Ok...which Super Charger?

[rocknrod]

Does anybody you know make the Turbo system for the Marauder ?

['03BlkMM]

Does anybody you know make the Turbo system for the Marauder ?

Here is one, I'm not sure if there are any more.

http://racerwalsh.zoovy.com/product/0304MARAUDER

[Rider90]

Search the keywords "Turbo Ernie" for a recent thread about turbocharging.

[BillyGman]

I think that the big consideration with the possibility of turbo charging a Marauder should be exactly how much ground clearence will be lost due to the pipe running under the K-member. It's my understanding that there's just not enough room to run it over the K-member. ofcourse I'm going on what I've been told about this. Just some food for thought. Another thing is, that if it isn't a twin turbo set up, then you might very well get some turbo lag (especially in the low RPM range) after you step on the go pedal.

And I bet that a good and well engineered twin turbo set-up for a Marauder would cost a whole lot more than any of the supercharger set-ups that are out there.

[SergntMac]

I think that the big consideration with the possibility of turbo charging a Marauder should be exactly how much ground clearence will be lost due to the pipe running under the K-member. It's my understanding that there's just not enough room to run it over the K-member.

I've seen the PTK kit in parts, not on the car, but it doesn't appear that there will be a ground clearance problem. Ernie may not be able to lower his MM like many of us have after this install, but I'm sure ground clearance is not going to be an issue. Like with any mod, one must be agreeable to compromise, in order to reap the benefits.

[blackf0rk]

There is always some type of Turbo lag on any Turbo'd vehicle, unless it's tuned right then the lag sometimes isn't as apparant. However, on a large vehicle, he'll probably be running a fairly large turbo, so it'll take some time for the boost to sit you back. We're not talking like 2-4 seconds, proably like 1 second or so.

The turbocharging setup is much more advanced and "into it" than a supercharger set. It's almost like the vortec S/C setup (or any centrifugal kit), yet there's more pipes to account for the exhaust side. And that's why it's more involved - intake AND exhaust has to be worked with. Not to mention, new headers for each side, along with a downtube need to be fabbed. Nothing like that on a S/C'er

It'll be interesting to see the numbers, either way (if its tuned right and is quality) will be put into the ranks of the 3 S/C'ers here on MM.net

GO ERNIE GO!

['03BlkMM]

Most of the single turbo kits I've seen the charts on are usually producing full boost by around 3k rpm's. A co-worker is looking at one for his G35 and the single kit he is considering is putting out full boost by 3200 on that kit. The twin kits for the same car make more low end boost but, like somebody else had said, cost significantly more.

[BillyGman]

I don't understand the supercharger rivalry that goes on at this board. I've been a member on the Mustang board since '96 and have seen and participated in many a "which SC is best thread" and I don't remember any that have gotten as out of hand as quickly as the ones over here do. I'm not saying that it doesn't happen, just that it is a rare occurance.

I also frequent a Mustang/Cobra board quite often, and I think that the only reason that you don't see nearly as many supercharger debates on those boards among Mustang & Cobra owners is simply because of the fact that they have a TWIN-SCREW supercharger option which we as Marauder owners do NOT have, and it's a well known and well established fact that the TWIN-SCREW supercharger is superior to both the centrifugal and the Roots type superchargers since it offers the best of both worlds.

Had it not been for atleast two different twin-screw supercharger kits being presently available for the Mustangs and for the Cobras, I'm sure that they would be having many more roots vs. centrifugal debates than they do just as we sometimes do over here. But for them, that debate has been rendered obsolete since most of the Cobra owners all reach for the twin-screw design, and their spectacular quartermile ET's prove that they're making the right choice. So there's no romm for debate in their camp.\

if you look closely at the SVT board for instance, you'll see that there have been some major knock down drag out verbal brawls over which TWIN-SCREW supercharger kit is better (Whipple vs. Kenne Belle). So it's only human nature amongst those of us who are passionate about High performance & HP.

[Rider90]

So if it is better, why hasn't anyone ventured into a complete twin screw kit for the MM?

[BillyGman]

So if it is better, why hasn't anyone ventured into a complete twin screw kit for the MM?

A pretty good question. I believe the answer is that it's because the MM had very low production #'s for one. And secondly the MM was only made for two years. thirdly might be that because it's a big heavy family sedan, my guess is that there's a greater percentage of MM owners who are simply satisfied with their cars being bone stock than there are Cobra owners, and who aren't going to even consider a $6K or $7K price tag to supercharge their vehicles. Bottom line is, there isn't nearly as big of a market for go fast parts for Marauders as there is for Mustangs or Cobras. just look at how many aftermarket places even make long tube headers for Marauders. Up until just a month ago or so there was only one place (Kooks) and that was it. now there's been a second place. but that's far from how it is with Mustangs and Cobras.

[Rider90]

Billy is the:

Of this thread
Thank you Billy

[BillyGman]

LOL............

[David Morton]

Maybe it's because I worked for Buick and have driven the turbocharged Grand National before or maybe it's because I had to get a new set of rear tires at 7000 miles from just stomping the accelerator too much (and this car has always hooked up very well from the beginning) and so I just don't feel it needs more bottom end torque, but I have to agree with Merc406. Get a turbocharger. I'm going to get one, God willing and the creek don't rise.

BillyGman said something that gave me cause to think (I know, it's rare ) and I want to comment about the power band/torque curve whatever you want to call it.

The Marauder is not a Mustang. It's a lot heavier and will never achieve the kind of off-the-line starts Mustangs are capable of unless it's got a lot more power and more tire to match. Lots of guys here have done an excellent job of doing just that, and lots of what thay have hashed out achieving that goal is usable whatever you get. I've got a set of Lidio's widened rims and will soon have Nitto 305s to match and plan to put them on when I go to the track. But not for everyday use. Why? Mostly it's too expensive, but also there's a lot of rainy days here and many roads have deep puddles and I'm very happy with the stock KDWS tire performance.

I believe our car can get into those 11s on pump gas and street tires alone with a well tuned turbocharger setup and this is why. The bottom-end torque advantage the Trilogy has, undoubtedly has a great feel and is probably the best kit for a street car because it's stop-and-go traffic a pure street car prowls in. But that belt robs the top-end torque, where the blower is probably by-passing anyways, so this advantage is lost after 4000 rpms. But a turbocharger is only just then coming into it's domain, spooled-up and making that 471 ft/lbs of rear wheel torque at only 7lbs boost that we see advertised on the PTK site, <CLICK especially because our cars are so heavy. For a 2-1/4 ton car, unbeatable holeshots are a lost cause at the track.

You need to concentrate on achieving the broadest range of power that you will be using. If it's the street where you want to "be all you can be", get a supercharger. Search the threads. Some better for off-the-line, others offer more top-end, trading off low-end grunt. Lots of experience here with blowers.

But I want to do my racing at the track where it's safer. I want the best ETs possible on pump gas. I want to save my street tires ( ) and not turn into Mr. Hyde every time I get behind the wheel, so my feeling, going from what I experienced all those years ago at Buick, tells me a turbocharger is the way to go for me. Turbo Ernie is getting one and I plan to as well. Maybe you'll want to wait and see what we can do with it and then decide.

Then again, if you have $18,000 burning a hole in your pocket, there's this twin-screw setup at Sean Hyland. Yes, there is a twin-screw for the Marauder, It just costs $18K. But you get a free engine with each purchase!
<CLICK p the for there site)<>
Long post. I loved every minute I spent here though.

[BillyGman]

BillyGman said something that gave me cause to think (I know, it's rare )

Now do you feel better for having said that?

[BillyGman]

. The bottom-end torque advantage the Trilogy has, undoubtedly has a great feel and is probably the best kit for a street car because it's stop-and-go traffic a pure street car prowls in. But that belt robs the top-end torque, where the blower is probably by-passing anyways, so this advantage is lost after 4000 rpms.

I believe you're correct and that after 4,000 RPM's there isn't any power/acceleration advantage that the roots type blower offers over and above a centrifugal. Certainly NOT above 4,000 RPM's. That's where the centrifugal begins to shine.

However, I also want to address a misconception that some people have on here (NOT meaning you Dave) that entertains the notion that a roots supercharger actually doesn't give you any power increase above 4,000 RPM's over and above a NON-supercharged engine, and some even seem to think that a roots supercharger even decreases the power output of an engine above 5,000 RPM's and that's simply an old wives' tale. Even with the 4.56 gears in my Marauder, my car has a very noticeable acceleration increase OVER the 100 MPH mark. So I fully agree with the comparisant that you've made, however, I just wanted to clear up that misconception that some others seem to have.