Starter Issues?

[Black&Gifted]

Hi, I'm currently stuck behind a home depot with a marauder that won't start.

Went to the store and she fired up just fine. Turned her off for about 3 minutes and when I went to crank her over all I get is a clanking sound. Not clicking, but more of a clanking/metal on metal tapping sound.

The marauder has sat for about a couple weeks with intermittent starting for a few minutes here and there. Replaced the battery and terminals a few months ago so I don't think that is an issue. Decided to take her for a drive and errands and everything was honky dory until the above.

What. The. Foooooooook.

Any help is much appreciated.

[CBT]

Battery done.

[CBT]

Or re-check them posts. But I'm sticking to battery.

[Black&Gifted]

Currently going over everything....

[Black&Gifted]

Well, waiting for a tow truck, which should be here in an hour. Good thing I already bought beer and cigarettes and am not driving anymore

[Black_Noise]

bad starter.

[tbone]

Sounds like starter solenoid to me with the clankety metal sounds. When they go, they go. I just replaced mine recently.

But, then again, could be the battery..........

[boatmangc]

I change a lot of starters in my trade, 99% of the failures are caused by using it with a weak battery or crappy battery cables/connections.

[CBT]

http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=18 386&thumb=1&d=1301941855 (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=18 386&d=1264380690)

[Black&Gifted]

Battery tested good but when disconnecting the battery I noticed the connections to the positive terminal was not solid/good. Going to revamp the connections and give it a whirl but I suspect the starter is dead.

Should I replace the whole shabang or just the solenoid if the connection revamping doesn't work?

[tbone]

Do the whole thing. I got mine on Rock Auto for $75 shipped.

I doubt they sell the solenoids seperately anyway.

[LANDY]

Load test your battery and make sure is not shorted. At work we get batteries with bad cells all the time. (Interstate). Also Jump the starter manually with a screwdriver, trying those will point you to the problem.

[Black&Gifted]

Changing the starter out. Got the first 2 bolts out but having a bear of a time with the 3rd bolt that is around the top. Any tips on removing this bolt? Tools used?

[RacerX]

I think I used extensions with univeral joints and an air gun. I'll find out again this weekend! :D

[ImpalaSlayer]

i used an 8mm wrench i believe. try it with headers.

[Black&Gifted]

Can't imagine effing with it with anything more than those Lincoln logs that come stock.

I can get in there but not able to get a good angle to break it loose. Will likely just go back at it with a bunch of extensions and an air ratchet when I get a chance.

Had the car up, tire off, everything disconnected and first 2 bolts out in 20 minutes.

[ImpalaSlayer]

Can't imagine effing with it with anything more than those Lincoln logs that come stock.

I can get in there but not able to get a good angle to break it loose. Will likely just go back at it with a bunch of extensions and an air ratchet when I get a chance.

Had the car up, tire off, everything disconnected and first 2 bolts out in 20 minutes.


you can just reinstall the new one with the bottom 2 bolts, thats what i did because there is no access with headers to get it out. hell i had to install the starter in 2 pieces just so it would fit. kooks are garbage!

[ctrlraven]

I will be replacing mine here soon whenever I can get a chance to just get under the car for a while.

[Vostok]

I just did this yesterday on my buds 03 CV. 3/8th's rachet. 10MM shortwell socket + 6 inch extension did the trick. The ratchet will appear to lack the clearance to get any good turns on it but it will work.

+1 on the not needing the 3rd bolt on the reassembly. I did it anyway but from what I hear it's not necessary.

I had to do it on my back in the dark :(

[99SVT]

I've done it several times with Kooks headers installed, a large selection of 1/4" extensions of various lengths are required. Bending the trans cooler line bracket in front of the starter helped a bit as well.

[justbob]

My headers make my starter easier to remove than having stock manifolds!

[tbone]

You need just the right length extension and socket. ;)

[Black&Gifted]

i'll post pics of what the extensions I used. 6 minute ordeal. simple

New issue: have lights and everything. when i try and turn over, it makes a single "clink/clank" and then everything is dead? Short? WTF?

[ImpalaSlayer]

i'll post pics of what the extensions I used. 6 minute ordeal. simple

New issue: have lights and everything. when i try and turn over, it makes a single "clink/clank" and then everything is dead? Short? WTF?

seems like a bad connection, higher load for the starter cant pass, probably the ground? check your battery terminals

[Black&Gifted]

ok. Thanks. I just changed some of the positive batter wires in this ordeal. I used 2 gauge from the battery to the fuse box and 2 gauge from the battery into a power block with the two factory wire going into the power block. Wire to big? I'll take a look at the ground at the battery terminal. oh, the joys.......

[Black&Gifted]

from a tracing/eyeball test, the grounds look "ok". also, its not the relay (just replaced that with no success). gonna hang it up tonight and do real work...

[Black&Gifted]

bad battery. I'm a moron. cbt, I owe you a case.

on the lighter side, i now know how to replace the starter in an 03+ panther in about 30-35 minutes.

[Black&Gifted]

bad battery. I'm a moron. cbt, I owe you a case.

[CBT]

bad battery. I'm a moron. cbt, I owe you a case.

It's all good. :beer:
Here's me changing mine, with a helping hand from justbob and guspech750.


http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=26 412&thumb=1&d=1318901726 (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=26 412&d=1318901726)

[tbone]

It's all good. :beer:
Here's me changing mine, with a helping hand from justbob and guspech750.


http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=26 412&thumb=1&d=1318901726 (http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=26 412&d=1318901726)

Took all 3 of you to figure it out, eh?
;)

[CBT]

Took all 3 of you to figure it out, eh?
;)

3 guys 1 wrench :eek:

[justbob]

Took all 3 of you to figure it out, eh?
;)

It was a tuff nut to crack loose!

[RF Overlord]

Please don't start multiple threads for the same issue.

Merging the two...

[tbone]

It was a tuff nut to crack loose!

Just put Joe on the nuts.......

[guspech750]

Just put Joe on the nuts.......

I'm good with nuts.....….............. Hey wait a minute. You tricked me.


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Eaton Swap + 4.10's = Wreeeeeeeeeedom!!

[Mebot]

Trying to get to the cause of my issue.. I'm at work most of the day and don't have time to troubleshoot but here's my issue:

Yesterday car won't start. Just makes a bunch of clicking noises. I have lights interior and stuff. My HIDs started flashing on and off randomly, even though my key was out of the ignition. :confused:

I have a portable jumper that i put on my battery and then i was able to crank the engine over. No big deal. Drove to the park n ride lot and hopped on the bus to go to work. End of day I come back to the park n ride lot and same thing happens. Clicks but won't start over. So I used the portable jumper again (because I threw it into the trunk before I left in the morning). Drove home and immediately took the clamps off the terminals and cleaned/shined everything up. I had a little bit of build-up on the terminals but nothing major. Shined everything good, put it back on and she started fine.

This morning come out, same deal. Car just clicks and doesn't turn over. I needed to jump it again.

So I am thinking my issue is either:

a) Starter
b) battery

I don't have a battery tester or voltmeter. I bought the battery new in Sept 2009.

I will have to do a little bit each night when i get home but any feedback is appreciated. I am doing searches on the forums now. What does PATS mean?

[Haggis]

Trying to get to the cause of my issue.. I'm at work most of the day and don't have time to troubleshoot but here's my issue:

Yesterday car won't start. Just makes a bunch of clicking noises. I have lights interior and stuff. My HIDs started flashing on and off randomly, even though my key was out of the ignition. :confused:

I have a portable jumper that i put on my battery and then i was able to crank the engine over. No big deal. Drove to the park n ride lot and hopped on the bus to go to work. End of day I come back to the park n ride lot and same thing happens. Clicks but won't start over. So I used the portable jumper again (because I threw it into the trunk before I left in the morning). Drove home and immediately took the clamps off the terminals and cleaned/shined everything up. I had a little bit of build-up on the terminals but nothing major. Shined everything good, put it back on and she started fine.

This morning come out, same deal. Car just clicks and doesn't turn over. I needed to jump it again.

So I am thinking my issue is either:

a) Starter
b) battery

I don't have a battery tester or voltmeter. I bought the battery new in Sept 2009.

I will have to do a little bit each night when i get home but any feedback is appreciated. I am doing searches on the forums now. What does PATS mean?

You can have your battery check at any Auto Zone for free, they will check to see what the starting amps are, you do not even have to take the battery out of the car.

[Black&Gifted]

not that I'm the master in this area, but it sounds like a battery issue since it sounds like it starts up from jumping.

PATS is the passive anti theft system. Lets hope its not that. Zack was helping me diagnose my issue on chicago garage (chicago svt) and the thread may go into the PATS discussion (don't recall specifically if it went into any detail). I think the first place to start with the PATS is whether your light on the top of the dash is flashing at normal intervals, accelerated intervals or is just not flashing.

[ctrlraven]

PATS is Passive Anti-Thief System, it's Ford's chip key ignition security system.

I would say it's the battery since you mentioned your HIDs flickering and they are powered off the battery. I believe you had a Costco battery, check to see what the replacement warranty is on it.

Another test you can do would be to take your battery out and take the battery out of your wife's car and put it in the MM (only if the battery is close in size) if the car starts up without issue then it's def the battery.

It could have a cell going bad in it and not holding much of a charge. I've seen batteries go bad in just a few months.

[Mebot]

You can have your battery check at any Auto Zone for free, they will check to see what the starting amps are, you do not even have to take the battery out of the car.

Yeah I was actually thinking about heading out there around lunch today and see if they can hook it up and take a look.


not that I'm the master in this area, but it sounds like a battery issue since it sounds like it starts up from jumping.

PATS is the passive anti theft system. Lets hope its not that. Zack was helping me diagnose my issue on chicago garage (chicago svt) and the thread may go into the PATS discussion (don't recall specifically if it went into any detail). I think the first place to start with the PATS is whether your light on the top of the dash is flashing at normal intervals, accelerated intervals or is just not flashing.

Agreed, I am hoping it's not the PATS since I was reading a couple of threads about it on the forum. Not wanting to go down that road...


PATS is Passive Anti-Thief System, it's Ford's chip key ignition security system.

I would say it's the battery since you mentioned your HIDs flickering and they are powered off the battery. I believe you had a Costco battery, check to see what the replacement warranty is on it.

Another test you can do would be to take your battery out and take the battery out of your wife's car and put it in the MM (only if the battery is close in size) if the car starts up without issue then it's def the battery.

It could have a cell going bad in it and not holding much of a charge. I've seen batteries go bad in just a few months.

Replacement is 100 months so I should still be in the clear. I am hoping it's just the battery since it's a relatively easy install. But I will get all the troubleshooting done now. Thanks for the feedback guys I will get back this afternoon with (hopefully) a diagnostic report

[Haggis]

Yeah I was actually thinking about heading out there around lunch today and see if they can hook it up and take a look.



Agreed, I am hoping it's not the PATS since I was reading a couple of threads about it on the forum. Not wanting to go down that road...



Replacement is 100 months so I should still be in the clear. I am hoping it's just the battery since it's a relatively easy install. But I will get all the troubleshooting done now. Thanks for the feedback guys I will get back this afternoon with (hopefully) a diagnostic report

You can check the starter by tapping on it while someone turns the key. If it turns over it could be your starter, but since your issue is intermittent you should try this more then once. First have your battery check.

[CBT]

I'm going with battery. That rapid-fire clicking is a sure sign, everytime.

[Odinson]

If you haven't swapped the battery yet go FOMOCO.

My Motorcraft was original and lasted 10 YEARS!! Probably could have squeaked another out of it. :eek:

[Mike M]

you can just reinstall the new one with the bottom 2 bolts, thats what i did because there is no access with headers to get it out. hell i had to install the starter in 2 pieces just so it would fit. kooks are garbage!

Now that's the type of review I can respect!

[Mike M]

I'm going with battery. That rapid-fire clicking is a sure sign, everytime.

Yep, it sounds like a machine gun with a silencer.

[Mebot]

Right so here's an update from this morning:

Went downstairs to the parking garage around 12:00 PM EST. I shut off my car around 8:15 AM this morning (so a little under 4 hours ). what to my surprise but find my HID headlights on! :eek:

Now I normally do not keep my headlight switch in the AUTO position. I always shut everything off when i turn my engine off (including the AC/Heat & radio). So my headlights are on when i start the car, and guess what? It cranks right over! no clicking, or anything! but the headlights stay on. I run through the cycle on the headlight switch (parking lamps, headlights, auto) and the headlights stay for everything. At this time i turn off my car. The headlights go off. I wait about 2 seconds and then headlights flicker and COME ON AGAIN! WTF

Right so anyways decided to start the car and I'm hungry so let's go to Advance Auto and there's a deli next door. Steak n cheese! yum! But i went to AAP and they did a battery check. No problem with my Charging System Test. Cranking and voltage is normal. However the part where it "failed" is the Cold Cranking Amps. It measure at 743 CCA and my battery is 850 CCA. But still within range to turn my engine on.

So while we're diagnosting the battery, my headlights decide to stay on. Even when my key is out of the ignition.

Much appreciation to Chris (Ctrlraven) who I was constantly texting because he helped install my HID and was trying to troubleshoot some other issues. My guess right now is that it's an LCM issue and I will have to check in with FastBlackMerc

I drove back to work and I took off the negative and positive wires on my battery so it wouldnt drain the rest of the day.

[Mebot]

I'm going with battery. That rapid-fire clicking is a sure sign, everytime.

Right so I'm thinking is it my LCM or battery? I am wondering if the LCM is throwing my lights on and the lights are draining my battery just enough so it doesnt crank over?

[ctrlraven]

This all didn't start when it began to rain did it?

[Mebot]

This all didn't start when it began to rain did it?

The headlights yes, as far as i can tell started today. I didn't notice them coming on intermittently yesterday, however the battery issue started yesterday (Monday) and my car is parked in a garage at night no moisture, leaks, condensation or precipitation that I could see

[ctrlraven]

I remember some people having issues with their lights and/or wacky wipers due to the wiper motor module shorting out which causes a feedback into the LCM.

If the light switch is left on Auto while during daylight and the wipers are turned on for more than 30-45 secs the LCM will turn the lights on providing the switch is in the Auto position.

I really don't think it's anything wrong with the HID kit itself since the remote turn-on function is a relayed setup which would mean something is sending a signal to turn the lights on regardless of light switch or key position. Our cars can get pretty retarded when there is a voltage issue.

[Mebot]

Well I sent a PM to FastBlack. I'm thinking I might as well knock out both the battery and LCM. I had the wacky wipers a couple years ago and got that module replaced (isnt that the EATC Module?) I forget

[CBT]

Well I sent a PM to FastBlack. I'm thinking I might as well knock out both the battery and LCM. I had the wacky wipers a couple years ago and got that module replaced (isnt that the EATC Module?) I forget

Nope, two different animals.

[ctrlraven]

Yep, two different things. There is a module that plugs into the back of the wiper motor. That's one main reason for wacky wipers most of the time. I replaced the wiper motor and then swapped over the stock wiper module and my wipers have been working fine since then.

[Mebot]

Nope, two different animals.


Yep, two different things. There is a module that plugs into the back of the wiper motor. That's one main reason for wacky wipers most of the time. I replaced the wiper motor and then swapped over the stock wiper module and my wipers have been working fine since then.

Lol shows what i know! Of everything car-related, I hate wiring the most. I think I'm biased since my '68 Cougar always had something electrical wrong with it.

Anyways, I will give a couple of the ford dealerships here a call and see if I can pick up a battery. If FastBlack gets back to me re: the LCM I will look into that as well. In the meantime, the rest of the week I'll just keep my battery wires unhooked during the night and while at work.

[ctrlraven]

Lol shows what i know! Of everything car-related, I hate wiring the most. I think I'm biased since my '68 Cougar always had something electrical wrong with it.

Anyways, I will give a couple of the ford dealerships here a call and see if I can pick up a battery. If FastBlack gets back to me re: the LCM I will look into that as well. In the meantime, the rest of the week I'll just keep my battery wires unhooked during the night and while at work.
I deal with vehicle wiring for a living which is why I haven't done a lot that I have wanted to my own car.

You don't have to get a Motorcraft battery, just as long as it's a brand name one (Motorcraft, Napa, Diehard, Interstate, Optima are all acceptable). I've had an Interstate Mega-Tron Plus 65 battery for about 5 years now. Came with a 30-month free replacement warranty/six-year performance

http://www.interstatebatteries.com/cs_eStore/Content.aspx?dsNav=Arpp~12,A~P art+Number,N~21-2147384741-4294493575-4294492520-2147384903,Nr~AND(P_unique_id% 3aMTP-65%7cMercury_Marauder%7c2003_S tandard+Battery_V8%2f4.6L)

[EMAS]

But i went to AAP and they did a battery check. No problem with my Charging System Test. Cranking and voltage is normal. However the part where it "failed" is the Cold Cranking Amps. It measure at 743 CCA and my battery is 850 CCA. But still within range to turn my engine on.



Returning that amount less than the listed CCA on a load test on anything but a brand new battery doesn't mean anything other than your battery is not brand new. As batteries age their CCA slowly goes down so yours is still far from done and is not the likely cause of your problem and I certainly wouldn't go out and replace it based on that test.

[Mebot]

Returning that amount less than the listed CCA on a load test on anything but a brand new battery doesn't mean anything other than your battery is not brand new. As batteries age their CCA slowly goes down so yours is still far from done and is not the likely cause of your problem and I certainly wouldn't go out and replace it based on that test.

correct my thoughts exactly. Before I plunk down a pretty penny for a new battery I want to make sure it's not some other issue (i.e. The LCM). Everyone is saying that the click click click sound is my battery, which it is. But I have to go one step further & figure out WHAT is draining my battery.

Fyi when I came home & parked in the garage I went inside to change. Came back out to take the wires, off for the night. Every 25-40 seconds my headlights "blipped". I'm thinking more & more it's an LCM issue more than anything else...

Sent from my Samsung Droid Charge

[Xenom]

Just read through hole thread...

I am having same issues. Turn the key and all I hear is the relay click. I repaced the battery and starter. I also verified fuses and relays are good.

Secuity light looks good(key to on and 3 seconds shuts off)

I have traced over most cableing and can't see any issues. Also ran a charger on battery to double check. Bettery test out fine.

When I do try and start it the check engine light is light when on start position.

Anyone have any other ideas?

Sorry posting from my phone.