Worst Cars

[crom]

I was emailed this by my boss. Brings back some memories on some unforgettable cars. I do remember guys stuffing big blocks in those old Vegas and running them at the track, atleast until the frame would tear apart.http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4063790/

[dwasson]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4063790/

These are mostly hard to argue with. Some of them bring back memories though.


AMC Pacer
The biggest problem with the Pacer was that AMC, as usual, had no money. AMC had a deal to buy the rotary engine GM was developing. When AMC called to order the engines GM pretty much said, “Rotary? Oh yeah, we abandoned that idea a couple years ago. So AMC had to use their old straight six (basically the old Chevy stovebolt). What added insult to injury was, after hearing complaints about what a slug it was AMC decided to add the V8 to the line up. To do that they had to have a bigger radiator and higher hood. This gave the poor ugly thing the taller grill. Sort of like trashing the ugliest girl in school. Parts of it made sense though. The passenger side door was longer than the driver side to allow for easier entry and exit to the backseat. And, if you squint real hard and you can imagine it squashed flatter, it has the same lines as the Porsche 928.

Chevrolet Vega
A company in Livonia MI (my hometown) called Motion Performance, sold Vega wagons with wood grain and a 454 automatic. The chassis would fall apart after a few hard runs. The metallurgy in the engine was interesting. It was an aluminum alloy that had some kind of hardening applied to the cylinder walls. If the owners used the right coolant and never overheated it was fairly reliable, if slow. The same alloy was used in the Porshe 928 V8 and it worked there. Porsche owners take care of their cars. A high school buddy had a Vega and we always said that the best thing about it was that when you met a girl you knew she liked you and it wasn’t the car impressing her.

Citroen SM
One of those ideas that you knew was trouble when you heard of it. What if we combine Citroen complexity and Maserati fragility?

Fiat Strada
I think that most of America was fed up with Fiat by this time and importer just didn’t care anymore. Fiat, by the way, stands for Feeble Italian Attempt at Technology.

Ford Bronco II
Poor execution of a good idea. Too bad they tipped over so easily.

Ford Edsel
One more proof that most things are best when created to a vision, rather than a committee.

Ford Pinto
Before the big fuel crunch Pintos were fun. They had the 1600 Kent motor and the 4 speed and you could get some real go fast stuff. When the gas prices took off people wanted them to be a little LTD so they bought automatics, power steering and added 600 pounds of stuff to slow them down.

Honda Accord hatchback
But Honda listened and fixed things.

Mazda RX-2
Never drove one or wanted to.

Oldsmobile Delta 88
I imagine a meeting where product managers were trying to figure out how to sell a large car during the fuel crunch. Someone said that there were no bad ideas and somebody else believed them.

Pontiac Fiero
As is GM practice, about the time they got the bugs out of the design it was canceled.

Renault Dauphine
What can you say about a car that made Ramblers seem sexy?

Sachsenring Trabant
If you have the Matchbox model of the Trabant it has about ¾ the amount of steel the full size car has. Imagine a car made of fiberboard, with a 2 stroke motor and about 25 HP. Now imagine all of East Berlin full of them, belching smoke, lurching about with no concept of lanes and all carrying 4 or more people. It looked like a clown convention in hell.

Yugo GV
The poor Yugoslavians were so backward they thought building a 5 year old Fiat would better their situation. Why do Yugos have heated rear glass? To warm your hands when you are pushing it. I think that the ad campaign in Europe said, “Preferred 3 to 1 over the Trabant.”

How did they forget the Ford Aspire?

[bigslim]

I would add the :
1. Chrysler TC by Mazeratti (a sales bomb)
2. Lincoln Versallies (dressed up Granada)
3. Lincoln Blackwood (no explaination needed)
4. All Mustang II's (the "Pinto" Mustang)

[TripleTransAm]

Two words: Cadillac Cimarron... (pimped out Cavalier)

About the Edsel... what REALLY happened? I've heard about that "fiasco" all my life but no one ever told me what really happened. I know it had special styling but what was it that made the car such a sales dud?

[dwasson]

About the Edsel... what REALLY happened? I've heard about that "fiasco" all my life but no one ever told me what really happened. I know it had special styling but what was it that made the car such a sales dud?

The Edsel was, if not the first, maybe the biggest, example of how focus groups can screw up an idea. Ford tested everything about the car. The marketing people asked people what they wanted in a car and then they told the engineers to throw every response into the mix. My dad said the Edsel "looked like an Oldsmobile sucking a lemon". Add to this the problem of it being an expensive car introduced during a recession and it never got traction with the public. Like most things, it probably wasn't as bad as it's reputation would have you believe. The one I drove seemed at least as good as the other cars of that era.

[MapleLeafMerc]

dwasson, loved your explanation of the cars on the Forbes list!

In 1972 my dad bought a Dart Swinger with a slant six in it. The thing could barely climb hills and had the sex appeal of a breadbox. :down:

[jgc61sr2002]

I would add the Chev Chevette and Pontiac 1000 and 6000. IMO all POS. :down:

[widowmaker]

Chevrolet Corvair

[RCSignals]

The Edsel itself wasn't a bad car. In fact it really wasn't much different from the Ford and Mercury models, and shared much of the same parts.
Edsel wasn't just a new model car, it was a whole new "division" at Ford Motor company.
From some of what I've read, HF2 actually changed his mind about launching the division, turning his interests elsewhere, but at that point it was too late to stop, too much time and money were in it, so Edsel Division was allowed to continue for it's minimum run.
I've read testimonials from Edsel division Engineers and executives that were were "cut off" from cooperating with existing info, such as "shared" technical data etc, and had to write all their own Service and other manuals from scratch.
The best looking Edsels were actually the last ones

[Donny Carlson]

My first car was a 1972 Vega hatchback. No A/C and an AM radio. This car was so cheap, it didn't have an electric pump for the windshield washer, you had to push a button on the dash, which >was< the pump, and pump the fluid on the windshield. The head warped on this car and left me stranded in an EXTREMELY dangerous neighborhood at night. Being an idiot 16 year old, I actually spent good money buying Crager wheels and Goodyear RWL tires for this heap. I even ripped out the nasty carpeting GM put in (snot green) and replaced it with some psychedlic crap I bought at a carpeting warehouse. I bought an 8-track player from some dude in home room, so I hooked it up to the stock GM speaker in the car that the AM radio drove. Whoa.:up:

I totaled this POS when I T-boned a VW bug. This was about a month before the speed limits were reduced to 55, so I was FLYING when I hit the bug.

Anybody remember Cosworth Vegas? Ever knew anybody who owned one?

My second car was a 1974 Pinto station wagon. Talk about an Anti-Chick magnet. This POS was a stick shift, no A/C like the Vega, also AM radio. The only decent thing was it had more room than the Vega. Remember those Pinto cruise wagons with the porthole windows in back? Eeps. My dad backed his service truck into my Pinto TWICE. The first time I got it fixed, the second time I used the insurance money for recreational substances. This car also met an untimely death. I was in college, studying late one night when I head a car roaring up the street, then a loud CRASH!!! Lots of swearing, I hear the car peel out. I didn't go look to see what was happining , thinking "Man, sounds like some poor a**hole got his car hit." Next morning, I discover the a**hole was me. Bent frame, rear axle shot. My dad had it towed over to Trucks of Texas and they gave him $500 towards a new GMC van that he bought.

[MapleLeafMerc]

Anybody remember Cosworth Vegas? Ever knew anybody who owned one?


I remember seeing a few stories on these. I think Cosworth was a British racing team. I don't know why they picked the Vega or how any of their cars fared.

[the_pack_rat]

I had a strong admiration of Buicks & Oldsmobiles as a kid growing up. My admiration of some of the FoMoCo cars, came a bit later in my life ... as I got closer to being of driving age. I tend to be more FoMoCo when it comes to the present day American cars ... GM doesn't do much for me anymore.

The Oldsmobile Delta 88 should NOT have been labeled as BAD car. It was the POS GM/Olds diesel engine itself, that was the REAL problem ... which was available as an option on SEVERAL GM cars during it's run, NOT something exclusive to the Olds 88.

The 88 of that era was a pretty decent car when equipped a gasoline engine.

Sometimes I think about the Marauder & imagine what it would have been like if Oldsmobile made something similar in thought to the Marauder that was special & unique ... like a "Super 88".

Course' GM was too busy trying so hard to NOT be "your fathers Oldsmobile".

And unfortunately ... this was one time GM really succeeded in doing something .... building Oldsmobiles that WERE anything but "your fathers Oldsmobile".

Not ONE car in the Olds lineup in the last few years even shared or carried a name from its predecessors ... let alone any of the qualities that once made an Olds a decent car.

A DAMN shame.

Eric < --- past owner of several older Oldsmobiles & present owner of 2.

[teamrope]

Sachsenring Trabant
If you have the Matchbox model of the Trabant it has about ¾ the amount of steel the full size car has. Imagine a car made of fiberboard, with a 2 stroke motor and about 25 HP. Now imagine all of East Berlin full of them, belching smoke, lurching about with no concept of lanes and all carrying 4 or more people. It looked like a clown convention in hell.

http://www.yelmtel.com/~teamrope/pics/trab.jpg

IMO the winner/looser of all time. Try doing 130 MHP on the autobahn and have to slow down to 45 MPH when one pulls out into the hammer lane to pass another one that is 200 yards ahead of him. :fire:

[Haggis]

You all are forgetting the classic Yugo, man am I glad they bombed that factory.

[2003 MIB]

Where's the Chevy Citation and its siblings????? Worst car ever!:bigcry:

[MapleLeafMerc]

I had a strong admiration of Buicks & Oldsmobiles as a kid growing up. My admiration of some of the FoMoCo cars, came a bit later in my life ... as I got closer to being of driving age. I tend to be more FoMoCo when it comes to the present day American cars ... GM doesn't do much for me anymore...

Not ONE car in the Olds lineup in the last few years even shared or carried a name from its predecessors ... let alone any of the qualities that once made an Olds a decent car.

A DAMN shame.

Eric < --- past owner of several older Oldsmobiles & present owner of 2.

My dad was always partial to Oldsmobiles, his first being a 1958 88. Through the years I grew to like them too. As a kid I was impressed reading the "Rocket V8" sticker on the air filter cover. Olds had some great cars over the years, and as you say, it's truly a shame that GM has run this once-proud nameplate into the ground.

In later years, after he "discovered" Carlisle, dad bought and sold several older Oldsmobiles. We still have a 62 Starfire, and get the Journey with Olds newsletter.

[jgc61sr2002]

:up:
My dad was always partial to Oldsmobiles, his first being a 1958 88. Through the years I grew to like them too. As a kid I was impressed reading the "Rocket V8" sticker on the air filter cover. Olds had some great cars over the years, and as you say, it's truly a shame that GM has run this once-proud nameplate into the ground.

In later years, after he "discovered" Carlisle, dad bought and sold several older Oldsmobiles. We still have a 62 Starfire, and get the Journey with Olds newsletter. MLM - 1962 Starfire is a nice ride. I have my fathers 1973 Olds Toronado with 27K on the odometer. Learned to drive on my fathers 1955 Olds Super 88 Holiday 4dr HT. I am also a member of the Oldsmobile Club. :D

[Paul T. Casey]

I test drove a Cosworth Vega, seemed fairly peppy, handled real good, and the price killed me (I was around 20 then.) I do believe that the Cosworth team ended up with Ford somehow after that. I don't remember any production cars, but the did some Indy and maybe some F1 racing together for a while.

[dwasson]

I test drove a Cosworth Vega, seemed fairly peppy, handled real good, and the price killed me (I was around 20 then.) I do believe that the Cosworth team ended up with Ford somehow after that. I don't remember any production cars, but the did some Indy and maybe some F1 racing together for a while.

Cosworth was one of the engine builders in Formula One and had a long relationship with Ford in Europe. I Was driving a BMW 3 series in Germany and was passed by a Cosworth Escort. I was driving at about 95 and the Escort was at 120 mph at least. I think that they also worked with Lotus.

The Cosworth Vega was expensive! It stickered for almost $6K in 1975. YOu could get a nice car for that money. I bought a 1973 Opel GT, new, in 1974, for $2700.

[the_pack_rat]

:up: I have my fathers 1973 Olds Toronado with 27K on the odometer. Learned to drive on my fathers 1955 Olds Super 88 Holiday 4dr HT. I am also a member of the Oldsmobile Club. :D


Toro huh ?, one of my Oldsmobiles is 72 Toronado.

My father had one growing up ... that, a 67 Delmont 88 & a 68 Delmont 88 he had, are the cars that got me hooked on old Oldsmobiles.

Me & my father were in an accident with the 67 when I was @ 9yrs old. RR tire blew out going around a curve on the highway in the rain. Immeadiately Kicked the ass end of the car out to the right towards an @ 50ft DROP off the highway. Luckily the ass end came ALL the way around in a 180' fashion & we missed going of the drop on that side ... but ended up hopping curb & SLAMMING parellel into the guardrail on the other side of the highway.

Honestly thought my life was going to be OVER during all this.

Car gets towed home later ... & I could NOT believe how LITTLE damage there was.

(2) rims - (2) tires - 1 hubcap - a wheel alignment - and some touch up paint.

This same car was once stolen & pushed over on the same side ... with next to nothing in damage either.

The body on that car took quite a beating in it's day ... so did the engine. It had the high compression 425 in it ... that car would really get up & go from what I can remember.

I'm a member of the OCA as well ... in addition to the Toronado Chapter & the ROA.

[Dr Caleb]

Cosworth was one of the engine builders in Formula One and had a long relationship with Ford in Europe. I Was driving a BMW 3 series in Germany and was passed by a Cosworth Escort. I was driving at about 95 and the Escort was at 120 mph at least. I think that they also worked with Lotus.


There was a Euro edition for sale in Canada in 1995 of the Contour that had a V6 24v DOHC built by Cosworth. Holy Carp! is all I'll say about that car. My Uncle had one. We could easily take a Mustang.

Cosworth still builds many engines for F-1 F-4 F-3000 and Indy Car (Cart) I believe. I think they also did some design for the Harley V-Rod.

[jgc61sr2002]

the pack rat - I was thinking about joining the Toronado chapter. I haven't done so to date. I belong to approximately 20 organizations so I had to cut back a little. :up:

[jgc61sr2002]

the_pack_rat - I was thinking about joining the Toronado chapter. I belong to approximately 20 organizatons so I was trying to cut back. :rock:

[Bigdogjim]

Two words: Cadillac Cimarron... (pimped out Cavalier)

About the Edsel... what REALLY happened? I've heard about that "fiasco" all my life but no one ever told me what really happened. I know it had special styling but what was it that made the car such a sales dud?

The short story is the Edsel was a head of its time!

Public did not care for the front grill works.

Price was a little more than then top of the line Fords.

Lower than the base Mercury.

A "nitch" car before the public was ready for the idea.

Price and timeing:eek:

[Bigdogjim]

The Edsel itself wasn't a bad car. In fact it really wasn't much different from the Ford and Mercury models, and shared much of the same parts.
Edsel wasn't just a new model car, it was a whole new "division" at Ford Motor company.
From some of what I've read, HF2 actually changed his mind about launching the division, turning his interests elsewhere, but at that point it was too late to stop, too much time and money were in it, so Edsel Division was allowed to continue for it's minimum run.
I've read testimonials from Edsel division Engineers and executives that were were "cut off" from cooperating with existing info, such as "shared" technical data etc, and had to write all their own Service and other manuals from scratch.
The best looking Edsels were actually the last ones

Thanks RC. Right on the money!!:up:

[CRUZTAKER]

I was real surprised to see a mazda in that 'all time worst' list....

I am very well of the issues of the rotory engine, they're even plagued (with issues) today. I don't see the RX-8 going much over 120k if it makes it that long. But growing up with rotary's, I was aware of this, and learned how to work with them, and found they were really easy to rebuild, and even easier to pump mass quanities of power and torque.

Atleast mazda's build was more successfull than fords attempt:flamer: !

The pic in the article did no justice....here's a juiced 8 second RX-2
http://www.mercurygallery.net/mmnet/watermark.php?file=500/627Mazda3.jpg

[MapleLeafMerc]

I was real surprised to see a mazda in that 'all time worst' list....

I liked one of their early jingles- something like "piston engine goes boing, boing, boing, Mazda engine goes hmmmmm....." :lol:

[MapleLeafMerc]

Holy Carp!

:lol::lol:

[Donny Carlson]

Where's the Chevy Citation and its siblings????? Worst car ever!:bigcry:Ah, yes, the Citation. WAPOS! I had a burgundy X-11 for a demonstrator back in the days I sold medium duty trucks for a Houston chevy dealer. It had what you could call a growl, but when you got on it the torque steer was terrible and the thing kinda squatted down on it's butt. I'm ashamed to admit I sold a number of these beasts to the citizenry of Harris County, Texas, two of which were X-11's. Dealers didn't usually stock them because they were more expensive than the regular Citations and people buying Citations bought them because they were cheap, once dealers had discounted the hell out of them to get them off their lots. My dealership had an inventory of Citations that were TWO MODEL YEARS old.:depress: One of the X-11's I sold to a Vietnamese guy, young dude, worked in his family's restaurant. He came in looking for an X-11, and I told him he'd be damn lucky to find one on any lot anywhere, and if he did, there'd be a good chance it had been sitting there for months. So, he wanted to ORDER ONE!!! Cool! I loved ordering cars, and this was a first. Only my sales manager and the dealer insisted the guy put down a $1000 cash deposit NON REFUNDABLE before they would take the order. I can still hear the dealer saying to me "Carlson, I get stuck with this f***ing X11 and it's YOUR A*S! He took delivery and was thrilled with the car, but utimately there was some kind of weird problem with the suspension that never got resolved to his satisfaction. It made some odd "bonnnngggg" sound at speed when you would run over an expansion strip on the freeway, but the service manager nor the Chevrolet rep could find anything wrong with the car once it was on the lift. The other X-11 sale was an inventory unit that had been dealer traded to us a year and a half before I sold it. It was an incredibly ugly beige color :puke: At the time it was the oldest car in inventory, two model years behind the current cars. I can't imagine what the dealer had lost on this turd in floor plan alone, but there was a $500 spiff to anyone who sold it regardless, so I put this guy in it who traded this clapped out Pontiac. He was hard to get financed, had little to put down, and we had to take it in the shorts on the car to qualify him with GMAC. There was an enormous loss on this car, so if it weren't for the spiffI would have made only the $25 minimum fee. At the last stop in the finance department he starts renegotiating the deal, throws a fit, demands his trade back, gonna go somewhere else, yadda yadda.I calmly ask him what is the problem, how can I make him happy with his new car? He says he wants a cassette player in the stereo and the car rust proofed. I say no problem, I'll have make ready take care of it right now. Sales manager blew up when I told him how I fixed the deal, saying no way are we gonna lose more money on this deal. I say, hey, deduct it from my spiff. So, delivered the car and still walked away with $300 cash that day.:cool:

Some day I need to tell the story about the Z-28 and the female porn star who bought it....:pimp:

[VaderSS]

Interesting that they picked a car that was poorly regarded, but actually a decent car, like the Edsel.

Interesting that they picked a particular car, based on it's engine, when other GM products had that same engine, and it was the engine that was junk, not the car itself.

All GM diesels that were based on gas engines were junk.

[LCpl Retired]

I had an Edsel 8 yrs ago or so..it was BY FAR the BEST CAR anyone could want for an old cruiser. I was a gleaming two tone Orange and White 2 dr Pacer with the E400. It cost 2500.00. It was sold for 3500 with a rebuilt motor 20k miles later. Thats all they were/are worth. It was a rock solid driver that we cruised everywhere. It turned heads like No Other Classic car I have ever driven, and I have driven some wild stuff. People would just look and look until they figured out what it was....and then start smiling. A well cared for Edsel just makes people happy. I hope that someone is enjoying that car today.

The sole achilles heel of the Edsel was the push-button steering wheel tranmission relay system that would fail as they got old, and leave the cars stranded. A 54 corvettish floor shifter solves the issue, or just fix the relays and have it work..dumb 50s design to have those relays under the car..

They were a marketing failure ..period...anyone who says otherwise is wrong......................... .......sound familiar?

the one other one on that list I have a little issue with is the Citroen SM...no big francophile but that car was/is just neat..a big, heavy car with a unbelievable smooth ride...nothing even comes close in ride quality...a lever on the floor gave it 12 inches of ground clearance when needed and dropped it flat on the ground for high speed ...it was so complicated it was cool...so many things about it just for instance the brakes (if I remember correctly)the Weight of the car pushing down on the suspension was the braking system, the brake pedal was an Orb on the floor that released the hydralic through the lines to the calipers to stop the car....
probably a poor commuter but a definate milestone of sorts...and that maserati motor would wind through the gears like you wouldn't believe

[Dr Caleb]

The sole achilles heel of the Edsel was the push-button steering wheel tranmission relay system that would fail as they got old, and leave the cars stranded.

I drove an Edsel, lovingly kept, once. It was in my wet-behind the ears mechanic days, before I knew what an Edsel was.

No word of a lie, I was given the keys, told to drive it into a bay around back. It took me 5 friggen minutes to find out how to put the thing in gear :). I thought the

P
R
N
D
2
1

on the dash were indicators. I couldn't find the friggen shift! I even looked under the seat for one :)

[teamrope]

They were a marketing failure ..period...anyone who says otherwise is wrong......................... .......sound familiar?

It seems I herd Ralph Nader had some thing to do with it too. (Or am I thinking about the Corvair?)

I also herd that there was a little uncertainty in who would service the cars, Ford, Lincoln, ETC....

Either way, I have seen a few of them, and they were not bad looking cars.

[usgecko]

It seems I herd Ralph Nader had some thing to do with it too. (Or am I thinking about the Corvair?)

I also herd that there was a little uncertainty in who would service the cars, Ford, Lincoln, ETC....

Either way, I have seen a few of them, and they were not bad looking cars.

I know I will probably be viewed as a heratic but I think the Corvair Monza Spyder was a damn fine looking car, or for that matter the coupe also.

Yeah it was Nader that trashed the Corvair.

Let the flames commence !!
:bounce:

[teamrope]

I've seen a few Corvairs that looked nice too. I still say the East German Trabie is the winner at being the looser hands down.

[VaderSS]

It seems I herd Ralph Nader had some thing to do with it too. (Or am I thinking about the Corvair?)

Yes, it's the Corvair. Ralph Nader was to cars as Abraham Lincoln was to gourmet cooking. He was clueless... The early Corvair had some issues, but so did the early Beetle, in fact, it had the SAME issues. Chevy fixed them and it turned out to be a decent car, at least as decent as any air-cooled car can be.

[RCSignals]

I also herd that there was a little uncertainty in who would service the cars, Ford, Lincoln, ETC....



Initially it was Edsel Division. They had their own dealer network too.

[dwasson]

Yeah it was Nader that trashed the Corvair.


Nader went after the Corvair because it's handling at the limit could get ... let's say "Sporty". Like most rear engine cars, suddenly lifting off the gas in a high speed corner caused an interesting phenomonon called "trailing throttle oversteer". Properly handled, this trait allowed you to get around a race course or down a twisty road pretty briskly. The Corvair was no worse than a Porsche 911.

A buddy of mine collects Corvairs (I think that he was dropped on his head as a child) and he tells of the Corvair Club meeting in the Detroit area a few years back. The speaker at the banquet was Ralph Nader. Part of his speach about how bad GM was involved how dangerous the Corvair was. (His book was titled "Unsafe at Any Speed") After the speach he was invited to watch dozens of people safely cornering at high gees in the autocross going on less than a mile away. He declined. He probably didn't want any reality to intrude on his prejudice. :banana2:

[MapleLeafMerc]

Funny how Nader's name should come up again so soon. (See "Panther platform Not Guilty" thread in the Lounge.) As far as I'm concerned he's a waste of good oxygen. :shake:

[UAW 588]

How about the Pontiac Aztek. What the hell were they thinking of.

[dwasson]

How about the Pontiac Aztek. What the hell were they thinking of.

I don't think that the Aztec is a bad car, just an ugly car. If it was a girl it would have a good personality and all the other girls would like her.

[teamrope]

Initially it was Edsel Division. They had their own dealer network too.
Well, it was a day or two befor my time ;)