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Thread: no crank getting desperate,,,

  1. #16
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    Relays are basically electrically-operated switches. Usually they have (4) wires. Sometimes 5.
    (2) of the wires would be the high current circuit, the other (2) wires are what activate the switch.
    Wire 1 = 12v high current into relay
    Wire 2 = 12v high current out of relay
    Wire 3 = 12 low current to activate relay (trigger wire)
    Wire 4 = ground to activate relay

    Most relays have a diagram on them that should describe the circuit and which legs do what.
    Ex Panther Owner

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent2006 View Post
    Bad ignition switch....
    I would also try this^^^^^^^
    You "feel" the difference because you want to "feel" the difference. Since you just spent money on the upgrade you "have" to feel the difference

    I'm looking to eliminate the double pump process I have to follow right now to get the pedal hard

    2004 300A Procharger #0010 D1X
    2003 300A Procharger #0017 D1SC (SOLD. Last I heard, it was in Washington State)

  3. #18
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    See if the PCM isn’t actually sending a ground signal instead of a positive to trigger the relay.

    Never heard of a 3 legged relay? Like stated a four or five.

    Only three things I can think of assuming the relay is in fact good. (I’m trusting you swapped with another)

    1) a 100% bad range selector switch or wiring from it to PCM. However I’ve never seen one fail in both neutral and park positions.

    2) a bad PCM but doubtful

    3) a broken ground in the starting circuitry.

    How many tabs are on the actual relay? It wouldn’t be the first I’ve seen where the wiring came loose and dropped inside the fuse box. I’ve seen it at least twice on cooling fan relays that got a tad too warm.

    You could really use the help of alldatadyi.com and it’s easy to navigate diagrams and definitely a powerprobe.


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  4. #19
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    Yeah when i heard 3 wires at the relay that did not sound right
    Ex Panther Owner

  5. #20
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    Yes , you are correct I re checked and the relay does have four wires and they are all tight and free of corrosion in pdb I was able to get a better look by loosing the harness that goes down by the inner fender .. I did switch the relays out with know working relays and also a few new ones I had .. I also re checked the grounds that I could find one is right by the battery also under the on the drivers side by the lift rod and they are clean tight connections and free of any corrosion.. really not sure what to do at this point I think I have exhausted all possibilities with my limited abilities and scanning equipment I really appreciate all the help any advice I have been receiving I think it is going to turn out to be something that I am just simply missing?? Hopefully I will get to the bottom of failure and repair it but for now I will just use the starter button as i would like to drive the car..

  6. #21
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    bad ign. switch

    Quote Originally Posted by malibill View Post
    Yes , you are correct I re checked and the relay does have four wires and they are all tight and free of corrosion in pdb I was able to get a better look by loosing the harness that goes down by the inner fender .. I did switch the relays out with know working relays and also a few new ones I had .. I also re checked the grounds that I could find one is right by the battery also under the on the drivers side by the lift rod and they are clean tight connections and free of any corrosion.. really not sure what to do at this point I think I have exhausted all possibilities with my limited abilities and scanning equipment I really appreciate all the help any advice I have been receiving I think it is going to turn out to be something that I am just simply missing?? Hopefully I will get to the bottom of failure and repair it but for now I will just use the starter button as i would like to drive the car..
    Thanks yes changed that also and , at least the one that bolts to the column above your knee if you were in drivers seat .. It will turn ign. on just will not engage starter.. tried it installed and place and also removed with harness attached and tried it to crank position and same result nothing.. thanks again

  7. #22
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    If you have a test light you can test this circuit. Check for 12v at the small starter wire with the key in "start" position. If nothing, check for 12v at the MLPS with key in "start" position.
    If you have power at the MLPS, and none at the starter then your problem lies between the MLPS and the starter. Could be a broken/corroded wire or misaligned or pushed in terminal.

    Diagnosing electrical/wiring is really just a process of elimination. Start at 1 end of the circuit (ignition switch) and see if you have power there. Then follow the circuit through its various travels checking for power at each interval/location. If you have 12v power from the switch, through the MLPS, and all the way to the starter then i would say the circuit is fine and your problem lies elsewhere.
    Ex Panther Owner

  8. #23
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    Thank you yes I have a test light been using it not sure what you mean by the mlps? another check i did was to turn key to crank and go to fuse box in car and see if the fuse forget the number i think number 8 would test positive when you turned it to crank .. it has one side of fuse hot when you turn key to on position and when you attempt to make it crank the other side of fuse test positive so the key is telling it to crank at least up to that point in the fuse box.. not sure if that is where you are saying to check?? I did the same test under starter relay in the power dist box under hood and I only get 12 v on the one connector,, It seems like it it not getting a signal from the interior fuse box to the starter relay under the hood?? I am not sure if I am making sense but figured I would let you know some of the test I did.. Thank you

  9. #24
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    The MLPS is basically the neutral safety switch. Manual Lever Position Sensor. Mounted on the shifter shaft on the transmission. 2 bolts an an electrical harness. Tells the ECM what gear the car is in. Also called transmission range sensor.
    From reading your description of the "fuse" it is slightly confusing. Both legs of any fuse should both read good with test light. Otherwise the fuse is bad.

    Do you have access to a wiring diagram for your car?
    Last edited by massacre; 05-19-2022 at 02:42 PM.
    Ex Panther Owner

  10. #25
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    i guess unplug it and test with light and turning key?? the fuse is definitely good I checked it with test light and physically removed it and swapped it out with another new fuse same results, not sure if I am explaining it correctly but what I am saying is only one side is live until you turn key to engage starter when you do the fuse is live on both sides as the circuit is completed when you let go of key from start position the one side is no longer live if it was the starter would be continuous at least that is how I am understanding it?? I am not that good with electrical issues but willing to learn lol Thanks again.. will try that tom after work or sat will post

  11. #26
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    When you say fuse, are you referring to a relay?
    That is what it sounds like.
    Automotive wiring can be intimidating, lots of people are in the same boat lol

    Having a diagram is incredibly helpful as it describes all of the circuits and their locations. No guessing.
    Ex Panther Owner

  12. #27
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    no definitely not a relay it is located inside the car in fuse box I believe it is number 8 a fuse has two prongs one side is constant with key on and the other side does not get power or become hot until you turn key fully to the crank position., this seems correct to me if it was not like this the starter would be engaged all the time ,, like I said I am not really into the electrical end of car but I think that is working??

  13. #28
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    Only other thing I can guess is...its not reading the key. Different than reading a wrong key which would trigger the PATS....

    Take the key off a key ring if it is on one and try it by itself...
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  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent2006 View Post
    Only other thing I can guess is...its not reading the key. Different than reading a wrong key which would trigger the PATS....

    Take the key off a key ring if it is on one and try it by itself...
    Thanks no key is by itself no other key also tried the second key i have same results but thank you for the advice... Gremlins?? lol

  15. #30
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    Do you have 12v at the ignition switch?
    Ex Panther Owner

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