Heinous control arms

[WI Fordguy]

Just finished installing the Heinous rear control arms. Very nice in the twisties, and a great upgrade for 45 minutes of work. Suprised by how good looking they are. Next up, the bigger rear sway bar.

[Taemian]

Just finished installing the Heinous rear control arms. Very nice in the twisties, and a great upgrade for 45 minutes of work. Suprised by how good looking they are. Next up, the bigger rear sway bar.

What's the ride quality compared to stock?

Be careful about upping the rear swaybar size. You'll always want understeer more than you'll want oversteer, especially in our cars.

[ImpalaSlayer]

What's the ride quality compared to stock?

Be careful about upping the rear swaybar size. You'll always want understeer more than you'll want oversteer, especially in our cars.

can you please explain this explanation? i don't see how under steer would ever be better then over, at least to me. not trying to start a pissing match, just curious on you're reasoning

[WI Fordguy]

ride quality over bumps etc. is uchanged. You don't even know they're there until you do a launch or throw it into the corners.

[Brian H]

PM Sent!!!!!

[Taemian]

can you please explain this explanation? i don't see how under steer would ever be better then over, at least to me. not trying to start a pissing match, just curious on you're reasoning

No problems!

Understeering into a corner means you don't turn into the corner as much as you want. You can correct this by simply getting off the gas. In this case, you may slide a bit onto the corner's outside shoulder, or worst case, plow deep into the outside shoulder maybe even getting into the ditch.

Oversteer means you hang the tail out, which can be corrected by slight throttle increase. Worst case though, and the back end comes around and you 180 the car and have lost nearly all control including direction, what lane you're in, and more.

On a closed race course, understeering means if you get off into the grass, just back off the throttle and ease back onto the course.

Oversteering means you spin the car and end up stopped facing the wrong way on the track.

Imagine this same scenario on regular roads. Understeering means "get off the gas, look where you want to go, and steer there." That will scrub off enough speed to do the job in most cases. Your correction is fairly easy. Oversteering usually leads people to swing the rear out, and then overcorrect and spin the other way, still ending up to 180 degrees from where you were headed.

Drifting is a great spectator sport, and I used to ice race myself in a winter series. However, I set up my vehicles for understeer. A tail happy Fox Mustang may be fun to drive in the rain/snow, but only for fun.

Forced oversteer is not a problem with a Trilogy, so I can hang the tail out at will. But imagine yourself coming off a freeway on a tight, off-camber, wet off-ramp. Do you want the car to slowly edge to the outside guard rail, or have the tail swing around on you?

One more scenario: You're on a long sweeping corner, and some idiot jams on his brakes in the middle of it. You have to hit the brakes NOW! Do you want the tail coming around to leave you sideways across the road (or worse), or do you want to "plow" towards the shoulder? I'll take the shoulder anyday in an emergency sitiuation. You still have options, whereas you relinquish all control once the tail starts swinging like a pendulum.

Hope this clears up my position.

[babbage]

I have the Heinous billet arms too. The car wants to leap forward off the gas. It's almost like you have an increase in spring rate in the rear, without the harshness. Much better handling.

[Mr. Man]

I found with all the suspension upgrades the MM handles pretty neutral

[Taemian]

I found with all the suspension upgrades the MM handles pretty neutral

Please define "all" that's on your car.

I was just worried that the bushings would be harder, giving a harsher ride. Rubber bushings have more play, but give good ride quality. Other compound bushings usually are stiffer giving better performance, but a harsher ride.

[Blackened300a]

Please define "all" that's on your car.

I was just worried that the bushings would be harder, giving a harsher ride. Rubber bushings have more play, but give good ride quality. Other compound bushings usually are stiffer giving better performance, but a harsher ride.

Ill use my set-up as a idea, Sparta control arms and watts link, addco sway bars front and rear. The springs and shocks are all stock.
On a launch the car tracks straight and just launches, less wheel spin and more forward motion. On the turns the car is planted, the body and the suspension track straight. With the rubber bushings the rear would feel a little sloppy after drifting a turn or on a hard launch. Sloppy meaning the body would shift its weight to one side on the rubber and the wheels would stay planted causing the tires to squeal a bit and just feel on the edge of spinning out. (I took a turn a little too quick and learned this the hard way with my stock setup) I was also able to test this by pushing on the side of the rear of my car with stock control arms. The rear would wiggle easily just by pushing it, after the new poly/delrin bushings the wiggle was minimal.
The new arms tightened the entire rear up and the sway bars with new watts link took almost all the body roll out of the car.
The ride remained the same. Just feels more in touch with the road and allows you to feel much more stable and confident taking turns at a higher rate of speed.
Changing the springs would really affect the ride more then any other suspension upgrade.

For the money and performance, go with trhe Sparta set-up. They are cheaper and use high quality steel with a steel sleeved delrin/poly bushing. Plus they are available in different colors.

[rayjay]

Ill use my set-up as a idea, Sparta control arms and watts link, addco sway bars front and rear. The springs and shocks are all stock.
On a launch the car tracks straight and just launches, less wheel spin and more forward motion. On the turns the car is planted, the body and the suspension track straight. With the rubber bushings the rear would feel a little sloppy after drifting a turn or on a hard launch. Sloppy meaning the body would shift its weight to one side on the rubber and the wheels would stay planted causing the tires to squeal a bit and just feel on the edge of spinning out. (I took a turn a little too quick and learned this the hard way with my stock setup) I was also able to test this by pushing on the side of the rear of my car with stock control arms. The rear would wiggle easily just by pushing it, after the new poly/delrin bushings the wiggle was minimal.
The new arms tightened the entire rear up and the sway bars with new watts link took almost all the body roll out of the car.
The ride remained the same. Just feels more in touch with the road and allows you to feel much more stable and confident taking turns at a higher rate of speed.
Changing the springs would really affect the ride more then any other suspension upgrade.

For the money and performance, go with trhe Sparta set-up. They are cheaper and use high quality steel with a steel sleeved delrin/poly bushing. Plus they are available in different colors.

+1, minus the watts link, same setup, same results.

[Taemian]

Thanks for the info, guys. I've plateaued on engine mods without going forged, so suspension and brakes are on deck. I just don't want to lose ride quality, as the MM is now my wife's (and carrying our little girl) daily driver.