Valve train chatter is fixed (completely gone)

[tta197]

As some of you have read from my past posts, my engine had excessive valve train chatter that was heard only at low RPM's from inside the car. Well after reading a post by Bigtay809 (here's a link:http://www.mercurymarauder.net/forums/showthread.php?t=7362&page=3) I decided to try to retorque all the camshaft bearing cap bolts. At first I was a little scepticle because my dealership told me the noise was normal. Well it just didn't sound normal to me and it bugged me to no end. So for those of you who have this very same noise coming from your engine, it's NOT normal. My engine is now as quiet as the engine in the 2000 Grand Marquis LS that I recently sold.

I will admit that removing the valve covers is a huge task. I just sucked. But I think it was well worth the trouble.
For those of you who live in Indy and don't believe that the valve train noise is not normal, I would be more than happy to give you a ride in my chatter free Marauder. I'm referring to the engine chatter not the rest of the car, that chatter is a whole different story.

[Petrograde]

Thanks for the info TTA!!!!

I haven't heard valve train noises, but if I do at least I know how to fix it!

Tom

[schuvwj]

Yes I have this noise. Sounds like a diesel engine at about 1700 rpm.
Had the local F/M dealer drive her Tuesday 2/17/04, plus I showed him the letter explaining the fix, (re-torque of cam bolts), for this noise.

First they checked the oil pressure at the block and on both heads to see if there was a difference, there was no difference in oil pressure.

So he called FMC and they ok'd the tear down to re-torque the cam bolts. Should have her back in a couple days.

I will keep you posted.

Now my concern is if I drove her 25,000 miles with improperly torqued cam bolts, will I have cam shaft problems later?

[RCSignals]

is there a Service letter on this from Ford yet?

[Fourth Horseman]

I have some slight noise from my valve train. Not bad at all, but definitely more than I expected. My question is the same as schuvwj's. Will those of us that have this run into any mechanical trouble down the road if we don't address it?

EDIT: Just read the other (linked above) thread and it sounds like I don't have this issue. My engine only makes the noise at idle. Valve guides? Engine is running well so I'll just sit on this for now. Great threads, by the way.

[tta197]

schuvwj, for what it's worth all four cams were spotless and unharmed, as they should be (I only have 400 miles on the car). I'm still pissed off I had to go through this trouble in the first place. As I have said before, Ford has some piss poor quality control and there's no excuse for this at all.
For those who are wondering why I didn't let the dealer fix this under warranty here's my thoughts on that: First, the dealer just blew me off and said they all make that noise (even though I test drove an '04 that was very quiet) and second, I just didn't trust anyone to do this so I decided to do it myself. Just as the old saying goes: if you want something done right do it yourself.

[schuvwj]

is there a Service letter on this from Ford yet?


When I gave my SM the letter explaining the fix for the valve train chatter he checked the FMC cumputer. Nothing was in the system yet.

[Mattsmerc]

what about start up? mine clatters like the lifters on my old ford t-bird. just at start up then the clatter goes away.

[tta197]

No start up chatter. It never had this problem. Now my Expedition does have this along with the famous piston slap on cold start up.

[Mattsmerc]

(li) curse the QC people at the plant

[Blue03]

I also have the ticking, clatter, diesel sounding noises once warm in the 1500/2500 rpm range and its starting to bug me. I have just over 1900 mi at this time. It looks like bigtay809 and schuvwj have gone in for a dealer fix. tta197 did it himself. Has anyone else had their MM in for a dealer fix, done it themselves or been turned down? Thanks for any replies.

[EbonyMarauder03]

My 2003 MM is going in the shop Monday. I printed the results from another thread about cam torquing. Mine sounds like a diesel at idle and it's not right. My brother-in-law's 1997 Cobra with almost 10 times the mileage of my MM is quiet. Sad to say the appt. was originally for a persistent lumbar problem. The seat needs to come apart again since Ford neglected to install all the clips to hold the lumbar to the seat frame. The only fix for this is NOT zip ties but to order a complete lumbar assy. There is so discrepancy about the part. Since I work in the parts dept of the dealer I just ordered the part, but the shop foreman who did a temporary fix on the lumbar doesn't think the part is right. Fortunately the lady at catalog assistence has been helpful. I will let you know about the outcome of both problems Monday night. Many of you are right, with less than 10,000 miles on an 03 MM quality isn't what it should be for such a pricey car. :mad:

[Mark McQuaide]

what about start up? mine clatters like the lifters on my old ford t-bird. just at start up then the clatter goes away.

I think that's normal. As soon as the oil gets up there the noise stops. My 30-valve Passat motor and my Mystique with the Duratech V6 both did that as well.

[schuvwj]

I think that's normal. As soon as the oil gets up there the noise stops. My 30-valve Passat motor and my Mystique with the Duratech V6 both did that as well.\

Mark the noise/chatter I'm talking about continues from start to stop, cold to hot. Temp makes no difference.

[TripleTransAm]

Hey, I just thought of something.

It's been about a half-year since I heard anyone mention clattering at startup. I don't know if anyone ever got to the bottom of it... some cars did it, some didn't.

I wonder if this has/had something to do with cam torquing?

Now that I think about it, I think I remember folks complaining this came from the bottom end? Perhaps it's a case of improper main bearing cap torque? Just brainstorming...

[BillyGman]

How would they know that it was coming from the bottom end of the motor? Did they use a stethascope to listen to the block while the engine was running? (no sarcasm intended).

[TripleTransAm]

Don't remember, I'd have to go back and re-read the threads. But it can't be that hard to 'generalize' where a certain noise of that nature is coming from. Without a stethoscope it was pretty clear my ticking was coming from up top... I guess one gets used to associating a "knock" with larger assemblies such as the crank.

[bigtay809]

Glad to see my post was able to help someone else! Bigtay809(Tim).

[EbonyMarauder03]

According the the Ford bulletins I've read at work a stethoscope is used. They are also supposed to "shut down" cylinders but unhooking the fuel injectors starting with number 8 cylinder (last cylinder on the driver's side) to confirm the noise. There is the previous mentioned retorquing of the cam girdles. This I have not been able to find on the dealer site and the more drastic head replacement. This was only found under the Cobra Mustang which has a different part number for the head, the last I checked. Again, in both cases, nothing is in print about the Marauder inheriting these problems from the Cobras. This doesn't surprise me. I will let you all know how my engine makes out with it's noise. I drove my brother-in-law's Cobra but it's a 1997 with about 80,000 on it. I think my motor is noisier but it's hard to tell with his stupidly loud mufflers and Bassani x-pipe. Plus our engine bay being more cavernous echos the noise better.

[Glenn]

How can I say this without drawing Flames!! I guess I can't. Maybe it is not even worth saying, perhaps not. But, I will not know unless I say it. I have 17,000 foot buried to the floor board miles on my MM, dozens of century marks, dozens of WOT and down shifts each day on the interstates, hard miles and no problems. I still get a consistent 20-21 mpg. The only time my MM has seen the inside of a Ford dealer is to have a Ford Master Mechanic install my mods and more to come. I don't know, I guess I'm just lucky. Not one problem. Wait until I install the 125 HP Zex Nitrous! I guess I get it then.

[hitchhiker]

Has this been corrected on the 04 MM's?

Thanks,

David