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Thread: Brake and abs light on after new tires.

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turbov6Bryan View Post
    That silver birch of yours at Louisville has 260k???!!!????

    Wow, I had no idea

    Nice Brian
    Sorry, I didn't make it to Louisville. Maybe another fordnut?
    Thanks to Darrin @ BC Automotive:
    $1800 and it was worse than when he started!

    Brian (FordNut) FPG # 1458 of 7838
    03 MM 300A (Lotsa mods, 130k mi) was 303rwhp/318rwtq N/A
    then 476/410 D1SC ProCharged on stock block
    then 660/555 D1SC PC on 5.3 wet sleeved Teksid alum big bore stroker
    then 365/369 N/A on 5.3 wet sleeved Teksid alum big bore stroker
    Now 751/617 3.4L Whipple on 5.3 Boss5.0 iron big bore stroker

    03 MM 300B Silver (Mostly stock, originally wife's car, 370k mi) FPG # 7053 of 7838 or 49 of 417 SB
    03 MM 300B Silver, Stock, wife's next one, 136k mi FPG # 7134 of 7838 or 89 of 417 SB
    04 MM Silver, Stock, on standby 85k mi, FPG # 1212 of 3214 or 432 of 997 SB
    01 F150 longbed
    01 F150 shortbed
    00 F150 4x4 stepside
    01 F150 4x4 7700
    68 Stang FB (70 351C 4V, 4 wheel discs, project car)

    Mods listed here (some items not current): FordNut's Mods

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Man View Post
    So if the OP has 275/45/18 on the rear and 255/45/18 on the front, why would this screw with his idiot lights?
    1. The 245, 255 or 275 is width. The 45 is height (not exactly, but relative to width). A brand new 45 will be bigger than a worn out 45.

    2. Basic troubleshooting - very basic - If you change something and then a problem starts, they are probably related.

    MAYBE if the tire sizes are right on the edge of being ok for the PCM, the rears could be aired up enough to make the lights go out.
    Thanks to Darrin @ BC Automotive:
    $1800 and it was worse than when he started!

    Brian (FordNut) FPG # 1458 of 7838
    03 MM 300A (Lotsa mods, 130k mi) was 303rwhp/318rwtq N/A
    then 476/410 D1SC ProCharged on stock block
    then 660/555 D1SC PC on 5.3 wet sleeved Teksid alum big bore stroker
    then 365/369 N/A on 5.3 wet sleeved Teksid alum big bore stroker
    Now 751/617 3.4L Whipple on 5.3 Boss5.0 iron big bore stroker

    03 MM 300B Silver (Mostly stock, originally wife's car, 370k mi) FPG # 7053 of 7838 or 49 of 417 SB
    03 MM 300B Silver, Stock, wife's next one, 136k mi FPG # 7134 of 7838 or 89 of 417 SB
    04 MM Silver, Stock, on standby 85k mi, FPG # 1212 of 3214 or 432 of 997 SB
    01 F150 longbed
    01 F150 shortbed
    00 F150 4x4 stepside
    01 F150 4x4 7700
    68 Stang FB (70 351C 4V, 4 wheel discs, project car)

    Mods listed here (some items not current): FordNut's Mods

  3. #18
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    possibly as what Fordnut said new 255, old 275

    https://www.tacomaworld.com/tirecalc...5r18-275-45r18
    2004 SB Ported Trilogy 48
    Has supporting mods and stuff
    Thanks to Marty O for his help in updating this car.

    R.I.P.
    Rex "SC Cheesehead"

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Man View Post
    So if the OP has 275/45/18 on the rear and 255/45/18 on the front, why would this screw with his idiot lights?
    Quote Originally Posted by RubberCtyRauder View Post
    possibly as what Fordnut said new 255, old 275
    This ^^^^^ may be the root of the issue.

    Since the OP makes no mention of a Traction Control light, it is easy to assume that he is talking about a 2003 300A Marauder. Seems even more likely because he was running the same size all around prior to this incident.

    The 275/45/18 is 27.74 inches tall.
    The 255/45/18 is 27.03 inches tall (2.6% difference).

    If the rears are worn down to only 1-2 mm of tread depth on the outside treads, the center tread could be entirely bald due to the center wear issue. In this case, it is entirely possible that the rears have been worn to a point where the rears are actually a tad smaller diameter than the fronts. Past time to replace those rears.
    Bluerauder
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  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by FordNut View Post
    It doesn't have traction control so it doesn't screw up the power delivery, but it does make the abs and brake light on the instrument panel come on. Sometimes people get away with the same size all around, but if the rears are slightly smaller than the fronts you have this issue.
    Finally another voice of reason! I have been saying for years that tire stagger does not just affect traction control. The ABS is counting revolutions also. All I did was put 255/55R-18 rears on with stock fronts, and I soon noticed premature triggering of the ABS. No dash light or other glaringly-obvious symptom. Just ABS triggering under moderate braking. This definitely increased stopping distance. I consider degrading ABS functionality unsafe and a Very Bad Idea.

    Unless you're going to be a hero and try swapping in a Crown Vic ABS module, stick with 5% stagger. It is painful finding the tires. See my sig for a 20" combo, can't help with the 18" stockers but others here can.
    Lifespeed

    2004 Silver Birch Marauder 130K miles
    Wilwood Aero6 F, NMDP R brakes, Penske 7500DA shocks, Hypercoil 600lbs F and Grand Marquis R air springs, Addco tubular sway bars, Metco control & Watts, 31 sp axles, Stainless Works cat-back exhaust, Lidio tune, American Racing AR883 9.3" 50mm F 10" 59mm R 20" wheels, Pirelli P-Zero 265/35-20, 275/40-20 tires

    Coming soon: Livernois 5.0L stroker, ADTR/Vortech V2 intercooled SC, Silverfox trans and Circle D converter

  6. #21
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    ON
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    You are not low on brake fluid are you?

  7. #22
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    Personally I've ran the 255/45 275/45 combo a well as 255/45 all around without any issues so I doubt that is the problem.

    What you really need to do to get to the root of the problem is to hook up a scan tool capable of reading the ABS codes and see what it tells you. Is it a code related to a single wheel or are their multiple codes?

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by EMAS View Post
    Personally I've ran the 255/45 275/45 combo a well as 255/45 all around without any issues so I doubt that is the problem.

    What you really need to do to get to the root of the problem is to hook up a scan tool capable of reading the ABS codes and see what it tells you. Is it a code related to a single wheel or are their multiple codes?
    Good advice to let the ABS module tell you what it thinks is happening. One bad wheel, obvious enough.

    That said, I am starting to form the opinion that the degraded ABS behavior with tire stagger error may not be that obvious to everybody. Of course there are no symptoms at all until you are approaching the threshold of braking traction. There, a modest difference in braking force at which the ABS activates may not be noticeable by your average, shall we say, less-enthusiastic driver.

    That said I am completely convinced tire stagger affects ABS. I have to believe the ol' seat of the pants and my experience. Not to mention another Nor Cal Marauder owner has confirmed he noticed this behavior.
    Lifespeed

    2004 Silver Birch Marauder 130K miles
    Wilwood Aero6 F, NMDP R brakes, Penske 7500DA shocks, Hypercoil 600lbs F and Grand Marquis R air springs, Addco tubular sway bars, Metco control & Watts, 31 sp axles, Stainless Works cat-back exhaust, Lidio tune, American Racing AR883 9.3" 50mm F 10" 59mm R 20" wheels, Pirelli P-Zero 265/35-20, 275/40-20 tires

    Coming soon: Livernois 5.0L stroker, ADTR/Vortech V2 intercooled SC, Silverfox trans and Circle D converter

  9. #24
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    I really appreciate all the replies. a lot of trouble shooting for me to do to figure this whole thing out. I will definitely post a reply once its solved.

  10. #25
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    Tire stagger does matter. Just swap the OEM fronts and rears and see what happens.

    My first experience with this problem was at Marauderville Indy.

    Replacement sizes were very limited at the time. I had some wide rears that were smaller diameter than stock, I don't remember the size. I drove up to Indy and didn't seem to have a problem. Went to the drag strip and it tripped the ABS light at the big end. It went back out at normal highway speeds. Apparently I was just on the edge of PCM acceptable limits on difference.

    I fixed it without any code readers or any of that other troubleshooting nonsense, I changed the rear tires back to the correct size and just like magic the problem was gone.
    Thanks to Darrin @ BC Automotive:
    $1800 and it was worse than when he started!

    Brian (FordNut) FPG # 1458 of 7838
    03 MM 300A (Lotsa mods, 130k mi) was 303rwhp/318rwtq N/A
    then 476/410 D1SC ProCharged on stock block
    then 660/555 D1SC PC on 5.3 wet sleeved Teksid alum big bore stroker
    then 365/369 N/A on 5.3 wet sleeved Teksid alum big bore stroker
    Now 751/617 3.4L Whipple on 5.3 Boss5.0 iron big bore stroker

    03 MM 300B Silver (Mostly stock, originally wife's car, 370k mi) FPG # 7053 of 7838 or 49 of 417 SB
    03 MM 300B Silver, Stock, wife's next one, 136k mi FPG # 7134 of 7838 or 89 of 417 SB
    04 MM Silver, Stock, on standby 85k mi, FPG # 1212 of 3214 or 432 of 997 SB
    01 F150 longbed
    01 F150 shortbed
    00 F150 4x4 stepside
    01 F150 4x4 7700
    68 Stang FB (70 351C 4V, 4 wheel discs, project car)

    Mods listed here (some items not current): FordNut's Mods

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by FordNut View Post
    Tire stagger does matter. Just swap the OEM fronts and rears and see what happens.
    But everybody on mm.net says it only affects traction control . . .

    Lifespeed

    2004 Silver Birch Marauder 130K miles
    Wilwood Aero6 F, NMDP R brakes, Penske 7500DA shocks, Hypercoil 600lbs F and Grand Marquis R air springs, Addco tubular sway bars, Metco control & Watts, 31 sp axles, Stainless Works cat-back exhaust, Lidio tune, American Racing AR883 9.3" 50mm F 10" 59mm R 20" wheels, Pirelli P-Zero 265/35-20, 275/40-20 tires

    Coming soon: Livernois 5.0L stroker, ADTR/Vortech V2 intercooled SC, Silverfox trans and Circle D converter

  12. #27
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    Just out of curiosity, are OEM size tires available for the rear from anybody?
    I got a set if BFG rears a few years ago. The salesman said they only made them in June and I snagged a set.
    Redster (aka Rodster)
    04 MM DTR
    ONeill equipped
    96 Audi A4 (ONeill equipped)
    2007 Shelby GT (ONeill equipped)(SAAC equipped)
    2002 Sable

  13. #28
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    nitto, cooper, falken, firestone, kumho, goodyear, bfg
    Thanks to Darrin @ BC Automotive:
    $1800 and it was worse than when he started!

    Brian (FordNut) FPG # 1458 of 7838
    03 MM 300A (Lotsa mods, 130k mi) was 303rwhp/318rwtq N/A
    then 476/410 D1SC ProCharged on stock block
    then 660/555 D1SC PC on 5.3 wet sleeved Teksid alum big bore stroker
    then 365/369 N/A on 5.3 wet sleeved Teksid alum big bore stroker
    Now 751/617 3.4L Whipple on 5.3 Boss5.0 iron big bore stroker

    03 MM 300B Silver (Mostly stock, originally wife's car, 370k mi) FPG # 7053 of 7838 or 49 of 417 SB
    03 MM 300B Silver, Stock, wife's next one, 136k mi FPG # 7134 of 7838 or 89 of 417 SB
    04 MM Silver, Stock, on standby 85k mi, FPG # 1212 of 3214 or 432 of 997 SB
    01 F150 longbed
    01 F150 shortbed
    00 F150 4x4 stepside
    01 F150 4x4 7700
    68 Stang FB (70 351C 4V, 4 wheel discs, project car)

    Mods listed here (some items not current): FordNut's Mods

  14. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by EMAS View Post
    Personally I've ran the 255/45 275/45 combo a well as 255/45 all around without any issues so I doubt that is the problem.

    What you really need to do to get to the root of the problem is to hook up a scan tool capable of reading the ABS codes and see what it tells you. Is it a code related to a single wheel or are their multiple codes?
    My abs & brake light came on one day while driving to work. Scanned the computer and found it was related to the rear left abs sensor. Found it to be a little loose, removed and cleaned it then reinstalled it, cleared the code and all was well after that.

    2004 Silver Birch
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    Build date:9/29/2003, Adopted on 12/02/05
    Exhaust by Greg
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    2010 Ford Fusion Sport FWD
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  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctrlraven View Post
    My abs & brake light came on one day while driving to work. Scanned the computer and found it was related to the rear left abs sensor. Found it to be a little loose, removed and cleaned it then reinstalled it, cleared the code and all was well after that.
    I've seen that problem on a few MM's.
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