]

Sorry, just couldn't resist. ;) I dunno, maybe 15 hp? :dunno:

Cam swap is going to give some additional HP and TQ, but IMO, there are other things you'll want to do first if you're planning NA mods.

What are your long term goals for the car? If you're looking for big HP, may want to sock away the bucks you'd spend on cams for a SC.

No, worries, just poking fun back atcha. :D I think I"d just add the SC and be done with it if it were me. Spend the whole $5-6K in one shot and have less chance of the other mods producing other unforeseen problems. IF I could run low 13s on street tires, I'd be happy. :banana:

[gdsqdcr]

No SC for me ...

Wife will not allow that much to leave at one time. Plus 3 kids ...
California will not allow much because of smog requirements.

15 does not sound like a huge gain for the money. Cams are a couple of hundred, then time to put them in, then a tune ...

O well ... at least I learned something.

[MMBLUE]

There is a thread on here showing like 25 or 28 HP gain all the way through the ban with 96-98 cams that were degreed. The difference between 96-98's and 99-01's is a mere 2* difference. And difference between 03-04 MM cams is 14* I got this info from a na svt/massacre thread. Musclemerc started it, but is way back in never neverland MM.net thread heaven or hell or whatever you call it. There is a graph showing the gains.

All I can say is WOW, what a difference. For all of the NA naysayers. I have a few complimented other mods like true Long tubes, catless, Z man tune, JLT CAI. And some kind of oil pressure mod that I'm not to aware of because the motor came out of triplethreats DD. I'm guessing I'm running about 350 to 360 HP. Again just a guess. I'm hoping to be 13.8ish or better.

[MMBLUE]

No SC for me ...

Wife will not allow that much to leave at one time. Plus 3 kids ...
California will not allow much because of smog requirements.

15 does not sound like a huge gain for the money. Cams are a couple of hundred, then time to put them in, then a tune ...

O well ... at least I learned something.

For the record, I'm thinking about 20-23HP with the other mods I have. And the cams cost 150.00 shipped and a case of (_______) your favorite beverage, a great time spent a friend on a saturday = WIN WIN 2 me!!!

To find HP like that "priceless"

[MMBLUE]

Not enough to justify the cost IMO. :lol:

When you need binoculars to make out my FL tag ahead of you at bithlo, I guess it's all relative then. Just as long as you don't bring the Buick :lol:

[FastMerc]

Ask any one that was at MV 9 what new cams sound like,My car has a pretty hot set right now in the new Stroker 5.0 Got alot of good comments.

[SC Cheesehead]

There is a thread on here showing like 25 or 28 HP gain all the way through the ban with 96-98 cams that were degreed. The difference between 96-98's and 99-01's is a mere 2* difference. And difference between 03-04 MM cams is 14* I got this info from a na svt/massacre thread. Musclemerc started it, but is way back in never neverland MM.net thread heaven or hell or whatever you call it. There is a graph showing the gains.

All I can say is WOW, what a difference. For all of the NA naysayers. I have a few complimented other mods like true Long tubes, catless, Z man tune, JLT CAI. And some kind of oil pressure mod that I'm not to aware of because the motor came out of triplethreats DD. I'm guessing I'm running about 350 to 360 HP. Again just a guess. I'm hoping to be 13.8ish or better.

Flywheel or rear wheel?

The most I've heard of to-date from a NA built motor is 320 - 330 rwhp, and I think that was Fordnut; maybe he'll chime in.

[BigCars4Ever]

He meant flywheel.

[MMBLUE]

He meant flywheel.

Thanks, you beat me to it.

[SC Cheesehead]

Thanks, you beat me to it.

That's a reasonable number, and for guys that are staying NA, cams are a good option to squeeze out those extra ponies. 03mmmonroe is planning to install cams in his car this winter; he's already running down in the 13.8 range, so that should be good for another 10th or two in the 1/4.

Interested in seeing your dyno numbers, post 'em up when you get the car run.

[Blackened300a]

Ask any one that was at MV 9 what new cams sound like,My car has a pretty hot set right now in the new Stroker 5.0 Got alot of good comments.

Your car sounds like a cammed pushrod engine. Very impressive, I wish we could have raced at MV9.

[Rkammer]

When you need binoculars to make out my FL tag ahead of you at bithlo, I guess it's all relative then. Just as long as you don't bring the Buick :lol:

:D Ahhh, yes, the Buick. Cures my need for speed every time.

But, binoculars? You must have lots of mods. My MM goes 14.7s at Bithlo with only 2.3+ short times. How bad could it be? :beer:

[MMBLUE]

:D Ahhh, yes, the Buick. Cures my need for speed every time.

But, binoculars? You must have lots of mods. My MM goes 14.7s at Bithlo with only 2.3+ short times. How bad could it be? :beer:
J/K 1 second is quite a bit tho.

[Rkammer]

J/K 1 second is quite a bit tho.

Yes, I'd say 10 car lengths or so is a big margin. :D

[na svt]

With only cobra intake cams and an off road X my automatic trans Mach made 285/306. Tq is over 300ftlbs at 3000rpm and stays there until 5000. Hp is 280 at 4900rpm and is 285 at 6000.

Installing them dot-to-dot will result in a lot less tq.


15 does not sound like a huge gain for the money. Cams are a couple of hundred, then time to put them in, then a tune ...
A tune isn't required. Normal gains for this mod is 20rwhp with a small loss in tq. When the cams are degreed and advanced to a 106 ILC the gains in tq are huge and this also boost hp a few more digits.


Flywheel or rear wheel? 20 RWHP

Cams are a great mod for a marauder, but off the shelf cams have lobe centers that don't work well at all with a heavy, automatic trans car like a marauder. With the right cams you can easily pick up 40rwhp and 25ftlbs of rwtq.

This graph shows early cobra intake cams, degreed and undegreed. The gains from degreeing are huge. This combo has stock exhaust manifolds and intake but does have an off-road X pipe:
http://img703.imageshack.us/img703/3598/cobracamsundegreeddegre.jpg (http://img703.imageshack.us/i/cobracamsundegreeddegre.jpg/)

This graph shows the shape of the curve and tq output when the cams undegreed/installed dot to dot. This car has no a/c, power steering or power brakes, only the alternator and water pump are being turned. It also has long tubes, RAI and a ported intake.
http://img822.imageshack.us/img822/5011/pcprodyno9698camsv2.jpg (http://img822.imageshack.us/i/pcprodyno9698camsv2.jpg/)

[na svt]

PM me for custom cams or suggestions on which LCs are best for your combo, it's free.

[MMBLUE]

PM me for custom cams or suggestions on which LCs are best for your combo, it's free.

Thank you for chiming in, I have been waiting. We did a dot to dot install and the pedal feel is remarkable. What do you think the gains are ? LTH, catless, "Z" V.2 tune, JLT CAI.

Alll in all, I'm glad I got those cams from you and am happy with the outcome.

[na svt]

Thank you for chiming in, I have been waiting. We did a dot to dot install and the pedal feel is remarkable. What do you think the gains are ? LTH, catless, "Z" V.2 tune, JLT CAI.

Alll in all, I'm glad I got those cams from you and am happy with the outcome.
You gained 18-20rwhp. However, you left a buttload of tq on the garage floor by not advancing them to 106.

[MMBLUE]

You gained 18-20rwhp. However, you left a buttload of tq on the garage floor by not advancing them to 106.
I'll be sure to have Travis pick that up ;). Anyhoo, didn't really have the time or tools to do so. Happy and thankful for what I got. I'll take that 20 HP any day.:banana2:

[Paul]

What would happen with cams on a s/c car? Blow it up?

[Phrog_gunner]

You gained 18-20rwhp. However, you left a buttload of tq on the garage floor by not advancing them to 106.




HP sells cars, TQ wins races???

[na svt]

What would happen with cams on a s/c car? Blow it up?They will allow the engine to make power more efficiently. More power with the same boost or or the same power with less boost.

[MMBLUE]

HP sells cars, TQ wins races???

Yeah but, any improvement to our sleds is a plus :banana2:

[na svt]

Yeah but, any improvement to our sleds is a plus :banana2:
Yes, and if you don't degree and advance the intake cams you miss out on all the power that is identifed by the red shaded areas:

(http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/526/picture1fp.jpg/])http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/2600/picture1fp.jpg
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