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Thread: SW Headers and the starter motor

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
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    Chandler Arizona
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    SW Headers and the starter motor

    Hey Guys,
    I have two questions about wiring up the starter with the SW headers now in place

    1) The stock cables, wrapped together, routed through a flimsy stock bracket that is bolted to the back of the passenger side block, are too short to go around the back of the starter and then up to the front of the starter terminals. This routing is needed in order to avoid melting the cables in the stock routing, which is now to close to the header. What do you think is the best way to add about 6 inches of cable to both the red and black lines. Or would I be better off just running two new cables? The stock negative cable appears to be flat braided metal as it gets to the end.

    2)There is a portion of the starter, the solenoid I believe (small cylindrical portion mounted to larger body of the starter), is only about the width of my middle finger :-) from one of the header long tubes...! SW recommends that nothing be closer than 1/2 inch to the pipes. So...... will the starter die as a result of getting to being to close and getting to hot ? If YES, then I suppose I need to go with a mini starter?

    Thanks guys.
    '03 Silver Birch. Stock rebuilt 4.L 32V DOHC, V7-JT blower w/ADTR kit, Shift kit in transmission, planning stainless work long pipes and cat backs. ECD for start up Feb 14 2021.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
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    Next door to my neighbor
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    The stock starter cable, bracket, and routing are just about the last thing on my car untouched. I had an internal solenoid short that caught fire years ago but the headers had been on way before that time. I just swapped to the mini for ease of install. Still using that same wire from the old melted starter too LOL.

    It’s had to have been 6/7 years now with this starter?? Still using the same heat shield from the last starter too. When un rapped the “new” starter still looks like I just took it out of the box.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


    Cobra short block / ProCharger F1-A / Cog drive upgrade / Manley valves / Brian Tooley Racing valve springs / 80# inj. / -8 fuel line / -6 return / Aeromotive 340 pumps and regulator / 2012 GT500 TR6060 six speed / twin disc clutch / Driveshaft Shop GT500 upgraded CV joint shaft / BA5000 blow thru MAF/ 4.10's / Ford Racing 31 spline set up and Girdle / Metco D.S. safety loop / Stainless Works headers, cats, and everything else out back / ClassGlass hood / Bob's hood strut mod / Hurst line lock / Metco control arms / Addco front and rear sway bars / Monroe severe duty shocks all around / Race concepts rotors / Badgeless grille / 35% tint / FBM's interior LED kit and ambient lighting kit / Pioneer FB700 deck / kenwood speaker 4 Ch. / Rockford Fosgate 10" sub and amp / Kicker 6 X 8's all around / back up cam / bluetooth / Pioneer Xm / 704 RWHP 603 RWTQ tuned by Mo's Speedshop.

  3. #3
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    Oct 2020
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    Chandler Arizona
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    JB, so the original starter in your case had some heat shielding? I have none on mine now.
    How is/was the shielding attached to the starter? Metal straps?
    Wow, your car is built!
    -KK
    '03 Silver Birch. Stock rebuilt 4.L 32V DOHC, V7-JT blower w/ADTR kit, Shift kit in transmission, planning stainless work long pipes and cat backs. ECD for start up Feb 14 2021.

  4. #4
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    Mar 2008
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    Next door to my neighbor
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    Yes it did. I just use a cheap DEI starter heat shield off the shelf of my local Advance Auto for like $20. It simply Velcro’s to it’s own self.

    It’s hard to lay any blame on heat being the cause of my fire considering the wiring was fine, the solenoid melted from inside to out, and I had headers/heat shield way before that happened. If heat was the cause it was seriously one slow process but anything’s possible. I know I was at 1 month out of warranty and DB electronics didn’t give a rats ass when I called to question it. I wasn’t looking for a handout, just questioning that I surely couldn’t have been a first. Their attitude sealed their own fate with me and anyone else I can help steer away.


    All I know was that was some INSANE smoke show rolling out all corners of my hood at a left turn red light! I gambled and quickly made the left on red into a parking lot, shut her down, popped the hood and saw it was a direct connection to the battery and wasn’t going to stop. I ripped my shirt off to use as a glove and forcibly yanked the negative off the battery. It was definitely hot!


    I let things cool down, disconnected the starter and simply push started her to a roar and finished my hour drive back home. That’s probably the third time I’ve been damn glad I did the manual swap as it got me running and home instead of stranded!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


    Cobra short block / ProCharger F1-A / Cog drive upgrade / Manley valves / Brian Tooley Racing valve springs / 80# inj. / -8 fuel line / -6 return / Aeromotive 340 pumps and regulator / 2012 GT500 TR6060 six speed / twin disc clutch / Driveshaft Shop GT500 upgraded CV joint shaft / BA5000 blow thru MAF/ 4.10's / Ford Racing 31 spline set up and Girdle / Metco D.S. safety loop / Stainless Works headers, cats, and everything else out back / ClassGlass hood / Bob's hood strut mod / Hurst line lock / Metco control arms / Addco front and rear sway bars / Monroe severe duty shocks all around / Race concepts rotors / Badgeless grille / 35% tint / FBM's interior LED kit and ambient lighting kit / Pioneer FB700 deck / kenwood speaker 4 Ch. / Rockford Fosgate 10" sub and amp / Kicker 6 X 8's all around / back up cam / bluetooth / Pioneer Xm / 704 RWHP 603 RWTQ tuned by Mo's Speedshop.

  5. #5
    Join Date
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    Location
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    JB "the solenoid melted from inside to out"

    That was a solenoid quality problem, did manufacturer stand behind it?

    WLB
    BB#1) 1996 ImpalaSS - 16,500 miles - 100% stock
    ______________________________ ___________

    BB#2) 2003 Marauder (300a) - 34k miles - Daily Driver
    #2912 of 7093
    Conceived 8/6/2002
    Delivered 9/19/2002
    Adopted 8/10/2011
    Trilogy 242 - Self Installed 9/9/12 (0-60 5.5 sec)
    Pioneer 6x8 Front
    Legacy 600w 6x9 Rears
    JL 6.5 SubWoofer
    K&N CAI
    Window tint 50% rear/35% front
    FBM CHMSL with Strobe mod 7/1/12
    DR Deep Aluminum Trans Pan
    Sparta FOMOCO Racing 8.8 Girdle
    Mo's Dyno Tune
    Gorilla Nuts - The System
    Ford Racing 4.10s, 31 spline Cobra carrier & axles 7/1/12
    Powder Coat Axle Housing 7/1/12
    CME HP Rear Control Arms & Watts Link 7/1/12
    ______________________________ ________________

    Rex "SC Cheesehead" Weinbender 11-14-13
    Ed "Baaad GN" Linthicum 8-6-2014

  6. #6
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by MyBlackBeasts View Post
    JB "the solenoid melted from inside to out"

    That was a solenoid quality problem, did manufacturer stand behind it?
    See above. Bottom half of 2nd paragraph.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


    Cobra short block / ProCharger F1-A / Cog drive upgrade / Manley valves / Brian Tooley Racing valve springs / 80# inj. / -8 fuel line / -6 return / Aeromotive 340 pumps and regulator / 2012 GT500 TR6060 six speed / twin disc clutch / Driveshaft Shop GT500 upgraded CV joint shaft / BA5000 blow thru MAF/ 4.10's / Ford Racing 31 spline set up and Girdle / Metco D.S. safety loop / Stainless Works headers, cats, and everything else out back / ClassGlass hood / Bob's hood strut mod / Hurst line lock / Metco control arms / Addco front and rear sway bars / Monroe severe duty shocks all around / Race concepts rotors / Badgeless grille / 35% tint / FBM's interior LED kit and ambient lighting kit / Pioneer FB700 deck / kenwood speaker 4 Ch. / Rockford Fosgate 10" sub and amp / Kicker 6 X 8's all around / back up cam / bluetooth / Pioneer Xm / 704 RWHP 603 RWTQ tuned by Mo's Speedshop.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2018
    Location
    Califon NJ
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    I re routed the starter power and signal wires on both my car and my brothers CVPI (5 speed swapped). It's fairly simple the way I did it, hardest part is removal from the bracket on the cylinder head. Both ours were done with transmission out but it is possible with trans in.
    Disconnect battery.
    Remove wires from starter, pry open tabs that hold wires in the cylinder head bracket. Also remove from studs on valve cover.
    Run the wires down the fender liner next to the AC line. As they get down there make the "turn" to follow the trans cooler lines over the crossmember.
    Should end up in starter territory with about 6" or so extra. I shortened mine. The factory terminal was corroded and less length is less resistance.
    The only challenge may be the terminal on the power wire. Not everyone is a professional mechanic and has large gauge connectors and crimper at their disposal. I'd avoid soldering due to the heat exposure.
    I don't have detailed pictures at this time but the car is inside and could take some if requested.
    2003 300a Trilogy #? 4.10s
    2000 Excursion limited v10
    1997 F350 7.3 5spd 4x4 (service truck)
    1992 Taurus SHO vortec SC 5spd
    1971 GMC 2500 pickup
    1971 GMC 2500 suburban 4x4
    1967 Camaro (basket case)

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Wisconsin
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    Quote Originally Posted by justbob View Post
    See above. Bottom half of 2nd paragraph.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    Sorry Bob, missed that. I guess I won't be buying anything from DB if they don't stand behind their product. Too many other options out there!

    WLB
    BB#1) 1996 ImpalaSS - 16,500 miles - 100% stock
    ______________________________ ___________

    BB#2) 2003 Marauder (300a) - 34k miles - Daily Driver
    #2912 of 7093
    Conceived 8/6/2002
    Delivered 9/19/2002
    Adopted 8/10/2011
    Trilogy 242 - Self Installed 9/9/12 (0-60 5.5 sec)
    Pioneer 6x8 Front
    Legacy 600w 6x9 Rears
    JL 6.5 SubWoofer
    K&N CAI
    Window tint 50% rear/35% front
    FBM CHMSL with Strobe mod 7/1/12
    DR Deep Aluminum Trans Pan
    Sparta FOMOCO Racing 8.8 Girdle
    Mo's Dyno Tune
    Gorilla Nuts - The System
    Ford Racing 4.10s, 31 spline Cobra carrier & axles 7/1/12
    Powder Coat Axle Housing 7/1/12
    CME HP Rear Control Arms & Watts Link 7/1/12
    ______________________________ ________________

    Rex "SC Cheesehead" Weinbender 11-14-13
    Ed "Baaad GN" Linthicum 8-6-2014

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2020
    Location
    Chandler Arizona
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    50
    Grimmy, (and JB)
    You did what I wound up doing; down past the AC compresser, then along the tranny cooling lines, then in through and around the bracket that holds the tranny lines to the block, then away from the tranny to the starter. I spiral wrapped the two lines together (signal and juice) then added a little braided heat insulation (re-use from stock installation) at the very ends of the two cables where they separated out of the spiral wrap. No heat shield wrap (yet) around the starter.

    But - here is my question; in ripping out my cables about 1.5 yrs ago when this project started I didn't get a good photo of where the negative cable from the battery attaches to the block. Would you happen to know? I've added a supercharger, so some of the front passenger side of the block is now unavailable.

    Many thanks!
    -KK
    '03 Silver Birch. Stock rebuilt 4.L 32V DOHC, V7-JT blower w/ADTR kit, Shift kit in transmission, planning stainless work long pipes and cat backs. ECD for start up Feb 14 2021.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Monroe, NC.
    Age
    52
    Posts
    571
    I have the stock starter and wiring and have been running SW headers for 15 years and 110k miles with no concerns. Motors has been out two times but no changes to the wiring or the starter.
    Russ, Monroe NC.

  11. #11
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    Somewhere in the N.C. Triangle
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    Quote Originally Posted by azgolfrat View Post
    Grimmy, (and JB)
    You did what I wound up doing; down past the AC compresser, then along the tranny cooling lines, then in through and around the bracket that holds the tranny lines to the block, then away from the tranny to the starter. I spiral wrapped the two lines together (signal and juice) then added a little braided heat insulation (re-use from stock installation) at the very ends of the two cables where they separated out of the spiral wrap. No heat shield wrap (yet) around the starter.

    But - here is my question; in ripping out my cables about 1.5 yrs ago when this project started I didn't get a good photo of where the negative cable from the battery attaches to the block. Would you happen to know? I've added a supercharger, so some of the front passenger side of the block is now unavailable.

    Many thanks!
    -KK
    The negative cable from the battery attaches to a stud on the front cover IIRC.
    “When you can’t make them see the light, make them feel the heat.”
    Ronald Regan

    "The only way to deal with the Islamic State - these blood thirsty, blood-drunken, terrorists -
    is to kill them, keep on killing them, until you kill the last one, then you kill his pet goat."

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