Hate to ask...Too much exhaust

[Matt34]

I havent been driving this for months but have been cranking it and letting it run for 5 or 10 minutes 2 or 3 times a week. The exhaust coming from it is really bad.

Not really sure if its burning oil or not but think it is. Ive only driven this car maybe 100 miles since I bought it and its not losing oil I can tell.

Just got a 79 ford truck that was sitting out in a field for the last 10 years and got it running in the last couple of weeks and the exhaust coming from it already is almost nothing in comparison.

Already added some of that stuff in the red and white can in the crankcase and let the car run for 15 or tweny minutes.

Gonna do it again tomorrow and then change the oil and add some slick 50. If that doesnt fix it and Im thinking it wont, what do you think would.

As always any help is greatly appreciated.

Enclosed a few pics.

[Marauderjack]

Sounds like it's running rich...choke stuck??:confused:

I would never add Slick 50 to anything......try something else or just use synthetic oil!!:shake:

[kirk]

What color is the smoke?

Typically
Black = fuel
Blue = oil
White = coolant

There can also be combinations, but this will give you an idea of where to look for an issue.

[fastblackmerc]

I havent been driving this for months but have been cranking it and letting it run for 5 or 10 minutes 2 or 3 times a week. The exhaust coming from it is really bad.

Not really sure if its burning oil or not but think it is. Ive only driven this car maybe 100 miles since I bought it and its not losing oil I can tell.

Just got a 79 ford truck that was sitting out in a field for the last 10 years and got it running in the last couple of weeks and the exhaust coming from it already is almost nothing in comparison.

Already added some of that stuff in the red and white can in the crankcase and let the car run for 15 or tweny minutes.

Gonna do it again tomorrow and then change the oil and add some slick 50. If that doesnt fix it and Im thinking it wont, what do you think would.

As always any help is greatly appreciated.

Enclosed a few pics.

Sounds like it is running rich. Choke stuck, not opening enough, stuck float in the carb, etc.

Running it for 5 to 10 minutes is probably the worst thing to do. Need to run it long enough for the oil and coolant to get to operating temperatures. You also need it to get hot enough to evaporate the moisture in the engine and exhaust system or you have too much condensation in the oil and exhaust system... neither of which is good.

[TJCOX]

converter bad? Tune up?

[rauder88]

Is the exhaust smoking or just smell bad? Probably running too rich. What FBM said only running it for a few minutes isn't going to do anything. Just let it run for an hour once a week once you figure out whats wrong with it.

[MERCULES]

Leaky valve guides and burns oil at start up? Running rich? Cracked head burning coolant? A better description is needed I think to close in on it.

[fastblackmerc]

converter bad? Tune up?

Probably pre-cat engine.

[Matt34]

Well Im no mechanic by any stretch of the imagination but I think this intake gasket is at least part of the problem. Never replaced one of these before... Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I do have all the push rods labeled to where they came out but did not rotate the engine at all to try and find tdc of any pistons.:confused:

[kirk]

Well Im no mechanic by any stretch of the imagination but I think this intake gasket is at least part of the problem. Never replaced one of these before... Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I do have all the push rods labeled to where they came out but did not rotate the engine at all to try and find tdc of any pistons.:confused:

I'm not seeing a problem. Why do you believe it's the intake gasket?

[fastblackmerc]

I'm not seeing a problem. Why do you believe it's the intake gasket?

Same here....

Gasket looks good.

[Matt34]

I'm not seeing a problem. Why do you believe it's the intake gasket?

Because i have no idea what Im talking about. I though where the gasket wasnt sitting flush maybe oil was leaking through there. You have to understand I've never taken an engine apart before.

A buddy of mine said the same thing, as long as where the H shaped spots are flat the gasket is fine.

He says the rubber ends on the valve stems under the springs are probably dry rotted and need to be replaced. He says he can do it and teach me and the way he will do it is we'll get one of those spring tools to get them loose and then remove the spark plugs and use a screw driver to make sure the valves dont fall down and hit the piston.

Does this sound right to you guys, cause the shop book I have on the car says you are suppose to have cetains pistons at tdc when removing these.

This guy does know about engines but not like you guys and has a kind of redneck way of doing things sometimes. He did say he'd only want like 50 or 75 bucks to do it.

Please, any and all opinions on how to proceed are welcome except taking it to a shop and paying to have it done. Not gonna be doing that. And I already have all the tools I would need.

[fastblackmerc]

Because i have no idea what Im talking about. I though where the gasket wasnt sitting flush maybe oil was leaking through there. You have to understand I've never taken an engine apart before.

A buddy of mine said the same thing, as long as where the H shaped spots are flat the gasket is fine.

He says the rubber ends on the valve stems under the springs are probably dry rotted and need to be replaced. He says he can do it and teach me and the way he will do it is we'll get one of those spring tools to get them loose and then remove the spark plugs and use a screw driver to make sure the valves dont fall down and hit the piston.

Does this sound right to you guys, cause the shop book I have on the car says you are suppose to have cetains pistons at tdc when removing these.

This guy does know about engines but not like you guys and has a kind of redneck way of doing things sometimes. He did say he'd only want like 50 or 75 bucks to do it.

Please, any and all opinions on how to proceed are welcome except taking it to a shop and paying to have it done. Not gonna be doing that. And I already have all the tools I would need.

I always used an adapter that screws into the spark plug hole to pump air into the cylinder to keep the valves closed.

Do one cylinder at a time.

Remove all the spark plugs (will make it easier to rotate the crankshaft).
Bring the piston you'll be working on to TDC.
Screw in the adapter.
Connect the adapter to an air compressor.
Use a hammer and a properly sized socket to hit the valve spring retainer (this will loosen up the locks).
Compress the spring.
Remove the locks.
Remove the spring.
Remove the old seal.
Install the new seal.
Reinstall the spring.
Reinstall the locks.
Release the spring compressor.
Repeat for the next valve.

[kirk]

I'm a little concerned you might be chasing the wrong beast. While your valve seals might indeed be bad and aren't too hard to change, your description about idling the car for 5-10 minutes several times a week may be an issue. These old carburated engines don't have the precise fuel control we're used to today. They often "loaded up" while idling for long periods, running rich and blowing smoke (black). Throw in a mechanical issue on the carb like the choke not working right or out of adjustment and it gets worse. It's not good for them. But we still have insufficient information to know if this is what's happening. You haven't said yet what color smoke you're seeing?

[fastblackmerc]

I'm a little concerned you might be chasing the wrong beast. While your valve seals might indeed be bad and aren't too hard to change, your description about idling the car for 5-10 minutes several times a week may be an issue. These old carburated engines don't have the precise fuel control we're used to today. They often "loaded up" while idling for long periods, running rich and blowing smoke (black). Throw in a mechanical issue on the carb like the choke not working right or out of adjustment and it gets worse. It's not good for them. But we still have insufficient information to know if this is what's happening. You haven't said yet what color smoke you're seeing?

+1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Matt34]

The exhaust is mostly like a light grayish color but very heavy. Sometimes when I rev the motor you will see a puff of black smoke.

Also down next to where the metal tube from the carb slides into the manifold to heat the carb, next to it is a fitting that ive been told is suppose to have a vacuum line coming from it to somewhere and there isnt. And the carb itself could be adjusted wrong but I did have a mechanic to do that for me.

Already bought a valve spring compression tool and ordered the rubber tips for the valves, all 16. Gonna try and replace this weekend.

I think I'm gonna try this compressed air way, what PSI should the compressor be set to or does it matter?

There are also other vacuum lines that are not hookes up I do believe but thats just cause I'm not sure where they go. And the linkage from the pedal to the carb is also in need of adjusting, you have to press the gas pedal to hard to get it to move and throttle the engine.

You guys are real lucky, it must be nice to actually know what you're doing.

I have learned a ton during this whole process of working on this car and am grateful for that. That in itself is a form of payment to me. Still got a long way to go though.

Thanks again guys for all the help, you have no idea how much I appreciate it. Before I let anyone do anything to this car I always check with this formn first

Any other comments or answers would be appreaciated. Thanks again

[kirk]

We didn't always know what we were doing. We learned through experience just like this.

If you have disconnected vacuum lines (not counting the choke tube) it will make the car run lean because you're introducing air to the engine that's not pulling in fuel with it.

The disconnected choke tube will make it run rich because it won't heat the choke spring properly to open the choke. That is if the choke adjustment hasn't been changed from its normal setting. Carbs have lots of adjustments and there are many ways to screw them up.

If you're getting grayish smoke it's likely oil. The black puff sounds like too much fuel (not necessarily always too much).

I'll let others chime in on the pressure needed from the air compressor. I know that too little could drop a valve, and too much could push the piston down. Not sure why they say to put the piston at the top. If it's at the bottom you can't put too much pressure in (compression pressures are pretty high).

[rauder88]

Piston must be at Top Dead Center ignition cycle otherwise a valve will likely be opening and you won't build any pressure in the cylinder to keep the valves closed. It's easiest to work in the firing order so you won't have to rotate the engine as much. I've always done it with shop supply air between 90-120 psi, never tried it with less. You will need an adapter like a compression tester to screw into the spark plu hole and supply the air.

[kirk]

Not sure why they say to put the piston at the top.

Brain fart last night. You keep the piston at the top so if you do drop a valve you don't lose it in the cylinder.

He's got the rocker shafts off so valve opening isn't an issue.

[fastblackmerc]

I've used everything from "shop" air to a small DIY compressor.

[Matt34]

Yeah I removed all the plugs and they are covered in oil, all of them. I'm trying to make my own adapter by hollowing out a spark plug and then running the air through that somehow, still working that out. Had no idea it would be so hard to drill one out, just keep burning up bits.

Gotta work tomorrow as it turns out but will let you guys know how it turns out. I got the valve seats today but no o rings, thought o rings went on the tops?

[fastblackmerc]

Yeah I removed all the plugs and they are covered in oil, all of them. I'm trying to make my own adapter by hollowing out a spark plug and then running the air through that somehow, still working that out. Had no idea it would be so hard to drill one out, just keep burning up bits.

Gotta work tomorrow as it turns out but will let you guys know how it turns out. I got the valve seats today but no o rings, thought o rings went on the tops?

Harbor Freight has what you need.

[Marauderjack]

Run some nylon cord in the spark plug hole......turn the crank until the piston pushes the cord against the valves.......do what you need to the valves.......re-install valve springs and back the piston down to remove cord!!:beer:

Repeat in each cylinder....easy and straight forward!!:D

[kirk]

Run some nylon cord in the spark plug hole......turn the crank until the piston pushes the cord against the valves.......do what you need to the valves.......re-install valve springs and back the piston down to remove cord!!:beer:

Repeat in each cylinder....easy and straight forward!!:D

Never heard that one before. Great idea!

[fastblackmerc]

Run some nylon cord in the spark plug hole......turn the crank until the piston pushes the cord against the valves.......do what you need to the valves.......re-install valve springs and back the piston down to remove cord!!:beer:

Repeat in each cylinder....easy and straight forward!!:D

Good idea!

[Marauderjack]

Thanks guys!!:D

Drop one valve and have to remove a head and ya get pretty damn creative!!:mad2: :bigcry:

I've done this many, many times with zero problems!!:beer:

[lifespeed]

One nice thing about the air compressor approach is it not only holds the valves closed, but can be somewhat diagnostic as well. For example, if you hear a lot of air hissing out the breather you have a ring problem. Air out the intake or exhaust - valve problem.

A leak-down test is more precise, but any major problems can be identified just by the location of leaking air.

[Matt34]

Well I got the adapter. Someone told me to leave all the plugs in except the one you are working on. Didnt hit them with a socket first to loosen the keepers like suggested though because I forgot that part until i just now read it again.

First off I cant even get one keeper off. The way I'm gauging where the pistons are is by looking at the rotor, if it points to the one spot on the cap then 1 is at tdc?????

Also when I leave all the plugs in and pump air into this motor I hear lots of air leaking... Really cant tell from where though. I'm thinking this motor probably needs to be rebuilt now but hell, I dont really know ****.

Feelin kinda frustrated now, gonna leave it alone for the rest of the night and try again tomorrow with all the plugs out, hit each valve spring with a socket to loosen those keepers because they definitely need it, and try again.

Any more advice would be greatly appreciated. Talk to you guys soon and as always, thanks for everything.

[lifespeed]

Lots of air leaking means that cylinder isn't at TDC with the valves closed. Or the engine is shot . . . :(

[Matt34]

No the engine was not at tdc, I'm embarrassed to say I wasnt even sure what that was but did a little reading and went back out and removed the fan blade and found the marks on the pulley and a metal half arrow thing that I am assuming is suppose to line up with the mark on the pulley.

Ive had a shop work on it and there was a spot that had a white line on it on the pulley that im thinking they put there to identify that mark....this engine is pretty dirty underneath.

At least I hope so....thanks for the info though man, I appreciate it.

[kirk]

IF you still have your rocker shafts off, ALL of your valves will be closed no matter where your pistons are.

If your valves are closed and there is lots of air (very little is OK) leaking out it's not a good sign. Only 3 places it can go, rings, valves, head gaskets. Have you run a compression test? Can you feel air coming out the carb or exhaust when this is happening?

[Matt34]

IF you still have your rocker shafts off, ALL of your valves will be closed no matter where your pistons are.

If your valves are closed and there is lots of air (very little is OK) leaking out it's not a good sign. Only 3 places it can go, rings, valves, head gaskets. Have you run a compression test? Can you feel air coming out the carb or exhaust when this is happening?

Yes I wasnt thinking but i have all the push rods removed so all the valves are closed. I know the engine isnt shot just because of how smooth it runs.

It may have some rings that are stuck because of lack of being driven and there is an exhaust leak at the maniflold.

No, I havent done a compression test yet but am looking into buying a compression gauge. Didnt get a chance to mess with the car today but plan to tomorrow afternoon. I'll give an update when I have one. Thanks kirk.

[Matt34]

well its official, cant even get one keeper off these valves, Im thinking i might just torch the car and be done with it, not sure its worth all this aggravation....

[fastblackmerc]

well its official, cant even get one keeper off these valves, Im thinking i might just torch the car and be done with it, not sure its worth all this aggravation....

Did you hit the springs with a socket that fits on the top of the spring retainer? That usually breaks them free.

[kirk]

....not sure its worth all this aggravation....

I learned to deal with the aggravation over time, you will too. Remember, IT'S JUST A CAR. Whenever I get stuck anymore I walk away before the aggravation sets in. A little time away frequently gives me new perspective when I get back, and I'm able to get past the issue better.

Like he said, hit it to knock it loose...

and then on to the next frustrating problem.

Life would be no fun without problems to solve. :)

[Matt34]

Well men, I guess the sun really does shine on a dogs ass every once in a while...
8 down, 8 to go. Thanks for the help guys, you have no idea how much i appreciate it