Battery draw if not a DD

[Bradley G]

A local member had an issue with his Marauder that does not see anything close to daily use.
The car has super low mileage and a recent new battery .
He described that the car cranked normal, but failed to start.
He was beside himself with discust because his cream puff T-bird was in the shop at the time with a wierd electrical problem.
Turns out that because he only drives the Marauder
occasionally, The draw from the PCM after several days , his Marauder cranks fine however won't start.
He was concerned that his 6 month old Motorcraft battery was defective(bad cell).
The dealer tested the battery, which checked out fine.
The dealers' Service advisors' advice going forward, was to disconnect the negative battery terminal and deal with reprograming the radio presets and relearn the adaptive transmission strategy.
He followed with, "do not keep the battery terminals connected with a trickle charger/battery tender or damage will occur".
Anybody have similar issues that caused an crank no start?

[tallpaul]

I don't mean to hijack your thread but I am having a similar problem. My MM has been sitting for several months and the battery reads 12.5v without any terminals connected to it. With them on it reads 8-9v, so there is a big time voltage drop somewhere. I can't find it.

So I have a no crank no start situation because the car does absolutely nothing when you try to turn it over. The interior lights and hood light comeone but it will not attempt to crank.

[fastblackmerc]

I don't mean to hijack your thread but I am having a similar problem. My MM has been sitting for several months and the battery reads 12.5v without any terminals connected to it. With them on it reads 8-9v, so there is a big time voltage drop somewhere. I can't find it.

So I have a no crank no start situation because the car does absolutely nothing when you try to turn it over. The interior lights and hood light comeone but it will not attempt to crank.

Try removing the fuses one-by-one till you find which circuit is causing the draw.

[fastblackmerc]

A local member had an issue with his Marauder that does not see anything close to daily use.
The car has super low mileage and a recent new battery .
He described that the car cranked normal, but failed to start.
He was beside himself with discust because his cream puff T-bird was in the shop at the time with a wierd electrical problem.
Turns out that because he only drives the Marauder
occasionally, The draw from the PCM after several days , his Marauder cranks fine however won't start.
He was concerned that his 6 month old Motorcraft battery was defective(bad cell).
The dealer tested the battery, which checked out fine.
The dealers' Service advisors' advice going forward, was to disconnect the negative battery terminal and deal with reprograming the radio presets and relearn the adaptive transmission strategy.
He followed with, "do not keep the battery terminals connected with a trickle charger/battery tender or damage will occur".
Anybody have similar issues that caused an crank no start?

I keep a "battery tender" on my MM when not in use. No problems. I wouldn't keep a trickle charger on the battery for long periods of time.

[RF Overlord]

He followed with, "do not keep the battery terminals connected with a trickle charger/battery tender or damage will occur".
Baloney. That's what battery tenders are FOR.

I have one on The Blackbird all winter and it starts right up every spring.

[Bradley G]

That was my suggestion to my pal, and he quickly told me under no circumstances keep a charge on the battery with the terminals connected.
This was the dealers warning
I keep a "battery tender" on my MM when not in use. No problems. I wouldn't keep a trickle charger on the battery for long periods of time.
.

[EMAS]

If it cranks then the battery has not drained and is not the source of a no start problem.

[Bradley G]

I keep a "battery tender" on my MM when not in use. No problems. I wouldn't keep a trickle charger on the battery for long periods of time.agreed


Baloney. That's what battery tenders are FOR.

I have one on The Blackbird all winter and it starts right up every spring.Of course BOB! The service writer explicity said "EXcept for BOB!" I forgot!:lol:

[RF Overlord]

The service writer explicity said "EXcept for BOB!" I forgot!:lol:Plenty of service writers have little technical background. Many were sales people the previous year.

[Bradley G]

I know it may be hard to believe but he is older than you!:eek:
Plenty of service writers have little technical background. Many were sales people the previous year.

[Bradley G]

I took the recent advice and invested 30 seconds to disconect the negetive battery terminal when I charged the battery this past week. :confused:

[MyO4Rawdur]

what exactly is a battery tender?

[tallpaul]

Try removing the fuses one-by-one till you find which circuit is causing the draw.

Will do, thanks for the tip.

[Bradley G]

Not in this instance.
If it cranks then the battery has not drained and is not the source of a no start problem.

[Shaijack]

A little guy or girl that watches your battery.

[Daily 03]

Brad said that the service rep said to not leave a trickle charger on all of the time.
This is correct a trickle charger will over charge a batery. He has to use a battery tender that will only charge when the charge level gets low.
I have 2 cars that are not driven much and I get about 7 years out of a battery using a tender on them. And they always start up.

Dale

[Bradley G]

He warned of any type of battery charge while the terminals are connected.
Brad said that the service rep said to not leave a trickle charger on all of the time.
This is correct a trickle charger will over charge a batery. He has to use a battery tender that will only charge when the charge level gets low.
I have 2 cars that are not driven much and I get about 7 years out of a battery using a tender on them. And they always start up.

Dale

[J-MAN]

He warned of any type of battery charge while the terminals are connected.

Like the alternator?

[MyBlackBeasts]

If it cranks then the battery has not drained and is not the source of a no start problem.

^^^ This is correct ^^^ If enough juice to crank, it will start. He has a different issue.

Battery tender (maintenance charger) is different than a trickle chargher. Yes, trickle left on for that period of time would cause damage, tender/MC would not. That is what they are designed for. They were designed for emergency services equipment, etc. so a piece of equipment that was sitting for a period of time would start dependably when needed.

[fastblackmerc]

I use this one

http://batterytender.com/products/automotive/battery-tender-plus-12v-at-1-25a.html

[RF Overlord]

He may have been referring to those big wheel-around chargers that will completely charge a dead battery in a couple of hours. Those old-school chargers only had a half-wave rectifier and would put out plenty of AC ripple. That probably isn't too good for modern electronics, but modern battery tenders have full-wave bridges and are unlikely to damage anything.

[justbob]

My escort does this. If it can't hit a certain cranking speed it will never fire up. Never really cared to investigate, finally just bought a new battery.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Billboard]

I don't mean to hijack your thread but I am having a similar problem. My MM has been sitting for several months and the battery reads 12.5v without any terminals connected to it. With them on it reads 8-9v, so there is a big time voltage drop somewhere. I can't find it.

So I have a no crank no start situation because the car does absolutely nothing when you try to turn it over. The interior lights and hood light comeone but it will not attempt to crank.


This sounds like a dis-charged battery, just charge the battery and you will be fine. Even a disconnected battery will drain down over time.

As far as the OP I also recommend a battery tender, these things are made to be connected to a car that sits for a long period of time.

[Bradley G]

I see your logic but if the ignition is not on , maybe there is a difference?
Again for the small investment in time, I'll disconect the battery,You do what you wish!

Like the alternator?

[MyO4Rawdur]

I use this one

http://batterytender.com/products/automotive/battery-tender-plus-12v-at-1-25a.html

the storage place where i leave my car has a light switch set on a timer at thirty minute intervals. if i bought one of those piggy back things for the light socket instead would i be able to rig the switch to never shut off? i dont have a regular socket inside of there so id have to either do the piggy back deal or nothing. any advice here guys?

[fastblackmerc]

the storage place where i leave my car has a light switch set on a timer at thirty minute intervals. if i bought one of those piggy back things for the light socket instead would i be able to rig the switch to never shut off? i dont have a regular socket inside of there so id have to either do the piggy back deal or nothing. any advice here guys?

You'd have to replace the timer-light switch with a regular switch.

[MyO4Rawdur]

You'd have to replace the timer-light switch with a regular switch.

ill have to find where their service box is any shut it off in order to do that. its probably powering at least 15-25 units per fuse. it would be impossible to do it with it on but they would also probably know what i did because the electric bill would be insanely high compared to normal.

[cat in the hat]

Is this a common problem with these cars ? My Marauder also does this, I have to keep it on a tender or it will go dead in about a week ; my old Vic can sit for two months at a time in the dead of winter and will fire right up every time.

[fastblackmerc]

Is this a common problem with these cars ? My Marauder also does this, I have to keep it on a tender or it will go dead in about a week ; my old Vic can sit for two months at a time in the dead of winter and will fire right up every time.

How old is your battery?

May have something drawing the battery down.

[JBFTech]

If you are comfortable using a meter, set the meter up for reading amps, and hook it up inline with the battery cable. First make sure you close the latch on the drivers door so you can get to the fuse box without waking everything up, and leave all other doors closed. Wait about half an hour to an hour for all modules to go into sleep mode, and see what your reading is. If it's higher than spec, start pulling fuses one by one, until the drain drops to within spec. Once you find that fuse, you can trace down the circuit and find out what is causing it. Ford spec across all FLM vehicles is 50mA or less battery drain. Some vehicles will spike to 70mA-80mA intermittently for 2-3 seconds, but is not a problem.

Battery tenders work great, have installed several of them for customers who only drove the car once in a while, put an end to their dead battery issues.

[cat in the hat]

How old is your battery?

May have something drawing the battery down.

There's definitely something drawing a small amount of current.

[EMAS]

Not in this instance.

No if it truly "cranks normally" then the battery is not drained and has absolutely nothing to do with the no start. Now if it cranks very slow then the available voltage while cranking my drop to the point that the computer doesn't function properly.

[tbone]

Anybody have similar issues that caused an crank no start?

Fuel pump for me.

[tbone]

If the car is going to sit for a while with no battery tender and no disconnnection of the battery, turn off the air suspension. I think people forget about that. Old bags leak more as well and will drain the battery that much quicker.

[MOTOWN]

A battery tender is your best friend during winter months storage, I do disconnect my positive battery cable while in storage and I haven't had any problems
As was already stated a battery tender only charges when the battery needs to be charged

[MyBlackBeasts]

If the car is going to sit for a while with no battery tender and no disconnnection of the battery, turn off the air suspension. I think people forget about that. Old bags leak more as well and will drain the battery that much quicker.

Air Suspension will not drain battery when key is off. The pump only turns on when key is in run position.

[tbone]

Air Suspension will not drain battery when key is off. The pump only turns on when key is in run position.

Not true. I hear mine run occasionally with the key off. Same for my Lincoln Town Car.

[tbone]

Otherwise the suspension would be on the ground after a relatively short time depending on the condition of the bags and you would have to wait for it to pump up before taking off.

[MyBlackBeasts]

Not true. I hear mine run occasionally with the key off. Same for my Lincoln Town Car.

Then something is wrong with the car.

Suspension is not activated until the key is powered on. This is a basic automotive principal to prevent the suspension from draining the battery when car is not running.

[MOTOWN]

You guys bring up a good point I've never noticed my pump running while the car is off, but my bags don't leak either

[MyBlackBeasts]

Otherwise the suspension would on the ground after a relatively short time depending on the condition of the bags and you would have to wait for it to pump up before taking off.

Yep, which is why when the bags are in that bad of shape you fix the problem so you don't have to wait.

[tbone]

Nothing wrong with my cars. I've sat in my garage 100's of times enjoying a beer and a smoke and heard the pumps come on occasionally......

[tbone]

Yep, which is why when the bags are in that bad of shape you fix the problem so you don't have to wait.

My bags are fine.

[MyBlackBeasts]

You guys bring up a good point I've never noticed my pump running while the car is off, but my bags don't leak either

When MM has been sitting more than a few days, when 1st start it up the pump runs for 10/15 seconds to top off the bags. It does not run in "key off" unless there is a mechanical defect.

[tbone]

I've noticed that the pump comes on shortly after you start it sometimes and the pump stays running after you turn it off as well.

[MyBlackBeasts]

My bags are fine.

Didn't say there was, was speaking in genaric terms aboput the issue.

Pump is a high amperage load. Mfg will not allow any HA load to activate unless key is in run position.

[tbone]

Ok, well I'm starting to second guess myself on the MM doing it with the key off (except the pump does stays on if it started before I turn the key off, it has happened a million times) but I know for a fact that my LTC does it. It just happened recently.

[1 Bad Merc]

Bradley -leaving a battery tender on your car will be okay. Dont disconnect your battery or you can end up with tuning issues. The car might lose your supercharger tune and you could have problems.

Hasnt anyone ever noticed the blinking red light on their dash by the windshield?

After a couple of weeks that will draw down your battery and your car will end up dead. I always use a battery tender and have had no issues for two years now.

[EMAS]

Bradley -leaving a battery tender on your car will be okay. Dont disconnect your battery or you can end up with tuning issues. The car might lose your supercharger tune and you could have problems.



Disconnecting the battery will not cause the vehicle to "loose it's tune". If that was the case it a car would loose the factory programing if the battery was disconnected. When you put a "tune" in the vehicle you are replacing the factory program.

[1 Bad Merc]

I have heard of issues where the car goes into some type of default mode before it reprograms itself and reads the tune properly.

This is what I heard -could be wrong as I am not an expert. But I dont take the chance and just use a battery tender.

[Gryphonzus]

I have battery tenders (that is the brand name as well) on all my vehicles as soon as I park them. I have at least 9 chargers in use. My original battery in my 2004 lasted almost 7 years. The only problem I have ever had was one of the battery tenders wore out after six years of constant use. They are the best investment I have made. Even my zero turn lawn mower battery has lasted 5 years. Most people I know have has to replace their batterys after a couple of years because they do not use battery tenders.

[RF Overlord]

From a tech article at lincolnsonline.com:

HOW THE AIR SUSPENSION WORKS

The system consists of:
A compressor with built in vent solenoid and air drier
Compressor relay
Two air springs and spring solenoids
A height sensor
An on/off switch and a control module

The control module also receives inputs from the courtesy light switches and vehicle speed sensor. If the speed sensor isn't working then the air suspension will not function correctly.

When the car is started the air suspension module will immediately raise the vehicle to trim height if needed. No venting is allowed for 45 seconds after starting, so if the vehicle is high it will remain high for at least 45 seconds. Venting is also not allowed when a door is open. When the car is moving the module uses a 45 second averaging procedure to control trim height. This means that unless the module receives a high or low signal continuously for 45 seconds no adjustments are made. If the car is stopped and a door is opened and closed an immediate trim height adjustment will be made.

If during a lowering or raising procedure trim height cannot be achieved in the "time out" period, the "Check Suspension" light will illuminate and the air suspension module will turn off. When the ignition is turned off and back on the air suspension module will return to normal operation and try to maintain trim height. The "Check Suspension" light is also illuminated when the air suspension is switched off using the on/off switch.

After switching the car off the air suspension remains active for one hour. From 0 - 59 minutes only venting is allowed providing all doors are closed. At 60 minutes, if trim height is low, the module will raise the car to trim height or run the compressor for 23 seconds if this is not achieved. At 61 minutes the air suspension system is switched off.

I think the last paragraph answers the question.

[TFB]

From a tech article at lincolnsonline.com:

After switching the car off the air suspension remains active for one hour. From 0 - 59 minutes only venting is allowed providing all doors are closed. At 60 minutes, if trim height is low, the module will raise the car to trim height or run the compressor for 23 seconds if this is not achieved. At 61 minutes the air suspension system is switched off.

I think the last paragraph answers the question.

Yeah I knew I'd heard mine run when I was out in the garage, that explains it...


Bradley -leaving a battery tender on your car will be okay. Dont disconnect your battery or you can end up with tuning issues. The car might lose your supercharger tune and you could have problems.

Hasnt anyone ever noticed the blinking red light on their dash by the windshield?

After a couple of weeks that will draw down your battery and your car will end up dead. I always use a battery tender and have had no issues for two years now.

Majorly False, I've let PATS vehicles set for a couple months and start OK... That would drive the dealers nuts charging the batteries every week on their stock.. Won't affect tune either...


I don't mean to hijack your thread but I am having a similar problem. My MM has been sitting for several months and the battery reads 12.5v without any terminals connected to it. With them on it reads 8-9v, so there is a big time voltage drop somewhere. I can't find it.

So I have a no crank no start situation because the car does absolutely nothing when you try to turn it over. The interior lights and hood light comeone but it will not attempt to crank.

Any current draw that drops 4 volts would soon cause smoke, you have a discharged/bad battery...


If it cranks then the battery has not drained and is not the source of a no start problem.

I would say same but I do respect justbob statement on one of his vehicles cranking but not starting... I have started my Marauder when the battery would just barely turn it over, so I dunno...

[NXSBOB]

I use this one

http://batterytender.com/products/automotive/battery-tender-plus-12v-at-1-25a.html
Save some dough at buy one of these, "Schumacher XM1-5 1.5 Amp Fully Automatic Power Charger and Maintainer". They work the same as Battery Tender's. They are Schumacher Brand and are available for $19.95 at Amazon.com and Walmart (Outlet store for China). Also, other places for more money.
http://www.amazon.com/Schumacher-XM1...humacher+XM1-5 (http://www.amazon.com/Schumacher-XM1-5-Automatic-Charger-Maintainer/dp/B004EI6A8K/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1355416731&sr=8-1&keywords=Schumacher+XM1-5)

[tbone]

From a tech article at lincolnsonline.com:
After switching the car off the air suspension remains active for one hour. From 0 - 59 minutes only venting is allowed providing all doors are closed. At 60 minutes, if trim height is low, the module will raise the car to trim height or run the compressor for 23 seconds if this is not achieved. At 61 minutes the air suspension system is switched off.


I knew I've heard it run with the key off. Thanks!

[Bradley G]

I just talked to Lonnie Doll about "Losing the tune" while the battery was removed from the car (little Sis) He assured me, Not possible!
Thanks for your concern:)

Bradley -leaving a battery tender on your car will be okay. Dont disconnect your battery or you can end up with tuning issues. The car might lose your supercharger tune and you could have problems.

Hasnt anyone ever noticed the blinking red light on their dash by the windshield?

After a couple of weeks that will draw down your battery and your car will end up dead. I always use a battery tender and have had no issues for two years now.

[1 Bad Merc]

I just talked to Lonnie Doll about "Losing the tune" while the battery was removed from the car (little Sis) He assured me, Not possible!
Thanks for your concern:)

I wrote that at 3.30 AM after drinking most of the evening :D

I was thinking about the emissions how they have to reset after the battery is disconnected and you normally have to drive the car for awhile. Guess I got confused :cool4:

Sorry -but you still should have a battery tender and everything will be great.

[Bradley G]

I am on the hunt for another 281 cubic inches of terror.
When I get it back, I don't plan to let ot sit for more than a day or an hour:lol:
I wrote that at 3.30 AM after drinking most of the evening :D

I was thinking about the emissions how they have to reset after the battery is disconnected and you normally have to drive the car for awhile. Guess I got confused :cool4:

Sorry -but you still should have a battery tender and everything will be great.

[cat in the hat]

My bags are fine.

. . . must . . . resist . . .

. . . . must . . . . resist . . . .

[ctrlraven]

I've heard my air suspension kick on shortly after turning the car off or within the next hour. If the car turns over smoothly but does not fire up then it's something other than the battery.

[Bradley G]

I don't want to believe it either :bs:
I've heard my air suspension kick on shortly after turning the car off or within the next hour. If the car turns over smoothly but does not fire up then it's something other than the battery.

[tbone]

Didn't say there was, was speaking in genaric terms aboput the issue.

Pump is a high amperage load. Mfg will not allow any HA load to activate unless key is in run position.


:rolleyes:

[IwantmyMMnow!]

After switching the car off the air suspension remains active for one hour. From 0 - 59 minutes only venting is allowed providing all doors are closed. At 60 minutes, if trim height is low, the module will raise the car to trim height or run the compressor for 23 seconds if this is not achieved. At 61 minutes the air suspension system is switched off.



Recently, whenever I have the kids and we arrive home from wherever, my daughter likes to lean up against the car and feel it sink down when the bags vent. I like the sound...sort of like a long Darth Vader exhale...never noticed it until she did...lol.

I've also heard the compressor kick on without the key in ignition.

Bottom line? My kids think my MM is cool and that's good enough for me!

[Bradley G]

Recently, whenever I have the kids and we arrive home from wherever, my daughter likes to lean up against the car and feel it sink down when the bags vent. I like the sound...sort of like a long Darth Vader exhale...never noticed it until she did...lol.

I've also heard the compressor kick on without the key in ignition.

Bottom line? My kids think my MM is cool and that's good enough for me!Smart kids!:bows: